I see meets or exceeds everywhere. I ignore it. Unless it’s tested it’s irrelevant.
Newbie to running older saws, question on mix ratio
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Yeah , I remember also the old Castrol Syntech vs Mobile 1 law suit over what qualified as a " Synthetic Oil " eventually Castrol one out due to its original base oil was PAO from crude stock origination . All oil are synthesized to provide the best final package for the intended application of usage . Unfortunately there are numerous oils that are not certified that are very good oils . Similarly , they are quite often economically much more affordable . I refuse to pay $ 30+ for a qt of 2T oil brother . I pay $13 to $15 for my oil needs , truck , car , tractor , backhoe , Harley , boat motor , chainsaw etc. That's why i say. for a simple small hand held 2T engine FB & FC oil are more than adequate . Perhaps if I made a living with these units I would by FD . P.S. My Dynaglide gets Group V oil brother !
I laugh at certification , I used Shell & Castrol & Exxon 2T oils for yrs . Not Jaso certified . Just know what your buying is from a reputable world class manufacturer . Does it say low ash or no ash , for outboard or lawnmower you must know the difference . That is why they are what they are "World Class" I see certified oils all the time that have their oil base stock & sometimes final blended product manufacturered & delivered to them from the same Shell or Castrol or Exxon Producer , its mostly a marketing ploy . Yes , they pay to have a unbiased outside authority certify the composition of their oil & perhaps some customers sleep better paying $5- S10 more for the same product with a Jaso Certification label , sorry my names Tucker not Sucker . My engines perform well without any Jaso accreditation & that Castrol Gardener is not Jaso accredited , rather Api. TC brother !
Exactly. It's misleading at best snd IMO the sign of a half assed company.
Shell, Castrol and exxon have all made or make certified oils.I laugh at certification , I used Shell & Castrol & Exxon 2T oils for yrs . Not Jaso certified . Just know what your buying is from a reputable world class manufacturer . Does it say low ash or no ash , for outboard or lawnmower you must know the difference . That is why they are what they are "World Class" I see certified oils all the time that have their oil base stock & sometimes final blended product manufacturered & delivered to them from the same Shell or Castrol or Exxon Producer , its mostly a marketing ploy . Yes , they pay to have a unbiased outside authority certify the composition of their oil & perhaps some customers sleep better paying $5- S10 more for the same product with a Jaso Certification label , sorry my names Tucker not Sucker . My engines perform well without any Jaso accreditation & that Castrol Gardener is not Jaso accredited , rather Api. TC brother !
And its not a marketing ploy at all as the equipment manufacturers are the ones that request certification.
And certification has nothing to do with composition. It's performance testing.
API TC isn't in use anymore and hasn't been for decades BTW.
In many cases oils that are actually certified do not coat anything more than those that are not.
Holy can of worms batman! I never meant to stir a beehive.
@North by Northwest I couldn't quite make out if you were saying that using that brand of oil is good or bad with the ***'s (I didnt know if thats a bad word filter or not.)
Those saws linked by the down under brother sure have seen some serious use. I might actually use the saws 0-20 hrs a year. I'm probably safe using std off the shelf 2 stroke oil at the 40:1 suggested.
Now another thing that I litterally cannot wrap my head around is that Ive read that having a richer oil mix actually leans out the saw. Ive been trying to noodle that for a bit and its not hitting any grey matter between my ear holes. Is that due to the different combustion temp?
@North by Northwest I couldn't quite make out if you were saying that using that brand of oil is good or bad with the ***'s (I didnt know if thats a bad word filter or not.)
Those saws linked by the down under brother sure have seen some serious use. I might actually use the saws 0-20 hrs a year. I'm probably safe using std off the shelf 2 stroke oil at the 40:1 suggested.
Now another thing that I litterally cannot wrap my head around is that Ive read that having a richer oil mix actually leans out the saw. Ive been trying to noodle that for a bit and its not hitting any grey matter between my ear holes. Is that due to the different combustion temp?
FD oils don't cost anymore than FC in most cases.. FB is absolete snd no longer in use by several decades or more.Yeah , I remember also the old Castrol Syntech vs Mobile 1 law suit over what qualified as a " Synthetic Oil " eventually Castrol one out due to its original base oil was PAO from crude stock origination . All oil are synthesized to provide the best final package for the intended application of usage . Unfortunately there are numerous oils that are not certified that are very good oils . Similarly , they are quite often economically much more affordable . I refuse to pay $ 30+ for a qt of 2T oil brother . I pay $13 to $15 for my oil needs , truck , car , tractor , backhoe , Harley , boat motor , chainsaw etc. That's why i say. for a simple small hand held 2T engine FB & FC oil are more than adequate . Perhaps if I made a living with these units I would by FD . P.S. My Dynaglide gets Group V oil brother !
