Just how much quicker does full chisel dull in dirty wood?!

[Cider]

Hi all,

I run a Stihl MS362CM cutting dry redgum for my own firewood. I just don't cut enough to become good on the hand file - plus I hate doing it - so I've decided to start sharpening off the saw instead and just swap chains in the field.

At the moment all my chains are semi chisel, I understand that full chisel cuts faster but also dulls faster in dirt.

I'm happy to use a fresh chain every tank. Do you reckon I would get more cut with a tankful of fuel using full chisel - even if I hit a bit of termite dirt? Or will dirt dull the full chisel so much faster that I'd still be better off with semi?

 

[Philbert]

Lots of theoreticals. Lots of ‘depends’.

Best thing would be for you to buy a loop of full chisel (same brand as your current chains), and try it side-by-side in your wood, and the way that you cut.

(Then please get back to us and tell us what you find!).

Philbert

 

[Woodslasher]

I'd keep running semi chisel. Full chisel dulls a bit quicker, but the big thing I've noticed is chipper/semi chisel chain gets dull when you hit stuff, chisel chain is "ruined" when you hit stuff. The chisel edge will get wrecked way further back on the tooth than semi chisel meaning you'll have to remove more material to get it sharp again. So not only does it get dull quicker, you'll wear out a chain faster if you sharpen it properly.

 

[user 122190]

Keeping a sharp chain sharp is easy. Just freshen up the chain regularly and keep it out of the dirt and you'll have no problems.

 

[JustPlainJeff]

A little off topic, but try a 2 in 1 file. To me, a 2 in 1 file will make a person who is normally pretty poor with a file a whole lot better. Faster as well.

 

[pdqdl]

Link please? I've done a lot of sharpening, but I don't know what a 2-in-1 file is.

 

[sean donato]

A little off topic, but try a 2 in 1 file. To me, a 2 in 1 file will make a person who is normally pretty poor with a file a whole lot better. Faster as well.

Practice makes perfect, I'll take a normal round and flat file over that 2 in 1 any day, but I've had lots of practice till I figured it out. You just can tailor your chain with that thing. Cutting soft wood? Take the depth gauge down a bit extra, not self feeding? Change your angle a bit. Just need a touch up? Few ateokes and good to go. The depth gauge does not need adjusted for a quick once over.

 

[Bango Skank]

You said what you said, and I read you loud and clear… but I’d still like to bug you to reconsider hand filing. It’s very simple, it’s really not a skill that takes years to get admirable results. It’s quite satisfying when your chain cuts faster than new, and you can learn to get results like that really quickly. Kinda therapeutic really.

 

[sean donato]

I'd keep running semi chisel. Full chisel dulls a bit quicker, but the big thing I've noticed is chipper/semi chisel chain gets dull when you hit stuff, chisel chain is "ruined" when you hit stuff. The chisel edge will get wrecked way further back on the tooth than semi chisel meaning you'll have to remove more material to get it sharp again. So not only does it get dull quicker, you'll wear out a chain faster if you sharpen it properly.

Can't say thats been my experience, unless you keep trying to cut what you just hit. And I can attest I've hit plenty. Normally it's a cutter or 3, clean them up and go back to work. Semi does the same thing, I also can't say there's an instance where I would want the slower cut over having to sharpen a little more.
We're also talking about something thats highly opinionated from user to user....

 

[Woodslasher]

We're also talking about something thats highly opinionated from user to user....

True, I really don't like how slow chipper chain feels but when I need to cut up wood that's been skidded or ground in the dirt chipper chain is at the top of my list. I sharpen chains for my family and my dad and brother do dirtwork/grading, whenever they borrow a saw for any amount of cutting I know every tooth on the chain is going to have the corner wrecked from cutting dirty stuff. One other thing is I just keep cutting in certain situations, a fair bit of my "in the field" cutting is limbing, sizing, and trimming the stump/rootball off a tree an excavator has pushed over. It's not ideal cutting conditions but it's what I need the saw for, so I just do the "clean" work first and cut the stump off at the end. The trunk is usually a bit dirty where I cut but the stump's gotta come off and if it hurts the chain so be it. I don't like it, but I have 12 or so chains for my 562 so I can afford to hurt one or two every now and again.

 

[trains]

Hi all,

I run a Stihl MS362CM cutting dry redgum for my own firewood. I just don't cut enough to become good on the hand file - plus I hate doing it - so I've decided to start sharpening off the saw instead and just swap chains in the field.

