Pioneer chainsaws

[Jeff_M]

Hi Folks, I've got a couple P-series saws with fatigued clutch springs I would like to replace and was thinking it might be worth my time to fabricate something like Pioneers obsolete Clutch Plier Tool (507475212). Does anyone have this tool, and if so would you be willing to take a close-up side and front picture with a ruler, and post? The images in the service manual are helpful but obstruct the tool somewhat. Thanks for any help or advice, really appreciate the knowledgable people on this thread!

 

[pioneerguy600]

whats that pioneer?

That is an 850 geardrive, basically a 750 chainsaw mated to a geardrive output box.

 

[Arrowhead]

Hi Folks, I've got a couple P-series saws with fatigued clutch springs I would like to replace and was thinking it might be worth my time to fabricate something like Pioneers obsolete Clutch Plier Tool (507475212). Does anyone have this tool, and if so would you be willing to take a close-up side and front picture with a ruler, and post? The images in the service manual are helpful but obstruct the tool somewhat. Thanks for any help or advice, really appreciate the knowledgable people on this thread!

What P saws do you have? As far as the the P40 and larger go, simple long-nose pliers work great while the clutch is off.

 

[Arrowhead]

I just returned from Australia and ran into my old friend Terry Tichner again, thought you might enjoy seeing this one.

Thanks for sharing Mark. That a great saw. Looks like a cool shop. Do you have any other pics posted in any other threads of that saw shop?

 

[mirosti]

Hallo,
I recently bought Pioneer P40 in very good condition, compression is exelent.
The problem is cold start. After pulled choke and cranking, cant start. My solution is to flood filter with a litlle gas, and after that it starts imdiatelly.
After first start it starts normally.
I clean carburator, it seems all is in good order.
Any advice?

 

[Jeff_M]

What P saws do you have? As far as the the P40 and larger go, simple long-nose pliers work great while the clutch is off.

Thank you for the response. I purchased my first used Pioneer P50 in 1989 to use on a vertical style CSM and it held up well, so I ended up with a few more - P38,P50x2,P60,P62x2,PP62, and a 655BP upgrade, when I'm not using a 026 and FM80. The replacement clutch springs I have are continuous without the hooked ends, so I thought the special tool might help. Since the long nose pliers have worked for you I'll give it a go. I have used the small post tool for replacing the fiber shoes and spring on a P50 and the P60, and it worked really well. Thanks again, cheers!

 

[rocketnorton]

Hallo,
I recently bought Pioneer P40 in very good condition, compression is exelent.
The problem is cold start. After pulled choke and cranking, cant start. My solution is to flood filter with a litlle gas, and after that it starts imdiatelly.
After first start it starts normally.
I clean carburator, it seems all is in good order.
Any advice?

air &/or fuel leaks. or pump diaphragm... vac test fuel lines, engine. if that's good, look @ carb.... may need kit. that saw is worth a little work, imo. like one I have. pics?

 

[Arrowhead]

Hallo,
I recently bought Pioneer P40 in very good condition, compression is exelent.
The problem is cold start. After pulled choke and cranking, cant start. My solution is to flood filter with a litlle gas, and after that it starts imdiatelly.
After first start it starts normally.
I clean carburator, it seems all is in good order.
Any advice?

I'd replace the fuel lines and fuel filter. Make sure there is no obstruction in the impulse passage on the reed bock or carb.
Also check the reed to make sure it's in good shape. The gasket between the reed block and case are prone for air leaks. It would be wise to check the entire saw for air leaks.
Did you rebuild or just clean the carb? If the metering diphram is just a little stiff, it will make for a hard start.

 

[Arrowhead]

Thank you for the response. I purchased my first used Pioneer P50 in 1989 to use on a vertical style CSM and it held up well, so I ended up with a few more - P38,P50x2,P60,P62x2,PP62, and a 655BP upgrade, when I'm not using a 026 and FM80. The replacement clutch springs I have are continuous without the hooked ends, so I thought the special tool might help. Since the long nose pliers have worked for you I'll give it a go. I have used the small post tool for replacing the fiber shoes and spring on a P50 and the P60, and it worked really well. Thanks again, cheers!