Castrol was group 3 btw and mobil was group 4/5. Neither of these facts really has any relevance to two cycle oil as the synthetic component of most modern two cycle oils is PIB, which isn't typicaly use in motor oils.
If I oil isn't certified the company is half azzed in my oppinion. Buyer beware.
and if anyone is interested in peeking at the antique collection the old man left behind heres some potato quality pics:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/AQUueyDBYHudquSH8
https://photos.app.goo.gl/AQUueyDBYHudquSH8
camel2019
ArboristSite Guru
It leans it out bc their more oil to fuel meaning less fuel to the saw this is why it’s important to tune to the mix.
People obsess on this but a 20 degree change in temp has much more effect than a little more oil.
Only oil i would not use on a chainsaw is either Stihl Ultra or any ashless marine grade oil . Any other aircooled 2T oil mixed at a reasonable ratio within a properly tune engine is fair game brother . Also the heavier ratio of oil displaces the adequate fuel to air ratio which causes a leaning effect to your previous balanced tuning efforts , in fact barimetric pressure has more direct effect on tuning .The more oil concept rational came into vogue during engine performance enhancement theory . More oil better seals the rings to produce more compression & power . Hell , more carbon in the combustion chamber must qualify as a engine performance enhancement also , since it theoretically increases compression for a short period of time .
Nice collection , well organized shop also !
The certification is irrevalant Ben , the oil is still on the market & being sold will be for the forseable future , unless electric gains a lot more traction . I never said FB , or FC or FD oil was more expensive its the certification of some FD certified oil or greedy manufacturers that inflate the unit cost with all their hot air about how nice their oil smells or smokes less because the bottle has a Jaso label , i call BS !
I have a bottle of Bel Ray H1-R beside me and it has in big letters "100% synthetic ester", says nothing about the base oil, which after reading this thread probably means it's refined mineral oil. Reminds me of food packaging and labeling... LOW FAT.
I have always kept a separate can for older saws. I mix 2.6 ounces of Husqvarna 2t oil with about 3/4 gallon gas. What ratio is that? I have no idea. But nothing smokes excessively or locks up. I have always said that if we had todays motor oil in the engines from the 60s and 70s, 300-500k miles would have been the norm.
It's not irrelevant. Saying you meet a set of tests you never took is irrelevant and misleading in a base case.
Sounds advice on Ultra...Only oil i would not use on a chainsaw is either Stihl Ultra or any ashless marine grade oil . Any other aircooled 2T oil mixed at a reasonable ratio within a properly tune engine is fair game brother . Also the heavier ratio of oil displaces the adequate fuel to air ratio which causes a leaning effect to your previous balanced tuning efforts , in fact barimetric pressure has mire direct effect on tuning .The more oil concept rational came into vogue during engine performance enhancement theory . More oil better seals the rings to produce more compression & power . Hell more carbon in the combustion chamber must qualify as a engine performance enhancement also , since it theoretically increases compression for a short period of time .
I've never had heavy carbon in any engine I have ever had, except those ran on castor blends.
The original Castrol Mobile 1 conflict was a api. driven politicial & 4 cycle service duty auto related to New Castrol Syntec Product line .
To use the kiss protocyl if it mentions ester its a ester based oil , other wise mineral or pao based synthetic oil .
Every manufacturer tests internally , the recipe dictates the end results . Boil potatoes , smash & add gravy or butter to achieve an end result of mashed potatoes with either ester based gravy or mineral based butter , its not an unknown . Same with 2T oil , add a base oil ultra refine the sulfur & wax & other hydro carbons out with high heat "cracking" & further refining aka filtering & add some "secret herbs & spices" additive packages & you have FD rated Mashed Potatoes brother ! Its a finite well known final recipe package "inhouse" This religious testing inhouse by numerous engine manufacturers using a multitude of oils inhouse , ensure that the engine engineers & manufacturers know what oil run best in engine X,Y,or Z . The Certification testing that Jaso does is a farce with antiquated 2T aircooled generator sets that are of questionable Chinaisium design . Further policy includes obsolete hot plate burn off & viscocity wheel testing perimeters . All redundant & unecessary . You use your hi priced FD labeled oil i will continue to use my Jaso uncertified Amsoil or any other quality 2T oils including Castrol Gardener or Shell - XYZ with no reservations less $$$ & with equal too or greater benefits within my engines brother !
