50:1 mix makes a mess

[LeLynn]

Hello everyone. Been looking around for a while but just joined up. I'll apologize ahead of time for the long first post. Ok, so I purchased my first "real" chainsaw (had a ryobi gas and a craftsman electric in the past). I decided on a Stihl 193t. I know some people will say it's not for ground use but that's not the point of this post. So after purchasing the saw and running it lightly on the tank of fuel the dealer filled the saw with, I mixed a gallon of fuel at 50:1 using echo oil. the saw runs great but it really makes an oily mess of the side cover. I have to remove it and clean it inside and out after each use (a use for me is usually less than half an hour). I figured maybe it was just the echo oil that makes a mess so after that gallon of fuel I switched up Amsoil saber also mixed at 50:1. It seems to be just as messy if not slightly more so. Am I missing something? Stihl made the little holes in the plastic so hard to clean it would seem that maybe my issue is semi unique (people don't deal with this mess daily do they?). Is Amsoil saber really that messy when mixed at 50:1? I've considered running it mixed at 80:1 (Amsoils most oil Rich "saber ratio") just to see if it helps but don't want to worry about hurting the engine or reducing its lifespan. I purchased this saw simply because I had hoped that it would last many years, (my ryobi lasted 6 years before it was stolen) so I'd hate to lessen its life simply to reduce the mess but damn Stihl didn't make the saw easy to clean . Is 80:1 safe? can my saw really be that far out of Tune? (it has the factory limiter caps on the Carb screws and since it has a rev limiter on the coil it's hard to tell if it's tuned properly. I'm at sea level (10 feet above) and have the high speed needle about half way between the stops) ANY HELP would be greatly appreciated.

 

[7sleeper]

Not quite sure what problem you are describing. Sounds like you might be mixing the problem of chain oil with two stroke oil. Chain oil makes a mess under the chain cover. That is normal on saws
that are of older design,
have non adjustable oil pumps,
have the adjustable oil pumps turned up all the way although not needed,
are using something else instead of proper chain oil or
have the oil hole on the bar clogged from saw chips.

Forgot to mention for cleaning, I find by far the best is a air compressor. Clean in a few minutes and what does not go away who cares, it's a chainsaw and not a cafe racer...

7

 

[JimMorrison]

Do not run 80:1 mix. Is your dealor any good, or is there at least one person there you trust?Take your saw back in and have them go through it with you and make sure it is properly tuned, for performance and long life, not cleanliness. Once that is confirmed, they should be able to help with any other issues.

 

[IyaMan]

Agreed, don't run 80:1. To have oil all over the place inside the plastic side cover probably wouldn't be from the gasoline-mix (also, the gas and oil don't separate all that easy... if at all). Most likely it is the chain oil. Does that saw have an adjustable oiler? Sounds like its spitting out more oil than needed.

 

[Franny K]

running it lightly on the tank of fuel the dealer filled the saw with,


I mixed a gallon of fuel at 50:1 using echo oil. the saw runs great but it really makes an oily mess of the side cover.

I switched up Amsoil saber also mixed at 50:1. It seems to be just as messy if not slightly more so..

I have a couple of small displacement 125, 200cc dirt bikes when I went to synthetic oil in my case the blue bottle half quart from Honda, and then Amzoil sabre pro the silencer seemed to oil up and drip out where it could while parked. The way I ride generally would be considered lightly as virtually all the time I am at hardly any throttle and often decending with none. This phenomenon could be related to the lightly used aspect as I do not seem to have any dripping from the chainsaws, string trimmers etc that I have for a few years used the same mix about 3 fluid ounces per gallon.

If you run it full power and still have that problem, a chainsaw should get the muffler much hotter than my dirt bike silencer, and still have this issue might as well see what the dealer says and I have a sure to work cure, trade it in on a battery electric.

 

[LeLynn]

Thanks for the replies. ok, so I'm speaking of the oil black exhaust residue being put out by the exhaust. i am aware that the chain will also kick off some oil but it honestly isnt all that bad. I'm sure the fuel was mixed correctly as I use the same mixing cup I use for my shifter karts and have for years. maybe I will see if the dealer has any suggestions on the Tune of the saw or can perhaps Tune it for me. I had not considered using compressed air but that may be just the ticket. It's just funny that Still would put suck a hard to clean plastic grill near the exhaust making wiping the saw clean without disassembly so difficult.

 

[blsnelling]

Sounds like your saw is running way too rich. Even 32:1 shouldn't do as you're describing. Do NOT use any less oil!

 

[CoreyB]

It is probably just tuned really rich from the dealer. also those saw are usually not worked long or hard enough to actually burn the mix properly. don't baby it. run it wide open all the time and make sure to put it in a longer cut once in awhile . take it back to have them retune every time the temp changes more the 25 degrees until you learn how to tune. So if tuned at 80 deg. go back when it is below 55

 

[IyaMan]

I'm sure the fuel was mixed correctly as I use the same mixing cup I use for my shifter karts and have for years

I though such carts run at like 25:1?

