Logging for remote cabin site in AK

[Humptulips]

I know a few people that have done not exactly what you are talking about but similar.
Winter is your friend. Get in there when things are frozen and bring a snowmobile. Build yourself a trail to the timber and you should be able to skid the logs pretty easy. No mud, everything will be frozen.
I question the idea of using very small trees though. No insulative value to a 6 inch pole. Bigger the better in my book. Can't pull the bigger trees? What about a vertical log cabin.
What are you going to do there? I think I'd be bored to tears once the new wears off.

 

[northmanlogging]

Me and the wifey got a copy of alone in the wilderness couple years ago for kristmass(yule for us pagans). I plan to one day be self sufficient, Mr. Proenneke helps me relax when things don't go well (replace his last name with his first name and say it out loud...:msp_ohmy, If he can do it at 53 or so then my busted butt should be able to pull it off before I'm 45, The best part of his book in my limited opinion is the psycho in the fur coat...

Good luck with your project though.

Spruce logs can be pretty light when dry, thats why the Wright brothers used em for air planes, hence the spruce army during world war one, but they are still pretty heavy when wet or green. Figure roughly 3.25 green, or 1.91 dry, pounds per board foot, that makes a 10" x 20' log weigh 425 pounds green or 250 pounds dry, these are ish numbers but they will get you in the ball park, so yeah Di(k is still a bad mo-fo

 

[Sandhill Crane]

What about a cord wood house/cabin? Again, very, very slow and labor intensive, but the material may be easier to get to the building site. You will need a means of collecting firewood anyway, same thing for the cordwood. It all sounds romantic, but I would strongly listen with an open ear and heart to those who live there.

 

[Slamm]

About that romance stuff, there is something about getting stuck in mud pulling logs that will quickly take the romance out of most any situation.

I always have to tip my hat to those that just work their butts off the hard way and never stop to think, what else could I be doing right now if I had worked smarter?

I don't mind working hard, but I work smart first and back it up with hard to get it done faster. My dad just worked hard ........... and I had to do it with him, there is easily 2 years of my life that could have been spent doing something else if we had the proper tools and equipment to clear land and fence rows, but thats how he wanted to do it, LOL. He taught me hard work, but you will get more out of life if you will work smart and hard.

I spent many a summer digging post holes with a hand post hole digger when a 3 point tractor auger was leaning in the corner of the shed ............ I'm 36 years old, its never moved ......... thats my dad.

Think to yourself, do you want to be knee deep in mud drinking whiskey trying to get an ATV unstuck or on the front porch drinking a beer/wine looking out at the horizon. Get some prefab'd lumber products and sled them in and be done with it, then spend time looking at the scenery, instead of getting it all over you, LOL.

Its one thing if the OP already knew what he was doing, but 10 miles from the nearest soul ain't the time to learn some skills.

Just an opinion,

Sam

 

[svfancler]

About that romance stuff, there is something about getting stuck in mud pulling logs that will quickly take the romance out of most any situation.

I always have to tip my hat to those that just work their butts off the hard way and never stop to think, what else could I be doing right now if I had worked smarter?

I don't mind working hard, but I work smart first and back it up with hard to get it done faster. My dad just worked hard ........... and I had to do it with him, there is easily 2 years of my life that could have been spent doing something else if we had the proper tools and equipment to clear land and fence rows, but thats how he wanted to do it, LOL. He taught me hard work, but you will get more out of life if you will work smart and hard.

I spent many a summer digging post holes with a hand post hole digger when a 3 point tractor auger was leaning in the corner of the shed ............ I'm 36 years old, its never moved ......... thats my dad.

Think to yourself, do you want to be knee deep in mud drinking whiskey trying to get an ATV unstuck or on the front porch drinking a beer/wine looking out at the horizon. Get some prefab'd lumber products and sled them in and be done with it, then spend time looking at the scenery, instead of getting it all over you, LOL.

Its one thing if the OP already knew what he was doing, but 10 miles from the nearest soul ain't the time to learn some skills.

Just an opinion,

Sam

I appreciate your warning about the realities of this kind of work, but after clearing lots and building patios for about 4 years in Montana, often above 6500 ft. elevation Im pretty well sure I do like hard work and I have some of the skills to do it.

My question is really about this swamp. We dont have much about swamp here in the rockies and though Ive strapped up 7 ton boulders and skidding them around on steep slopes with an excavator, I have not pulled 300 pound logs out of a swamp and I thought this might be the place to get some answers about technique. I admire all of you real loggers out there, but the work my little outfit has done around ski mountains here would probably make a lot of you want a stiff drink.

Of course what Im talking about doing is terribly difficult, that is why im asking around, calling guys that have done it and scouting the place with little more than my pack and a bow saw before I dump my lifes savings into this project.

I take the real warnings and the actual advice very seriously but the dismissive, you dont want to do that comments assume too much about who I am and what I want to do.

 

[Slamm]

Sounds good.

A man without a challenge is typically only a shell of what he could be or could have done. Different things challenge different people. Maybe this is your challenge ........... me, I'd helo in a little cabin and go hunting or fishing everyday after that.

