How many new saws?

[hammerlogging]

o

LOL, wow, what a bunch of fuxxing windbags, LOL.

Now I can't cut, barely can log and don't know how to run my business and its a hobby that barely makes any money. I'm learning new things everyday from this site, no doubt mostly from the Westies, their eyes are everywhere.

Truly amazing,

Sam

Nah, you know your #### and how you do things works for you. Some discussions get out of whack because it doesn't work like a back and forth conversation so a response here or there might not be meant to address your comments as directly as they seem to.

 

[Jacob J.]

Eastern cutting is its own game and western cutting is its own game and the two have different challenges.

I got to work some eastern timber a few years ago. I didn't care for the bugs or hot & muggy conditions.
The ground wasn't super steep but plenty rocky and you had to pay attention because the hardwoods
could get to sliding around pretty good. I did my three weeks and called it good.

There was also some plant there, similar to stinging nettles that would irritate the crap out of you.

 

[OlympicYJ]

I've cut plenty. I am not going to go spend 4 hours researching what I have cut the last 20 years.
Exclude me from this highly technical scentific endeavor.
Put plainly, wearing out a saw every 4 months is CRAP. Buying new when a re-ring is all you need is CRAP.
But who really cares? The end result of any deep thought comparison here in this forum ends with the west coast faller being able to walk on water and cure blindness with a touch.

News flash: Dumping trees all day is not logging.

I didn't ask you to go back and research how much timber you cut in the last 20 years just a number for one year. As someone mentioned earlier it is called timber falling. I never said east coasties were bad loggers. There are different ways of doing things in different parts of the country. Some things you guys do are great and some things the west coast guys do are great. The whole debate has to do with you saying guys that buy a new saw every year are abusing them. Yes they are wearing them out. The minute you start that saw up it is wearing itself out and becoming junk. Any time they are used they are abused but it's not overt abuse its called every day wear and tear.

LOL, you ****, my point is I'm not about going out and selling saws as a means for tax write offs for financial gain. I have enough other things to buy and bother with. And I don't work on saws either, whether they are 1 week old or 7 years old, I've had very little ever break on them chain tensioners and some plastic. I started using auto gas this year and for the first time in a decade I'm have some starting problems ....... as in it takes a couple of more pulls to get two of them started. Going back to 100 LL AV gas.

I too question the board footage deal, I know some westies have to cut, limb and top their trees, but what I see on TV its a lot of softer wood and they just have to cut off at a waist high stump and let her fall over, and the wood looks like it cuts like balsa wood, which is fine, cut what you have to cut, but it isn't hardwood and you don't have to cut another 4-10 12" branches off of the stem either. I don't make much money with a chainsaw, I make my money with a skidder. Right now we're cutting trees for another guy at $10 per tree, we had a short day yesterday, I cut, limbed and topped 44 trees, Menno cut 44 trees then we went home to work on an oil leak on the skid steer, while the water goes down up North.

If all I had to do with cut them over, Oh boy, that number would triple easily. I remember in Wisconsin I cut about 10,000 board feet in one day when I was starting out, it was hot and a very steep sidehill, I was somewhat impressed, until later at the bar a guy said he had cut 40,000 board feet in the same day. I spent most of the night bothered that I would never be a good timber cutter and should just quit, because I didn't see any possible way I could have cut my 10,000 in a quarter of the time, and I was literally running from tree to tree, all day. So I tell another good cutter that I want to watch him cut for a day, so I can learn how to cut 40,000 in one day ........................ he said, who can cut that much in one day on a sidehill around here? I said this other guy did. He laughed for about 3 minutes, because he knew it bothered me a bunch, he said that guy just tips trees, there are two others that come behind him and top the trees, OOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHHHH, now it made sense, LOL.

Its not really a big deal to me, I just present how I do things and what I do, I make money doing it too or I wouldn't be doing it. How or why the westies always get in a jam that its their way or nothing is beyond me, buts that just how it is, they make no money for me, and I've been doing what I do long enough and for around here, most think I'm doing it correctly. I have zero machine payments and very little pressure. I do take on more work than I should at times, but I do that for the challenge, otherwise I work when I want and for who I want, short of winning the lottery, few can top that, so most everyone here can take their petty chainsaw arguments and shove it, LOL.

