How good is factory chain?

dbabcock · Jan 15, 2003

I'm a lazy dub, so many times rather than filing chain when it gets dull, I just buy brand new Oregon or whatever loops from saw dealers and use those until I have maybe a dozen dull chains. I then either file them, or most of the time, I just bring them to get sharpened.

So how good is a factory brand new chain compared to a hand filing or grinding job done by a "normal" person, versus a good round filing job by an experienced filer?

treeclimber165 · Jan 15, 2003

Factory chain is usually pretty good, and better than most 'average Joe' sharpened chains. But many chains get small knicks or dings in handling between the time they are made and the time you put one on your saw.

An experienced filer will be able to file an edge equal to or better than a factory fresh edge. I knew I was getting half decent with a file when I was able to file a sharper edge than a new chain. I now touch up brand new chains before I ever use them, to remove any burrs or dings. It took several years of filing before I got to this point.

I am personally opposed to using chain sharpened on a grinder. The vast majority of shops around here will burn the chain and remove temper, so the chain no longer holds an edge as long. I'd rather throw a chain away than have it ground by a local shop. It's usually the least experienced kid in the shop who gets chain grinding duties.

dbabcock · Jan 15, 2003

That's a good point about the saw shops taking the temper out with a poorly applied, reefed-on grinding wheel. I've absolutely noticed that even one-use-old chain that I've had sharpened almost never lasts as long as the factory-original sharpening. I've even seen heat discoloration on chains I've gotten back, indicative of some heavyhanded grinding action.

bwalker · Jan 15, 2003

I am personally opposed to using chain sharpened on a grinder. The vast majority of shops around here will burn the chain and remove temper, so the chain no longer holds an edge as long. I'd rather throw a chain away than have it ground by a local shop

I agree with brian. Most shop sharpened chains end up cutting slower than new chain. When I file them They definantly cut faster than a shop grind/hack job. I just started filing a few months ago on the suggestion of a few on this site. Although my results at first where not he best I am half way decent now. Not as good or fast as someone like Brian or Mr. 90 sec tickle himself, but I dont do it everyday. That being said I am sure there are shops somewhere that sharpen chains good. I just havent seen too many.

JimL · Jan 15, 2003

I sharpen alot of chains every day with a grinder, I only remove enough material to make it sharp, careful to not to create too much heat, might take several passes on the chain to get it back in shape.

Tonight I did a chain for the firedepartment, took 4 passes, they use it to cut holes in roof's so it goes through shingles and the like...

I personally file a brand new chain before I use it.

Fish · Jan 15, 2003

I'll put my grinder sharpened chain up against any of your
hand filed hack jobs any day. How does the factory sharpen the
final product anyway? 100,000 Mexicans with files? Or does a
"machine" grinder put the final edge on them?

Gypo Logger · Jan 15, 2003

Most shops do a hack job of grinding, I must agree, but this is mainly because they have no finesse and dont modify the stone or dress it with the right carborundum stone often enough. Then to top it off, rakers are rarely lowered after sharpening, which is just as well, cause it ain't gonna cut anyway.
Since I am now the self appointed chain Guru, (where's Walt when you need him?), I guess I will have to challenge Fish with one of my 90 second tickled 35RS chains against his bench ground chisel.
Sharp Dressed Man

Fish · Jan 15, 2003

Don't come down here tickling anything! We have laws against
your type of perversions.

Fish · Jan 15, 2003

That was my post number 666, what does that mean?

Gypo Logger · Jan 15, 2003

Ok, thats it Fish, Im jumping in my truck and driving down to Kentucky to see you. I just have to cut, split and load 3 full cords starting tomorrow. Its mostly Cherry, so I should be able to do it by Sat. How far is it to your town? Do you have beer in K.Y.?
Can I crash on the floor of your shop? Is Johnny Prine having any concerts there this time of year? Dont worry, all the woman will be safe.
Lambert

Fish · Jan 15, 2003

I fear for the Llamas.
The FBI is on the watch for suspicious characters coming down
here so be careful.
We are expecting snow here, which may be something new for you, so leave the Speedos in Canada.

logcutter429 · Jan 15, 2003

When i put on a new chain i file it cause the factory fileing just don't cut it.

Fish · Jan 15, 2003

Was the picture taken by a factory camera?

Grateful11 · Jan 15, 2003

>The vast majority of shops around here will burn the chain and remove temper.

Actually you're not removing temper, you're adding more temper. First you heat-treat then you temper. I've done some heat-treating in various machine shops and you take metal up to a point say 1500-1600 degrees, in a heat-treating furnace for so long, quench it in oil or water, and then put it in a tempering furnace. You set the tempering furnace to whatever degrees say 500 and soak the parts for so long, this is called tempering. The higher the temperature you take it to, the more you temper it. Almost all heat treated metals have to be tempered or they would be too hard and brittle. Some metals should as M2 are affected very little by reheating, such as grinding, after it's been heat-treated even if you get it so hot that it turns blue. Some metals such as A2, an air-hardening steel that doesn't have to be quenched, have to be sealed in stainless-steel foil wrap, to retain it's carbon if I recall correctly, before heat-treating, then you temper it. I'd be curious to know what type of metal saw chain is made out of.
Grateful

treeclimber165 · Jan 15, 2003

Wow, thanks for correcting my improper use of the term 'temper', Grateful11. Or should I call you Glen?

Did anyone else here have any difficulty understanding what I was trying to convey? I tried to be as informative and helpful as I could in that post. I've heard the term 'temper' used in that context for years and thought everyone would comprehend my meaning.

Dennis · Jan 15, 2003

Brian...quit taking things so d@mn personal...and send me more of those pics to my email...lol

Grateful11 · Jan 15, 2003

Hey don't take it personal, it wasn't meant to slam you. I knew exactly what you were trying to convey, I've been hearing from my dad and others for 40 years. I thought this site was about Information but people sure are touchy around here. Who's Glen?
Grateful

Fish · Jan 15, 2003

I will agree that with most shops, they do a poor job with a
grinder sharpening chain, but I have confidence that I do a
good job and I strive to achieve the same angles as a new
chain, that is the trick. There are a few out there that can do as
well with a file, but that is an art that takes time to develop.
With a grinder, the wheel must be dressed often.
Also, one must keep his temper.

treeclimber165 · Jan 15, 2003

Originally posted by Dennis
Brian...quit taking things so d@mn personal...and send me more of those pics to my email...lol

Did you get enough? Danm near went through my entire library.

Fish · Jan 15, 2003

Yeah Brian, send me some more pics too.
Grateful, forgive Brian, he gets cranky when the temps drop into the 60's at night.

How good is factory chain?

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