Brand Blindness

[purdyite]

I can't be bought, but I can be had. You might take me by the hand, or the nose, and lead me somewhere, but I can't be pushed anywhere and I don't take that pushy crap from anybody, car dealers especially. I ain't there for the propaganda. That stuff makes me furious.

 

[Jonny Quest]

Amen, Brother.

 

[Bronco]

Even stihls so called best but worst oil is only FB rated. Any we can buy from stihl in US is FB. Their better oil is sold overseas. Cant figure out why we get the crap stuff. Run the other way from their oils imo. They dont even get the old FC rating.

FB corresponds to high lubricity performance but without any low-smoke technology.

FC meets the FB lubricity standards but also is a low-smoke lubricant.

FD corresponds to higher detergency properties than the other two grades, meets the lubricity requirements and has low smoke requirements.

Best oils today are FD.

VPracing 40:1 FD and Efree 89 all I need.

dont forget about Red Armor-Echo..also FD

 

[RedneckChainsawRepair]

dont forget about Red Armor-Echo..also FD

Tried it in original formula. One out now is 2nd formula.

VP 100% synthetic FD and cheaper too. Also cleans etc.
So no brainer to me.

 

[Bronco]

Tried it in original formula. One out now is 2nd formula.

VP 100% synthetic FD and cheaper too. Also cleans etc.
So no brainer to me.

OK got it... Q: (not to turn this to oil A vs oil B tread) but didn't know about a 2nd formula on Red Armor? Please advise, thanks..

 

[RedneckChainsawRepair]

OK got it... Q: (not to turn this to oil A vs oil B tread) but didn't know about a 2nd formula on Red Armor? Please advise, thanks..

Already in threads just search. Posted everywhere for anyone to read over the years.

Made it cheaper removing ingredient. But still charging crazy high prices. No thank you.

Easy to tell. New has silver diamond back ground. Been that way for years now. Original was all black.

 

[Breckinridge Elkins]

Already in threads just search. Posted everywhere for anyone to read over the years.

Well, I searched and most of the posts are from you claiming it's bad but not saying why. If you have more specific information beyond "They changed it" without saying how, and "It's bad now" without saying why, I would love to read it.

 

[RedneckChainsawRepair]

Well, I searched and most of the posts are from you claiming it's bad but not saying why. If you have more specific information beyond "They changed it" without saying how, and "It's bad now" without saying why, I would love to read it.

Nobody said it was bad. Still good FD oil. Just over priced IMO.

Also you didnt google it then on the threads not here, that go way back not by me.

 

[sean donato]

There's nothing in any sds or otherwise to suggest they changed anything other then the lable. They did change some of their reporting on the ads, but the sds is not by any means an inclusive list if what the product is made of.

 

[bwalker]

Already in threads just search. Posted everywhere for anyone to read over the years.

Made it cheaper removing ingredient. But still charging crazy high prices. No thank you.

Easy to tell. New has silver diamond back ground. Been that way for years now. Original was all black.



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Guys jumped to conclusions on that. I know the msds changed, but I am not sure the formulation ever changed. Only toxic substances need to be listed on the msds and those that were removed were not toxic. In addition the physical properties on the msds didnt change. The old stuff smelled and looked the same to me and if there is a performance differance I can't see it.
I also wouldn't assume that because an oil is 100% synthetic that it is better. Their a plenty of synthetic oils that are outperformed by blends.

 

[thomasinvancouver]

Depends on the dealer support that’s available and what exactly I’m looking for. Just bought a Husqvarna 592 because its numbers were better than the Stihl 661. It’s my first Husqvarna.

 

[Breckinridge Elkins]

Nobody said it was bad. Still good FD oil. Just over priced IMO.

Also you didnt google it then on the threads not here, that go way back not by me.

Ok I gotcha. You are probably right about it being over priced.

 

[Seachaser]

Depends on the dealer support that’s available and what exactly I’m looking for. Just bought a Husqvarna 592 because its numbers were better than the Stihl 661. It’s my first Husqvarna.

Give us a report when you give it a workout.

 

[RedneckChainsawRepair]

Just something I been curious about. Lets say they are all FD oils to cut the chase. Dino oil the cheapest, Semi dino blend synthetic is blended with dino to make it more affordable per oil companies. Synthetic should be the most expense.

So why is it some semi blends cost so much more then 100% synthetic oils?
Info straight from oil company.

Mineral-based 2 Stroke Oil​

Mineral-based 2 stroke oil, also known as conventional or regular oil, is derived from petroleum. It is a cost-effective option and suitable for older or low-performance two-stroke engines. While mineral-based oil provides adequate lubrication, it may have limited resistance to high temperatures

Semi-synthetic 2 Stroke Oil​

Semi-synthetic 2 stroke oil combines the benefits of mineral-based and synthetic oils. It is a blend of petroleum-based and synthetic components, striking a balance between cost-effectiveness and improved performance. Semi-synthetic oil offers better lubrication and protection compared to mineral-based oil while being more affordable than full synthetic oil.

Synthetic 2 Stroke Oil​

Synthetic 2 stroke oil is engineered using synthesized chemicals, offering superior performance and protection. It is designed to withstand higher temperatures, providing enhanced lubrication and reducing engine wear. Synthetic oil also offers better resistance to oxidation and degradation, making it suitable for high-performance engines or engines operating in extreme conditions.