Good luck, and post photos,

Sam

 

[ShaneLogs]

You could wait till the ground freezes up hard and the water freezes up and the ice is thick enough to bring machines across it then you could skid logs right across the swamp.

 

[forestryworks]

Have you heard of Richard Proenneke, he built a cabin up there by himself, using only hand tools when he was 53ish but he stayed up there until 86ish(have horrible memory for times), someone made a movie out of his home videos from the 60s called Alone in the Wilderness, you should see if you can find it. There also a national park at his old cabin site and the cabin is still there.

Proenneke's book is a great read and should be required reading of all Alaska-bound modern homesteaders. I place his book on the same shelf I place Aldo Leopold's "A Sand County Almanac".

Proenneke was also a great naturalist in his own right and was instrumental in Lake Clark becoming a National Park & Preserve.

He lived in this cabin for thirty years.

 

[northmanlogging]

A guy can move a fair bit of wood with a four wheeler, even more if you can get the end of the ground, and four wheelers get pretty good mileage, the problem lies in this swamp you speak of, most of the chain saw winches etc, have a line speed of around 100' a minute and plenty of power to pull the logs you want to pull especially when dry, but do they have enough reach? you want to keep anything you can't pick up easily on solid ground, that means dragging string out into the swamp by hand and yarding to hard ground, not fun work but not impossible, your also hampered with the chainsaw winches by how far you can reach, the Lewis winch can only carry 150' of line, the capstan types can use an unlimited amount of rope... but rope is kinda iffy and likes to stretch, and get cut on stuff and packs full of mud... on and on. so if you can get within range of these logs you should be able to deck em up with the lewis winch and then pull a stick or two at a time with the fourwheeler, especially with a log arch. If your cut off from your cabin sight with more swamp or creeks, then deck the logs at a solid spot in the summer using chainsaw winch and wait until winter and use a snowmobile to move em to the cabin sight. The real bastard heavy work will be getting them to an initial gathering point out of the swamp, falling, limbing, yarding, all a pain by hand but not impossible. If you can rig it run your winch line up in a tree 20-30', that way as the logs come in the end gets lifted a bit and they are inclined to stack themselves for you, in theory anyway, doesn't have to be real high but the higher you go the better the results. This method is called cold decking by the way, build a big pile of wood and then come back later and concentrate on moving them farther down the line. Once you have your cold deck it shouldn't take more than a week or two of skidding them to the cabin sight, unless you want some kind of backwoods mansion, then figure on three weeks:msp_biggrin: Good luck to you and I really want to see pictures of this project!

 

[svfancler]

A guy can move a fair bit of wood with a four wheeler, even more if you can get the end of the ground, and four wheelers get pretty good mileage, the problem lies in this swamp you speak of, most of the chain saw winches etc, have a line speed of around 100' a minute and plenty of power to pull the logs you want to pull especially when dry, but do they have enough reach? you want to keep anything you can't pick up easily on solid ground, that means dragging string out into the swamp by hand and yarding to hard ground, not fun work but not impossible, your also hampered with the chainsaw winches by how far you can reach, the Lewis winch can only carry 150' of line, the capstan types can use an unlimited amount of rope... but rope is kinda iffy and likes to stretch, and get cut on stuff and packs full of mud... on and on. so if you can get within range of these logs you should be able to deck em up with the lewis winch and then pull a stick or two at a time with the fourwheeler, especially with a log arch. If your cut off from your cabin sight with more swamp or creeks, then deck the logs at a solid spot in the summer using chainsaw winch and wait until winter and use a snowmobile to move em to the cabin sight. The real bastard heavy work will be getting them to an initial gathering point out of the swamp, falling, limbing, yarding, all a pain by hand but not impossible. If you can rig it run your winch line up in a tree 20-30', that way as the logs come in the end gets lifted a bit and they are inclined to stack themselves for you, in theory anyway, doesn't have to be real high but the higher you go the better the results. This method is called cold decking by the way, build a big pile of wood and then come back later and concentrate on moving them farther down the line. Once you have your cold deck it shouldn't take more than a week or two of skidding them to the cabin sight, unless you want some kind of backwoods mansion, then figure on three weeks:msp_biggrin: Good luck to you and I really want to see pictures of this project!

This is excellent feedback! I saved this right into my little research folder. I am hoping to find two or three accessible stands on this first trip in and I will measure carefully and reference against the capabilities of the lewis winch. The capstan looks like something that WILL pack full of mud as soon as the line gets wet. I understand the Lewis winches are very reliable, and I know some guys who have gotten them second hand with no problems, but for this remote work Im thinking sink the money into a new one.

The cold decking is exactly what I need to do. Im not a millionaire and this is a long term goal for me so breaking things into stages is my only option.

Im not building a four-star commercial lodge, we're not talking a thousand logs. My initial plans are leaning towards something more like 12 x 16 so contracting one of my neighbors four wheelers or bringing in a snowmachine is not going to run me in the e10s of thousands...unless i blow it up and have to fly in a new one.


Thanks again.