Sam

On whole tree yarding and ground based shows in smaller second growth the cutters just fall. The trees are small enough that they can be pulled up to the landing where a processor will do the limbing and bucking. In big wood, trees can be heavy enough that they have to be limbed and bucked before they are yarded; thats what you are seeing there. Don't base much off of shows like Ax Men it is mostly created drama. And there are "soft woods" here that are pretty tough. Sitka spruce for instance. Very tough wood and if you get a big wolfy spruce that the processor cant handle the chaser gets it and were talking alot more than just 4-10 limbs to cut. Try about 30ft of 3"-4" limbs and that crap dulls a chain very fast. As someone mentioned earlier most cutters out west are using full skip chisel chain that cuts very fast in our softwoods. As it's been explained to me semi skip robs too much power in soft wood to get any sort of extra speed by having more teeth than full skip. But doesn't dull as fast as full skip does. Thats why it is so popular in hardwood. Also the reason those stumps are cut off at seemingly waist high is because of flare or butt swell. mills don't wan't that so it is left on the stump. Don't mistake this as a "oh our wood is just as hard as yours and were better than you statement." This is simply an explanation of what you're seeing with an example thrown in to illustrate it's not the cake walk tv shows make it appear.

 

[epicklein22]

Interesting story, my Jred dealer just told me about a customer of his with a 2188. The guy claimed a million board feet without one problem, just consumables. Even had the original spark plug. Sold the saw for $450 and bought another new one. That sounds pretty damn good to me.

 

[tramp bushler]

Wow , you guys really get goin !!
So , what was the original ? How long does a daw last ?
When I was younger I demanded a saw give me 90 days trouble free . After that I was board with all but the best of them . The best bein Ace Morgan hot rodded Huskies . Man were they sweet .

Thats burning 2 1/2 gal. Saw gas in 6-7 hours sometimes more , sometimes less . But it varied with the saw some . 064 Stihls and 288 Huskies gave the best balance of power speed and fuel efficency . With timber in the up to 4' on the stump . Bigger timber , a 394 H or 056 Mag II you would be burning close to 3 gal.
Lets see about limbing , take a Sitka Spruce that grew in a tight stand . 36" across the stump , 140 feet tall . What we call 3 log timber . Aladkan timber tapers pretty fast and bushlers got paid on Scribner scale . Because most of it wad tower ground we didn't have to get too carried away with the limbing . So theres 5-9 limbs per verticle year of growth . Probably an average of 18" verticle growth per year .less in the top half of the yree . Limbs usually start at about 32' up sometimes less sometimes more.
So you had to limb 3 of the 6 sides . So ya had 90' of tree with 3 limbs every foot ana half . They are as hard as any Rock Maple I ever cut in Maine . Limb diameter was about 2 1/2" . Smaller at the top , Bigger toward the butt . So thats 180 limbs , 2 1/2" avg dia. Per tree . And the Quality Control piss fir willeys HATED pig ears . Boy would they get consternated over pig ears .

 

[tramp bushler]

2100 Huskies really enjoyed drinkin gas too . So the first 2 logs would be a 40' 22" then a 40'16" then usually a 32'-40' 8" top log . Now this is just an average with 1 of the 5 species we generaly cut in Southeast Alaska . And as anyone who has cut much coastal virgin timber will tell you , average is rare . Incidently those 3' 3 log spruce were an average of 300 years old .

Red Cedar , gosh , run and hide . You never seen limbs like s.e. red cedar . A red cedar 5' on the stump 120' tall would use up the better part of a tank of fuel in a 56,2100,394 and from what I saw an 066/660 . To fall , limb and buck one .

So bein I'm Alaskan , and Alaska is kind of the bastard child of West coast timber , BUT Interior Alaska is like Minnisota or Wisconsin , or Ontario . See , we have BOTHsides of the Continental Devide in Alaska .

So on the coast say an average of 25,000 board feet merch and 25,000 feet of cull scale per day for an average bushler x90 days equals 4 million500 thousand board feet

And , not many fallers in Alaska run full skip chain , It works ok but semi skip is the best ballance ime . Doesn't rob your power on the stump and does pretty good in the limbs .

 

[tramp bushler]

I know almost no fallers who regularly got more than a season on a powerhead .most got 5 or 6 months .
For a long time I thot that the next saw was going to be the perfect one .

Now I like them to last .

