Adjustable Cinch Carabiner

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Maybe is missed it, but you should buy a copy of The Tree Climber's Companion before you buy your hunting license. This has become the de facto guide to basic tree climbing. Sherrill sells it. The best investment you will make.

Stop and consider how much you have invested in hunting gear. Then realize that safety gear should be a priority too. Just because your rope hasn't broken or worn doesn't mean it is the proper rope. You have to consider safety factors. Working on a 1:1 SF isn't safe. No margin for error. You need at least a 5:1 and better closer to a 10:1 margin.

If you buy some black or camo parachute cord you get set it in the tree and leave it for the next time you will install your rope. If someone tampers with it, you're not out much money.

Tom
 
Thanks Rocky
No I did not mean to condem all the posters.
The way I see it is their is "us" & "them"
Us being Arborists dedicated to preserving trees and Them being the entire population of folks who have brought our trade down to the level of hacks.
I see this as a golden opportunity to educate someone outside our field in the importance of tree preservation.
I agree and the original poster should take note: Tree climbing is indeed one of the most dangerous activities to do.
I dont think this is a good place to try to teach climbing however this guy is climbing already and would more benifit from some good advice than non-constructive criticism.
So my advice is to read the prior posts who suggested books, web-sites and visiting tree crews.
Being informed is the first step.
who knows when you are sitting around the campfire cooking up Bambi the other hunters may ask: Hey, that was a pretty slick way to get up in the tree. How'ed you do that?
Frans
 
Originally posted by NickfromWI
I know this is off the topic, but could you expand on this. I disagree.

love
nick


Nick,

I have yet to handle any such rope that had the "hand" of our arborist lines. If you've done much rock climbing, you know that such ropes are typically used with mechanical devices, not bowlines and blake's.


AvID,

By all means stick around... you may just move from recreational hunting climber to an interest in our profession! Learning never stops. :D
 
Avid,

My origional suggestion has merit for your application. Here's another idea though.

Climbing at night is difficult at best. The only times I've done it had someone on the ground lighting the way. You might consider night vision goggles. If I was going to do what you intend, would set up cheap 1/2" climbing ropes during the day and get familar with the climbs while it's light out. Using a bigshot at night would surly scare away any deer nearby. If the sound of the throwball breaking branches and thumping the ground didn't scare the deer away, then your curses after the throwball got stuck would. Would use single rope tie in, so the rope is choked around a limb above where your going to sit with running bowline. If someone was going to mess with your rope the worst they would likely do is cut it as high as they could reach from the ground. I'd use 2 handled ascenders with foot loops backed up by a microascender for the ascent. Don't think I'd monkeyfiddle with my pantin in the dark. After the season was over you could go retrieve your ropes for next year.

I have an uncle who swears you need 3 guns to hunt deer. A rifle. A shotgun for the drive in and out, with steel balls for shot cause they won't ruin the meat. And a high end air rifle for upland game birds(and squirrels) cause it won't scare the deer away.
 
Avid-being a hunter and an arborist I feel I must say something. First I do most of my hunting the "old fashioned" way- on the ground. There are so many different scent reduction opportunities that I have no problem with scent being an issue(had a pack of coyote within several feet of me and they had no clue I was there until I tried to smokepole one).
Second there are also many newer climbing style tree stands that I am starting to see that look like the damage to trees would be kept to an absolute minimum- I know I've seen some in a Cabelas posting. If you use a climbing stand I would still want a tie in point above where I was climbing to and have a rope/harness backup system in place to CYA.
Third is that climbing a tree is dangerous enough in good conditions in "working" clothes, with the proper equipment and with another person for safety. I still hunt because I don't have anyone else that goes with me when I hunt thus I would be breaking one of the first rules of never climbing alone.
Maybe it's time to review your hunting abilities and try going to the "next level" which would be staying on the ground and really learn how to hunt.
 
Tom Dunlap:

I'll definitely look into the book. I always enjoy expanding my knowledge, and that sounds like an excellent read for many reasons.