Sounds like you have a nice collection. We'd love to see pics!!

 

[mirosti]

Thank you rocketnorton & arrowhead,
I just clean and check carb. Have no experience with reed valve, when I take off carb, seen that membran not tight. Don't know how is the right order of that assembly.
When starts, saw is doing very strong and rpm is stable.

Highly appreciate your help.
In Serbia is impossible to find any parts for Pioneer, so I have no possibility to buy membranes.

 

[Lou]

@ mirosti;
I always run my FarmSaw dry before I put it away. When sitting for an extended period, I've learned to put a little fuel in the throat to get her started the first time. Once she's been running that isn't necessary again unless she isn't started for another extended period.
HTH
Lou

 

[mirosti]

Thank you Lou,
I just doing the same when starting.
But, I want to start normally with choke.

 

[Arrowhead]

Thank you rocketnorton & arrowhead,
I just clean and check carb. Have no experience with reed valve, when I take off carb, seen that membran not tight. Don't know how is the right order of that assembly.
When starts, saw is doing very strong and rpm is stable.

Highly appreciate your help.
In Serbia is impossible to find any parts for Pioneer, so I have no possibility to buy membranes.

We can send the parts you may need. Depending on the model of the carb, I may have a rebuild kit here.
I know I have new fuel lines I can send also. I'd send the parts to you for just the cost of shipping. Do you have a paypal account?
It would be nice to know there is a good running P40 in Serbia.
Is the carb a Tillotson or Walbro, then the model number.

 

[rocketnorton]

once the carb is known, then order of gaskets & "membranes", can be checked. if the membrane [pump diaphragm] and it gasket are reversed, they will not "pump", not very good at starting speed, anyway...

 

[Jeff_M]

Sounds like you have a nice collection. We'd love to see pics!!

Nothing special compared to yours and others who have posted here, but here's a few from the 70's:



And from the 80's:



They've worked well for felling, cutting firewood, and on a small mill:





Sorry Pioneer went out of business and what that meant to all that worked there, but it's nice their good engineering and products live on, and are appreciated.

 

[fossil]

Nothing special compared to yours and others who have posted here, but here's a few from the 70's:

View attachment 324466

And from the 80's:

View attachment 324467

They've worked well for felling, cutting firewood, and on a small mill:

View attachment 324468

View attachment 324470

Sorry Pioneer went out of business and what that meant to all that worked there, but it's nice their good engineering and products live on, and are appreciated.

Good looking group of saws

 

[Arrowhead]

Very nice collection!!

 

[heimannm]

mirosti - Although it may be hard to find locally, sounds like you need a carburetor kit. What carburetor does that saw use?

Before you go too far though, check to make sure the choke is closing fully. I found on a few of my old saws that due to wear or use, the linkages no longer closed the choke fully and the only way to get them to start was a prime down the carburetor. Repair the linkage to close the choke and the problems were solved.

Ed - search on "Australia", I posted quite few photos of Terry shop after my first visit a few years back. On second thought, those photos have probably disappeared as well...

I do have some more photos but no time to post them now. We need to meet up at a GTG again and look through all the albums. He has all kinds of chain saws, machine tools, old equipment, stationary engines, and the list goes on.

Mark

 

[mirosti]

We can send the parts you may need. Depending on the model of the carb, I may have a rebuild kit here.
I know I have new fuel lines I can send also. I'd send the parts to you for just the cost of shipping. Do you have a paypal account?
It would be nice to know there is a good running P40 in Serbia.
Is the carb a Tillotson or Walbro, then the model number.

Thank you very much for all supports.
Carburator type is: Tillotson HS147B2.
Unfortunatelly, I have no paypal. If you want you can send diaphragms only, in standard letter.
Nice regards from Serbia.

ps. I have no idea who was leader in design and tehnology:Stihl or Pioneer in that time(60-70ties).
Pioneer castings shows significant similarity to the plane parts.

 

[P62]

Pioneer P52
Finaly picked up a Pioneer P52 to complete my P series collection. This one will need some TLC but I have enough parts to complete the saw. Picked up a few more along the way to make the trip worth while.