 

[ray benson]

Give that E10 three years to work on your fuel lines and parts. You'll see. I run enough of it to never store anything with that crap in it long term or use Stihl lubricants.

Yup, an all-brand user but mostly Stihl and I don't drink the coolaide or listen to that much BS at a dealer like the OP did.

Echo top handle 3000 and a Stihl 025 - both over 20 years old. Ethanol 10% gas with mix every year , no issues. Replace the mix every 2 months and run the equipment dry after running some canned storage mix in December. No fuel lines have been replaced. Only fuel filter , spark plugs and air filter changes. Refill with ethanol gas mix in the spring or if needed before spring. Seems fresh fuel is the key.

 

[bwalker]

Just something I been curious about. Lets say they are all FD oils to cut the chase. Dino oil the cheapest, Semi dino blend synthetic is blended with dino to make it more affordable per oil companies. Synthetic should be the most expense.

So why is it some semi blends cost so much more then 100% synthetic oils?
Info straight from oil company.

Mineral-based 2 Stroke Oil​

Mineral-based 2 stroke oil, also known as conventional or regular oil, is derived from petroleum. It is a cost-effective option and suitable for older or low-performance two-stroke engines. While mineral-based oil provides adequate lubrication, it may have limited resistance to high temperatures

Semi-synthetic 2 Stroke Oil​

Semi-synthetic 2 stroke oil combines the benefits of mineral-based and synthetic oils. It is a blend of petroleum-based and synthetic components, striking a balance between cost-effectiveness and improved performance. Semi-synthetic oil offers better lubrication and protection compared to mineral-based oil while being more affordable than full synthetic oil.

Synthetic 2 Stroke Oil​

Synthetic 2 stroke oil is engineered using synthesized chemicals, offering superior performance and protection. It is designed to withstand higher temperatures, providing enhanced lubrication and reducing engine wear. Synthetic oil also offers better resistance to oxidation and degradation, making it suitable for high-performance engines or engines operating in extreme conditions.

What you have posted sounds like something from Scamsoil or the like.
In certain areas synthetic blends are better than 100% synthetic oils, which is why the majority of FD certified oils are blends.

 

[sean donato]

Just something I been curious about. Lets say they are all FD oils to cut the chase. Dino oil the cheapest, Semi dino blend synthetic is blended with dino to make it more affordable per oil companies. Synthetic should be the most expense.

So why is it some semi blends cost so much more then 100% synthetic oils?
Info straight from oil company.

Mineral-based 2 Stroke Oil​

Mineral-based 2 stroke oil, also known as conventional or regular oil, is derived from petroleum. It is a cost-effective option and suitable for older or low-performance two-stroke engines. While mineral-based oil provides adequate lubrication, it may have limited resistance to high temperatures

Semi-synthetic 2 Stroke Oil​

Semi-synthetic 2 stroke oil combines the benefits of mineral-based and synthetic oils. It is a blend of petroleum-based and synthetic components, striking a balance between cost-effectiveness and improved performance. Semi-synthetic oil offers better lubrication and protection compared to mineral-based oil while being more affordable than full synthetic oil.

Synthetic 2 Stroke Oil​

Synthetic 2 stroke oil is engineered using synthesized chemicals, offering superior performance and protection. It is designed to withstand higher temperatures, providing enhanced lubrication and reducing engine wear. Synthetic oil also offers better resistance to oxidation and degradation, making it suitable for high-performance engines or engines operating in extreme conditions.

And down the rabbit hole we go..... group 3 oils can be called synthetic, but are derived from Dino oil, work and function just as well as a full synthetic pao or pag based oil. A synthetic blend doesn't indicate a lesser oil then a "full" synthetic it's mostly marketing bs since that lawsuite between Mobil and Castrol.
To your assertions of red armor being "changed" without the full formula you have zero basis of your assertion.

 

[Breckinridge Elkins]

They may have simply rephrased the MSDS. It's all over my head but in another thread someone speculated that one of the additive may have been dropped from the MSDS because it isn't considered toxic.

 

[bwalker]

And down the rabbit hole we go..... group 3 oils can be called synthetic, but are derived from Dino oil, work and function just as well as a full synthetic pao or pag based oil. A synthetic blend doesn't indicate a lesser oil then a "full" synthetic it's mostly marketing bs since that lawsuite between Mobil and Castrol.
To your assertions of red armor being "changed" without the full formula you have zero basis of your assertion.

Back when that case was going on there was a large study of taxi cabs in Toronto. In it Petro Canada Group 3 out performed Mobil 1, which at the time was a PAO ester blend.
I bring this up because it's not as simple as saying synthetic is superior. In some aspects synthetics are better and in others they are not.
The other thing is synthetics are produced by the oil refining industry and the start out as petroleum. If one realized the amount of processing that a group 3 base oil takes they would realise on a process basis there is very little differance between them and PAO's. Really the only differance is the feedstock for PAO start out as ethylene, which is produced from a gas concentration unit. Group three starts out as a cut from the vacuum distillation column. Either way both are produced from crude oil.

 

[Lightning Performance]

Echo top handle 3000 and a Stihl 025 - both over 20 years old. Ethanol 10% gas with mix every year , no issues. Replace the mix every 2 months and run the equipment dry after running some canned storage mix in December. No fuel lines have been replaced. Only fuel filter , spark plugs and air filter changes. Refill with ethanol gas mix in the spring or if needed before spring. Seems fresh fuel is the key.

Running it dry removes the ethanol.