Poll: What model for the next AS build off??
- Thread starter blsnelling
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little possum
Crash and Burn
Ya know, I dont think weve ever run the 3120 VS the other 084... I still think the SP125C takes the cake
Sure it will handle it. IDK how long it would run it though
wigglesworth
Booned
HOORAY 044!!! 
HILLBILLYREDNEC
Addicted to ArboristSite
Build saw
I still think the work saw build is the way to go. Kinda like a show and tell of how and what to do for sawyers on a budget. To many of the saws built on here are worthless for work because they are over built and would fail to perform in the real world, this aint Cookie cutter fairytale land yaz know. I am always looking for ways to improve the standard off the shelf work saw. I see porting as no value in the woods, to much risk of it failing at the wrong time.
I still think the work saw build is the way to go. Kinda like a show and tell of how and what to do for sawyers on a budget. To many of the saws built on here are worthless for work because they are over built and would fail to perform in the real world, this aint Cookie cutter fairytale land yaz know. I am always looking for ways to improve the standard off the shelf work saw. I see porting as no value in the woods, to much risk of it failing at the wrong time.
little possum
Crash and Burn
Contradiction?
I would think if they have such a high failure rate a lot of timberfallers out your way would quit running them. I would think all of them in the last buildoff could cut firewood all day. I know the 2 I did have cut 5 tanks in a row in oak with a 24" bar on one and a 28" bar on the other.
Yup. But I think we're getting used to that. And we give it the attention it deserves. Or not.
Define "porting".
little possum
Crash and Burn
It would be a test, but most of the builders would port differently for a milling saw.. ?
HILLBILLYREDNEC
Addicted to ArboristSite
I am talking porting that removes weight and metal. I see no reason not to up the compression by lowering the squish and do some polishing, but removing metal to get more power is useless in a daily work saw. There is a guy on you tube and he admits that one of his ported saws eats spark plugs because of to much compression. Firewood saws are not work saws in what I am talking about,a true work saw is one that gets used 10 hours a day no pampering all day,just add fuel oil and that is it. I have been told by a few of my friends who still do falling locally that the FS gets the ticket book out for overly modified saws :msp_mad: I am the type to v stack the saw open the muffler and adjust the carb and use it. I have neither the patience or brains to port a saw, to me the simple way to get more power is to either buy a bigger saw or do a few minor changes to the saw . I want to see what other do to bone stock saws to get a little extra umph out of them. There are tons of videos about wild hot saws on the net, not much on budget grade saw improvement that the average home handyman can do to make his saw more usable. Porting involves alot of tools and is very time consuming to do right, most of are not up to do that much work.
indiansprings
Firewood Purveyor
Hillbilly, it is obvious that you have never worked in a commercial firewood operation, you need to get your candyazz down here to a real firewood operation. Saws will get run 10 hours a day and there isn't any babying saws. Just good daily maint. is performed. I'll bet our firewood saws make as many cuts as any saw used on timber, depends on the customer but can be from every 12 inches to every 24" depending on the length of wood
the customer wants. You need to mouth someone else other than the firewood cutters. We use a saw as hard as anyone. I bet you the Simonized 460 that is on it's way back, ( and yes it has had metal removed,lol) will hold up just fine to 8-10 hour days of constant firewood bucking on a landing. Many have got decent gains with nothing more than a 30.00 dremel tool a couple of carbide burs, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to do a basic woods port. When is the last time you heard of a FS service guy tearing down a saw to see if it had been modded. Sure no arrestor screens, you'll get popped. If it is so "dangerous" to run a modded saw why does Simon, TimberWolf, Walker's and others make their living modding true "professional" fallers saws. If they were in danger of getting tickets every day I don't think would be having the multitude of customers that they have.
the customer wants. You need to mouth someone else other than the firewood cutters. We use a saw as hard as anyone. I bet you the Simonized 460 that is on it's way back, ( and yes it has had metal removed,lol) will hold up just fine to 8-10 hour days of constant firewood bucking on a landing. Many have got decent gains with nothing more than a 30.00 dremel tool a couple of carbide burs, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to do a basic woods port. When is the last time you heard of a FS service guy tearing down a saw to see if it had been modded. Sure no arrestor screens, you'll get popped. If it is so "dangerous" to run a modded saw why does Simon, TimberWolf, Walker's and others make their living modding true "professional" fallers saws. If they were in danger of getting tickets every day I don't think would be having the multitude of customers that they have.
If I'm going to spend the time to polish anything on the inside you bet I'm going to remove some metal to make it work better and more efficient. I don't think a fallers saw gets worked any harder than someone cutting firewood for a living. The firewood saw is making cut after cut 20" apart sometimes for a whole tank then stop and refuel, fire it up and keep going.