At the moment all my chains are semi chisel, I understand that full chisel cuts faster but also dulls faster in dirt.

I'm happy to use a fresh chain every tank. Do you reckon I would get more cut with a tankful of fuel using full chisel - even if I hit a bit of termite dirt? Or will dirt dull the full chisel so much faster that I'd still be better off with semi?

Semi chisel will dull just as quick when you hit white ant mud in the wood.
I cut with semi chisel, tried chisel chain, but the cutting tip/ end of the chain dulls too quick to be effective, I get much more firewood in the trailer with semi chisel, may not cut as fast initially, but cuts more for longer in the end, tho to be honest, the speed difference is very little.
hitting mud/ rocks wire etc will dull any chain.
Cut sugar gum, its up there with grey and yellow box, so its a bit harder than redgum, again, also depends on the growth rate and rainfall the timber got as well, as that also contributes to hardness.

learn how to file correctly, then a few file passes once you notice its getting a bit dull, and keep feeding it wood.
sharp chain what ever it is, will put more wood in the trailer over a dull one, so keep it sharp, what ever you choose.

 

[Del_]

Link please? I've done a lot of sharpening, but I don't know what a 2-in-1 file is.

It's a jig that holds a round file and a flat file for the depth gauges enabling the user to do both task at one time. This sets the depth gauge the same for each tooth.

 

[pdqdl]

I suspected that, but that is a sharpening jig with two files, not a 2-in-one file.

What can I say? Everybody should know how literal I am by now.

 

[Cider]

I suspected that, but that is a sharpening jig with two files, not a 2-in-one file.

Stihl calls it a 2-in-1 file, but yes it is really multiple files in a jig - a round file for each way, and a double-sided flat file for the rakers. All nicely indexed off the tooth height. I do have one, and my chains are much better for it. I just don't like sharpening in the field. I also tend to cut little and often - a tankful of cutting probably gives me a week of firewood, it's already dry so no need to do a big carting and stacking job. I'd rather sharpen my chains in the comfort of the workshop, and just pop a fresh one on for each tank.

Looks like there are opinions both ways on the full vs semi chisel chain, so it sounds like it will be worth giving it a try. Most trees here have some termite work up the middle, that's just the way it is. I'd rather not get upset by it - like woodslasher says, "it's what I need the saw for"!

 

[pdqdl]

My thoughts are that chisel tooth chain is for the pro's that are in a huge hurry and don't want to mess around with dull chains on job where everybody is on the clock. They also get real pissy with the guy that can't keep his saw sharp.

Semi-chisel tolerates a great deal more dulling before it quits cutting. The only difference between them is that tiny bit of extra metal in the corner. When filed well, it makes a nice sharp tooth that penetrates the wood quicker than otherwise. Semi-chisel lacks that sharp point, which is curiously easy to bend down with the slightest trip into the dirt. Then it instantly becomes a ramp for the tooth to help deflect off the wood that needs to be cut.

Collateral reason for having chisel tooth: pro's frequently make boring cuts, which work better with chisel tooth. It also is a bit more inclined to kick-back, which is why you often can't get chisel tooth chain at the local HomeDepot, and almost never in non-safety chain.

 

[mountainlake]

The worst thing about full chisel is when you hit something rounding off the tip, then you can sharpen a third of the tooth to get it in shape. Steve

 

[Squareground3691]

A radial edge will last longer than a straight edge in dirty wood but obviously the chisel chain gonna cut faster by design

 

[PV Hiker]

Semi-chisel tolerates a great deal more dulling before it quits cutting. The only difference between them is that tiny bit of extra metal in the corner. When filed well, it makes a nice sharp tooth that penetrates the wood quicker than otherwise. Semi-chisel lacks that sharp point, which is curiously easy to bend down with the slightest trip into the dirt. Then it instantly becomes a ramp for the tooth to help deflect off the wood that needs to be cut.

....

That is a great way of saying it!

 

[rogue60]

Aussie hardwoods and white ant **** up the guts especially when dry can be brutal on any chain.
Even in pretty clean timber I'll give the chain a rub every tank so you are doing OK getting a tank out of the chain in that dirty crap you are cutting. So yeah you are doing nothing wrong if swapping out chains and sharpening at home works for you keep doing it you said you don't cut much so hand filing on the saw in the bush isn't imperative.
And don't skimp on chain Stihl semi chisel is the best in this type of scenario.

 

[BrettS]

What can I say? Everybody should know how literal I am by now.

Among other things....