Frans:

"Us being Arborists dedicated to preserving trees and Them being the entire population of folks who have brought our trade down to the level of hacks.
I see this as a golden opportunity to educate someone outside our field in the importance of tree preservation."

That is exactly how I see it, and very well said on your part. Fact of the matter is, most hunters (like myself) are NOT arborists. We do not know the "trade", nor know how to learn and/or apply its principles. I'm attempting to extend myself and increase my knowledge on the subject of tree climbing, and fortunately (at least I hope) some here have recognized that. You seem to be one of them! :)


Stumper:

I'll try to post pics tonight of the current adjustable rope grab I use now with my lineman style belt.


ORclimber:

Your suggestions are definitely appreciated, but are a learned skill. I have some work to do before I can reach that level of climbing. Hopefully I can locate a class around here where I can learn better ways to climb! ;)


DadF:

I don't want to argue (on an Arborist site) about the benefits to treestand hunting versus ground hunting...I will simply say that there are many approaches to hunting and some approaches do not lend themselves to certain areas.

For example, I do have a climber and I do use a harness (whether in a climber or fixed position stand), but not all trees are suitable for a climber. I can either cut 100 branches so I can use the climber, or I can climb around the branches with tree steps and set a fixed position stand. Which would you recommend as an Arborist? I doubt it would be to cut 100 branches.

In terms of scent reduction and the impact of scent on your hunting experience, it is all relative to WHERE you hunt. I hunt highly pressured public lands where the deer are VERY wary and very aware of human presence. Hunting on the ground in such instances is a huge disadvantage for two reasons:

1) Your scent is inline with the deer, at the same level, whereas in a tree your scent stream is often over the deer's nose.

2) Your field of view is severely limited compared to being elevated.


Lastly, I do hunt from the ground on occassion and I have taken several deer from the ground and from stalking. In my opinion, to be a successful hunter...you must be versatile. As mentioned above, different areas lend themselves to different hunting approaches. To be successful you often implement the most opportune methodology.

So to define staying on the ground as "really learning how to hunt" is ignorant, short sighted, speculative, and completely opinion driven. Granted there is no arguing it is perhaps the safest means of hunting, it is definitely not the most effective one.

In fact, as a hunter...you should know that the majority of big game animals are taken from an elevated locale. This could be hunting on the ground on a ridgeside, or over a bluff, but mostly it is from treestands. (Review the P&Y results and see the hunting methods used to harvest most of the big game animals in there). In addition, being that elevation positions are a distinct advantage while hunting, and if you are hunting relatively flat land (New Jersey)...you only suitable option to achieve that advantage is a treestand.

Nevertheless, to each their own, but you cannot sway my opinion and own experiences regarding the best method for harvesting game. In short, there is no SINGLE way that is the "true way to hunt"

Note also that "old fashioned" and ground hunting is a contradiction. In review of history, as far back as the American Indians, many of them hunted from trees for the exact same reason we do today. They recognized it has its advantages, just as myself and many other hunters do today.



Now back to tree climbing! :)
 
Avid- I will agree with you completely. Guess I'm spoiled by having plenty of private property right outside my backdoor that I've been running around around since I was able to get out of the house on my own. With minimal hunting pressure and complete knowledge of every nook and cranny I just haven't needed to hunt from a stand. I also have a climber and used it when I was still bow hunting(have been too busy for that for at least 10 years).

Tom suggestion on the Tree Climbers Companion is excellent. I carry one in the truck with all the time.

Frans comments about "you" becoming one of "us" may be a lot closer than you realize. You already have a rudimentary knowledge of trees(mast and food sources) and realize that trees (at least now)do not heal from wounds but merely surround and scab over. That is way more than most people and a lot of tree "hackers" know.

Personally I think that a face to face meeting would be interesting and we would both come away from it knowing more than what we did before. Unfortunately I have never been to NJ and don't foresee any plans to for in the future-UNLESS you have turkeys over there. I don't have turkeys outside my backdoor and am always looking for an excuse to go somewhere to hunt them!!!