HILLBILLYREDNEC
Addicted to ArboristSite
From what you just said proves that you are not able to read, I said firewood cutters not commercialized fire wood harvesting for resale. Firewood cutting is a totally different gig then commercial logging. From what you are misconstruing about my post shows your lack of knowledge on porting. When I say metal I mean, pistons being shaved,piston being shaped, and jugs being reduced in port size and inlet and exhaust being reshaped. There is three types of porting I know that get done, polishing of the transfers and lower the squish, reshaping the ports and the exhaust outlet, race porting for pure speed. And you know nothing about my local FS policies, FS policies very from region to region. Ignorance is ok if you do not insult some else.
Porting does not raise compression...which you seem to be in favor of...
So...you are willing to do visible mods, i.e., the kind that the FS can write tickets for, but opposed to the one's that can't be seen?
So, assuming porting has "no value" makes you feel better about not being able to port your saw?
Try porting.
Give the search engine a go...you might be surprised.
Porting doesn't. Turning popups and cylinder bases certainly does.
Doing most anything right is time consuming. I used to have more time than money...now I don't seem to have any of either.
I would say that most people frequenting this site aren't afraid of a little work. The one's that are, or lack the knowledge/skills or ambition, or simply don't have the urge to modify their saws, generally don't hide behind nonsense about how little value porting has.
Like any other engine, there is a whole range of modification you can do depending on skill, finances, and the effort you are willing to put in. Lumping everything from a woods port to a race saw in the same category just demonstrates ignorance.
Spend some time reading, find your comfort level, and be happy with it.
indiansprings
Firewood Purveyor
I'm not a very smart guy, but it's just like you said Mdavlee, is that once we hit the woods the saws literally will run from 7am until whenever we decide we've had enough, we take two 15 min breaks and a 30 minute lunch, with one guy doing nothing but dragging up tops with a 4wd tractor, two saws saw busy limbing and one stays busy bucking. After a few days of bucking and piling we'll split, or after we're way ahead on wood cut to length I take the guy of the tractor and one limber and put them to splitting. I'm in no way shape or form a faller, even after 30+ years of using a saw, it still bugs me to cut down the true monsters, I've backed down more than once from falling a tree, if I'm uncomfortable with falling a tree that is outside my self imposed limitations, I'll usually have my cousin who logs for a living come over and drop it.
I have the upmost respect for fallers and guys in the PNW. I think the true fallers have the same respect for the guys sawing firewood for a living, they understand it is repetitive cut after cut until the tank is dry, fill her up and go again and again. Lots of repitition, just cut after cut. A firewood saw in this setting gets used every bit as hard as a falling saw. Hillbillies post are again just an example he has no understanding of what we do in this part of the country. It just takes a good saw of any brand, sharp chain, good mix, common sense and a hell of alot of hard work. There is no glamour in it, there will never be a show on TV about it, not enough danger and drama and our bars are just too short. Hillbilly or anyone else is welcome to come spend a day with us from around the 2nd or 3rd week of Sept to the 1st of Mar, we'll make sure they get their monies worth.
Tops are just in the kiln as far as I'm concerned with this weather we're having. I've been on the fence as hard on porters as anyone, I've got enough for guys like TLandrum to listen to them as far as what he gets in increased production from good ported work saws, the same with Simon, he wouldn't have the business or repeat customers if the saws didn't increase their production.
I'm in that phase of life where I realize I'm getting old plus the health issues I've got prevent me from running a big saw all say. Even though I'm a big ole boy, I can't run a 460 all day anymore. I really am liking the idea of a agressively ported 261 to run most of the time on 18" and smaller wood. The youngster's can have the enjoyment of running the big saws. I rather run the smallest saw I can run that doesn't effect our production. Easier on the body, easier on fuel.
I have the upmost respect for fallers and guys in the PNW. I think the true fallers have the same respect for the guys sawing firewood for a living, they understand it is repetitive cut after cut until the tank is dry, fill her up and go again and again. Lots of repitition, just cut after cut. A firewood saw in this setting gets used every bit as hard as a falling saw. Hillbillies post are again just an example he has no understanding of what we do in this part of the country. It just takes a good saw of any brand, sharp chain, good mix, common sense and a hell of alot of hard work. There is no glamour in it, there will never be a show on TV about it, not enough danger and drama and our bars are just too short. Hillbilly or anyone else is welcome to come spend a day with us from around the 2nd or 3rd week of Sept to the 1st of Mar, we'll make sure they get their monies worth.
Tops are just in the kiln as far as I'm concerned with this weather we're having. I've been on the fence as hard on porters as anyone, I've got enough for guys like TLandrum to listen to them as far as what he gets in increased production from good ported work saws, the same with Simon, he wouldn't have the business or repeat customers if the saws didn't increase their production.
I'm in that phase of life where I realize I'm getting old plus the health issues I've got prevent me from running a big saw all say. Even though I'm a big ole boy, I can't run a 460 all day anymore. I really am liking the idea of a agressively ported 261 to run most of the time on 18" and smaller wood. The youngster's can have the enjoyment of running the big saws. I rather run the smallest saw I can run that doesn't effect our production. Easier on the body, easier on fuel.