 

[LeLynn]

That makes since. The saw does not get much heavy use. Yes karts do often run at 25:1 or often 16:1. I wasn't saying that I run the same mix ratio (or oil for that mater) I only stated that to reinforce that I do in fact have plenty of experience mixing fuel. I'll probably have the dealer look it over once and see if maybe the needles are set a bit too rich. It could be that I simply idle the saw too long and make short cuts with it rather than heavy extended cuts like the larger saws often make. It's funny though that my cheap ryobi didn't really make a mess of itself under the same usage conditions. It did have a bit of oily residue on the pope but it was easier to clean because it wasn't covered by a plastic grate. Maybe the Stihl simply collects more of the residue because it's aimed at the cover rather than simply leaving uninterupted. Thank you all for the guidance.

 

[Brushwacker]

I think the problem is more fine tuning then any thing but being new and not broke in may be your rings are not seating well as they will when broke in contributing to the factor. Its new, and there is always a chance of a defect also.
If it wouldn't void warranty, I'd try 1 of the better non synthetic oils between 25 and 32 to 1. Would flow through your carb a tad slower and lean the air - fuel ratio a tad and I expect your rings would seat better. Could switch back to synthetic after break in, fine tune it and I'd expect you'd not have the problem. I prefer richer then 50 to 1 but if it voids your warranty I would buy the best oil I could afford and use it during that period.

 

[blsnelling]

Leave the fuel alone and properly tune the carb. Problem solved.

 

[LeLynn]

Thanks again for the guidance. I have tuned a couple chainsaw carbs in the past, but never one with a rev limiter. Usually you tune rich enough to make a burbeling/slight misfire sound at max throttle and lean it out just enough to have it clear up under load at max throttle. But this saw seems to always burble do to the fact that it seems to hit it's rev limiter. Should I lean on the saw hard enough to "bog" it down some and listen/adjust from there then? Or is there a better option?

 

[blsnelling]

Make it so rich that you KNOW it's rich and won't clean up in the cut. Then lean it out 1/8 turn at a time until it runs clean. Make sure it's hot and had a good load.

 

[giver]

Stihl has been making saws for along time, if they say mix it 50:1 than there's probably a reason for it.

 

[Brushwacker]

Stihl has been making saws for along time, if they say mix it 50:1 than there's probably a reason for it.

EPA

 

[7sleeper]

EPA

Has nothing to do with EPA at all. There are enough 2 stroke oils out there that only require 1:80 or 1:100. Modern 2 stroke equipment won't live a day longer going to higher oil content.

7

 

[LeLynn]

I know that chainsaws are relatively low string engines compared to my karts. My 125cc kart engine makes about 40 horsepower and for that reason I use a VERY different oil. I run Maxima 927 which is a castor blend and I run it at 24:1. But that engine is run very hard the entire time. I do get some ooze out of the tailpipe but it's easy to clean. I'm sure that the "low performance" chainsaw engines could go without the castor based oils and can most certainly use less than 24:1 mix. 100:1 would never fly in a kart situation but may very well be a possibility in a saw. I spoke to my neighbors landscaper today after work and he uses 50:1 mix in all of his equipment. However he knows of many guys using stihl synthetic and amsoil saber at 100:1 and have done so for years. In fact one of his blowers was purchased used from a friend of his who used it at 100:1 for 3 seasons and it still runs like a top (although he has been running it on 50:1 mix for the year or so he has owned it). I'll try to get the saw tuned and keep it at the 50:1 mix just for my own piece of mind. But now that I have researched a little more online and spoken to this big-time landscaper, 80:1 doesn't seem all that crazy anymore.

 

[Brushwacker]

Has nothing to do with EPA at all. There are enough 2 stroke oils out there that only require 1:80 or 1:100. Modern 2 stroke equipment won't live a day longer going to higher oil content.

7

Non of the modern saws have been around 30-40+ years to prove your point. It may work that way some times, but when the going gets extreme the lower oil content most normally fails sooner. There is no doubt by my experience that you can get more good life on an otherwise marginly worn top end by running a richer oil mixture often enough its worth a try if you don't want to go through with replacing those parts sooner.
I accidently straight gassed my 034 super about 6 weeks ago. 1st poured in straight gas on about 3/4 tank, ran it to the bottom until it quit, then filled it up with more straight gas and locked it up tight in about 5 minutes. Got it home, removed the muffler, piston looked ugly scoured but I poured in some oil, got it to turn over, put the muffler back on, had about 1/4 gallon of my usual 28 to 1 non synthetic mix, so I added about 1 1/2 oz, of Stihl ultra synthetic to that which I estimate made it about 16 to 1. Fired it up, made a few cuts, felt strong so I took it to a tree job the next day and ran about 1 and 1/2 tanks of of fuel cutting blocks up to around 20" in diameter. Couldn't tell it lost any power compared to prior the seizure. There is no doubt in my mind if I had to run 50 to 1 the engine would be trash.
I don't know how long this 1 will last now, but I did near the same ( locked up but not scoured as bad) on an 034 super about 15 years ago, and it being my only saw most of the time never failed me ( used it at 25 to 1) and was still running strong when I sold it about 7 years down the road.

 

[Big_Wood]

wholey **** am i ever thinking of abandoning AS. companies run 50:1 and saws run many years production at that. guys here don't (even the heavy users) even stand the slightest bit of chance to kill a saw at 50:1. it's an absolute ****'n JOKE! guys, if you want a saw to run 50 years mix 50:1. if you planning on passing it down through a few generations mix 32:1. i have a feeling the generations ahead will want a modern saw though. you guys aren't capable of wearing a saw out cutting firewood.!!! ****'n period!!!!!