 

[tramp bushler]

probably should stay out of this but ,,. some of these men put down more boardfeet of timber in one season to another s 10 seasons. not to start a pissin match over one coast over the other ,but i,ve seen the decks from some of these and i'm not seeing as much lumber laying . some peop:le need to come out and spend a little time on some big strips out here and see the differentiates . a smart faller dont abuse his saws he wears them out. just sayin. hope the ramble made sence. theses pills are good.:msp_unsure:

So this is where th battle started . Way t go Pac ..

 

[redprospector]

So this is where th battle started . Way t go Pac ..

Now you're diggin' up bones Tramp.

Andy

 

[paccity]

not me tramp.:msp_rolleyes: this is what b\got my hackles up. "I don't understand why a man would need a new saw every 8 months. It has to be pure negligence, because I have cut a lot of timber and firewood in 20 years. And I do about zero maintenance on them myself- just drop them off when something lets go....I leave them out in the rain, sun, snow...no love beyond being careful and not abusing it when using it. " i'll leave it at that.:msp_wink:

 

[tramp bushler]

Reteading my posts I can ser the arthritis in my hand . My thumb is like a disobedient old man . .

 

[tramp bushler]

not me tramp.:msp_rolleyes: this is what b\got my hackles up. "I don't understand why a man would need a new saw every 8 months. It has to be pure negligence, because I have cut a lot of timber and firewood in 20 years. And I do about zero maintenance on them myself- just drop them off when something lets go....I leave them out in the rain, sun, snow...no love beyond being careful and not abusing it when using it. " i'll leave it at that.:msp_wink:

:msp_razz::msp_unsure::redface:

 

[atvguns]

I was just wondering about how many new saws loggers in different parts of the country use in a year? I bought seven new saws last year. Traded three in, kept the others as backup saws. What say ye??:msp_smile:

What have you started

 

[redprospector]

What have you started

Logging22 didn't start anything. Heck, he could have asked how often we eat cheese and we would have had a similar discussion. :msp_laugh:

Andy

 

[tramp bushler]

Some guys just have things last . Some guys just don't . I know a guy who busheled with 075s on POW . One of his saws he made 26,000$ with before he had to do anything to it or even bring it in from his strip .

Oh , and no timber fallers should look down of someone cutting firewood professionally .
Bushlin a strip in a camp may be harder work sometimes . But . Runnin a small loggin company in the cold winter is alot harder occupation . And buckin big firewood is hard on a saw . .

Just sayin.

 

[logging22]

What have you started

Well hells bells boys. I didnt want to start a fight. Just wondering what kind of use others got out of there saws is all. I get a new saw whenever the budget allows, even if i really dont need it. Thats just me. I still have powerheads that i bought years ago when i started this crazy thing we call logging. Just bought 2 new ones this month. Looking at 2 more. Need? Not really. Want? Hell yes!! I have two cutters with me now and ya never know when a saw will go down. Carry at least 6 with us to the woods. Too far to go back to the shop and get another one. Its just my way of making things easy, for me. Had a pretty good week. Got near 120 thousand bf to the mill and only cost me 2 bars, 4 chains, and a flippy cap. All power heads running and accounted for. If only i could get the power of a 3120 or 088 in the frame of a 346 or 044. Man, dreams are great eh??:msp_tongue:

 

[RandyMac]

Hey 22, you want in on our 100cc McCulloch 10 series saws?

 

[logging22]

Hey 22, you want in on our 100cc McCulloch 10 series saws?

Are we building or buying? Hell yes i want in. Details please.

 

[RandyMac]

Are we building or buying? Hell yes i want in. Details please.

building, contact homelite jim.
We are shooting for nearly 100cc in less than an 18 pound package.

 

[NORMZILLA44]

This went to poop in a hurry. Maybe better on the chainsaw forum.

New ones every 4- 6 months or so. Somebody else gets a nice used saw and I get a new one. I don't get paid to #### with saws in the strip....much less on my weekends for that matter- #### that.

Howdy pard. Good point whether needed or not, and resale of the used one. That is what most production fallers, including my friends in my area do, Ive seen them wear out a saw in 6 months, or run it a full year or more. But on average I would say here 6 months or a year. But all pro fallers I know by a replacement yearly no matter what. They may sell the previous one, use that for backup, or a firewood saw. Or cut more timber but either way they get a new one every year. Good read so far, but not in to the east or west thing, because totally different animal, and Redwood dust has claimed saws, and men. For the new saw replacement I was using your post as refrence, you know who the rest will apply to pard, as I know you are a timber faller.