I would also like to see the cinching carabiner you have been using.
 
Here are some pics of the "adjustable rope grab" I am currently using. It came with the belt, of which I believe a company called Tree Hopper used to make these.
 
Keep in mind, this sucker is about 10 years old now...so it's been through alot. Outside of the paint, I don't see any wear...and definitely nothing that concerns me...although I suspect many here will look at that contraption and do two things:

1) Laugh
2) Wonder what the hell I'm thinking using it
 
I find it to be quite useful, and VERY easy to use while up in a tree. Compared to the "high tech" equipment used by alot of the professionals though...I'd think it is pretty elementary in design but quite fundamental.

Just wish I could find another one...somewhere. Best thing for me to use at this juncture, because I am used to using one and can climb well with it.
 
So...the rope must have a snap on the other end that attaches to your saddle. Then this adjuster stays attached to your saddle.

To let out slack the pointed lever on the lower right is pushed in to move the cam off the rope.

Correct me if I'm wrong.

If I'm understanding the action, if it had a double-auto-locking mechanism, it could be useful. It would still have to pass breaking strength.

How do you open the gate on the snap?

I doubt that you'll find a new tool like that.

The closest you'll find is a Micro-Cender. You can attach that with a Maillon Rapide. Don't go cheap and save a nickel by buying a screw link made in the Pacific rim. False economy when your life is at stake.

I don't think that I've seen that unit in Gary Storrick's collection:

http://storrick.cnchost.com/VerticalDevicesPage/VerticalHome.shtml


Tom
 
The rope is attached to a D loop on the belt via a figured 8 knot.

To let slack out, you just push the thumb button down and pull. Pressing the thumb button releases the grab and lets the rope flow through the adapter with some resistance. When releasing your thumb, it grabs the rope and it doesn't budge.

To trim slack, you just hook in to the other D loop and pull. The way the rope is situated in the adapter allows you to pull trim but not pull out the other way.

Pretty ingenious "rope grab/trim" device...but I haven't seen it anywhere else...ever.

I don't even know who made the belt I have anymore...been so long. I do believe the company I mentioned earlier, Tree Hopper, makes a belt that is very similar...but it looks like they went out of business or revamping their website.
 
I actually found that "hook" on another safety belt offered by a company called North Starr Treestands:

http://northstarrtreestands.com/Safetystarr.html

I called and asked if I could buy one, and they said they don't have them as an accessory, I would have to buy the whole belt.
The hook is made overseas in Taiwan and can only be ordered in bulk.

The belt costs $31.

Not positive if it is exactly the same one that I have, but it looks awful darn close.

What do you guys think?

The guy I spoke to was pretty "interesting"...telling me it takes a "very special rope" to use with the hook. I don't know if he knows what he's talking about, but by the looks of their harness/belt and how the rope connects to it...I think I trust what I've been doing with D loops, carabiners, and a quality knot! :)

I think I may just buy the belt to get the hook...what do you all think?
 
Well, I am going based on the hook that comes with that belt is identical to the one I have now. If that is the case, I would be using a hook that has kept me safe for the last 10 years with ALOT of use.

I've posted pictures above of the one I've been using...which originally came with the belt I have. The only thing I've had to replace is the rope in that 10 year time frame.
 
AviD,

Your logic is on the wrong track I think. Just because your system hasn't failed in ten years doesn't mean it is the best system to use. You came here to ask advice from people who make thier living climbing trees. Now you're going to ignore the advice and do what you want. That's fine, but it sure doesn't make sense. In one day, anyone on this forum spends more time on a rope than you probably will for a hunting season. I don't think that even one person endorsed the use of the camming device. Does that tell you anything?

If you're married, have your wife read through the thread and have her make the decision about using that device instead of a proper, accepted tool like the Microcender. Sure it costs more, but you're more likely to go home walking at the end of the day.

I've never been in a life threatening car crash but I wear my seat belt all of the time. Have since my Dad took the '60 Plymouth to Monkey Wards and had belts installed for all of the passengers.

Tom
 

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