MasterBlaster
TreeHouse Elder
What mah homes said, dawg.
Rope questions
- Thread starter jaymay75
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I have climbed on it when was like 6 and it was the cats meow then. Ropes have come a long way as with climbing techniques. I guess I just spoil myself. It doesn't have to be expensive for me to like it. I really like Buckeneer ropes and they are low end. Its ust personal choice. If works for and you like then thats great. I just get the feeling some people are being a bit closed minded on this.
Kneejerk Bombas
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You have to remember, ropes change too in a 12 year span.
MasterBlaster
TreeHouse Elder
You lucky dawg!
Kneejerk Bombas
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I doubt you get them that mature...
Operator error. Jeff, on the John Deere, gunned the engine as the tree started to wiggle and you know that's not good when you still have more than 6"- 8" of hinge to cut on a 100' tall backleaner. The tree tipped, wobbled and set back down on the 7900 when the rope snapped. It had a lean towards the backcut. Lost a foot and a half off the end of the rope hitched to the Deere. I wanted Slow and Easy and got gun and run. Jeff backed up, I retied the rope and he tried it slow and easy, it worked. I'm sure anyone that has had someone pull a tree with a machine has experienced an operator giving them a gun and run. I told Rich to down grade that rope and I'd give him a new one to replace it. We could have used my ropes but Rich went up to cut the left and right spars off to enable us to fit the tree in what we had for landing zone and his ropes were up there. So we used his rope. Last tree of the day, third time Jeff had ever pulled a tree over with the Deere. Not dumb, Jeff just jumped the gun as I was making the backcut. No one hurt.
Kneejerk Bombas
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The old truck pull. Very dangerous, not too professional, and dumb, if you want my opinion.
Did you participate in the truck pull thread? That was a good one, half the people said truck pull was dumb, the other half said nothing could ever go wrong.
Did you participate in the truck pull thread? That was a good one, half the people said truck pull was dumb, the other half said nothing could ever go wrong.
i think the portable power and anchoring wieght of the Truck Pull is usable lightly as the gentle giant; and being familiar with lines and working carefully can easily get great results.
i think placing a Porty with a few wraps onto truck, gives adjustability to another besides gun-ho mo-fo; with ~3wraps, the line should safely slip before overloading, kinda like a mechancial fuse. Driver should be very carefull not to snap line, for they are prolly in line with it's Deadly Unleashed Force of Line Recoil
(Actuarily, i'm legally not allowed to agree with Mike, so had to respond)
i think placing a Porty with a few wraps onto truck, gives adjustability to another besides gun-ho mo-fo; with ~3wraps, the line should safely slip before overloading, kinda like a mechancial fuse. Driver should be very carefull not to snap line, for they are prolly in line with it's Deadly Unleashed Force of Line Recoil
(Actuarily, i'm legally not allowed to agree with Mike, so had to respond)
Kneejerk Bombas
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After reveiwing the thread "Truck Pull", kindly linked by Spyder, I see you did participate. Interesting to read your posts two years ago and to see you make this mistake now.
Boy, that thread really got edited up! It 's origanal edition was much better.
The growth rings on the evolution of all the branchings and intricacies of this place is like any other; different things handled differently; coddled more tenderly in the infancy to form the charachter, strength and weaknesses that now carry on the inertia of a seperate existance from all the effort input.
i think JP coulda trimed more here, less there etc.; but in the balance was "Good as Any, Better than Many" and then some. i think his heart and head were in the right places respectively, save with all disrespect a foot too high in each case!! .
i believe in free speach, but think that negativity is a force as any other, perhaps even a dis-ease. One that wishes not to die, but only change form and takes overwhelming/matching force to equalize; if not wished to roll on dancing to different forms of ugliness. So, theoretically, a lot of negativity can be a stunning waste of energy.
For, you have the force of the negativity, then the matching just to equalize to Zer0; but both parts could have been used to go forward, not backward; or chasing your own self around back to Zer0. The sum of all the pulls and pushes in a system make up it's balance or personality, each one able to throw things off a bit, especially those operating in extreme direction and/or forcefullness.
To correct off balance without going to opposite extreme, takes clean, focused intense force to and thru balanced center to target without distraction, as all ways and always i have seen this in trees, and can apply it elsewhere around me.
In a time of the one called Forrest/SpikeSupra; that caused such a stir, as to block our vision of and to the trees; i seemed to stand with him at every turn. i didn't like all of what he was/was not; but stood at the most extreme counterbalancing point of a negativity towards some folks and types as an unproductive climate to sense, civility and purpose here. Not so much for just his sake, but any that may wish to ask or speak here. Minding not so much where i stood specifically, but my affect on the total balance. Today, those extremes to either side exist not (fortunately). So, i have not a leveraged point of pull to try to pull to center target balance; so am left to the clean blown truth to power thru, without distraction.
Once again the 2 Ph sciences meet as in times of olde; and their first discovery.
i think JP coulda trimed more here, less there etc.; but in the balance was "Good as Any, Better than Many" and then some. i think his heart and head were in the right places respectively, save with all disrespect a foot too high in each case!!
.i believe in free speach, but think that negativity is a force as any other, perhaps even a dis-ease. One that wishes not to die, but only change form and takes overwhelming/matching force to equalize; if not wished to roll on dancing to different forms of ugliness. So, theoretically, a lot of negativity can be a stunning waste of energy.
For, you have the force of the negativity, then the matching just to equalize to Zer0; but both parts could have been used to go forward, not backward; or chasing your own self around back to Zer0. The sum of all the pulls and pushes in a system make up it's balance or personality, each one able to throw things off a bit, especially those operating in extreme direction and/or forcefullness.
To correct off balance without going to opposite extreme, takes clean, focused intense force to and thru balanced center to target without distraction, as all ways and always i have seen this in trees, and can apply it elsewhere around me.
In a time of the one called Forrest/SpikeSupra; that caused such a stir, as to block our vision of and to the trees; i seemed to stand with him at every turn. i didn't like all of what he was/was not; but stood at the most extreme counterbalancing point of a negativity towards some folks and types as an unproductive climate to sense, civility and purpose here. Not so much for just his sake, but any that may wish to ask or speak here. Minding not so much where i stood specifically, but my affect on the total balance. Today, those extremes to either side exist not (fortunately). So, i have not a leveraged point of pull to try to pull to center target balance; so am left to the clean blown truth to power thru, without distraction.
Once again the 2 Ph sciences meet as in times of olde; and their first discovery.
Kneejerk Bombas
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JPS did what he had to, I guess. That doesn't mean I didn't like the unedited version better.
Some of the editing was done by posters too.
Some of the editing was done by posters too.
truck pull
Mike I did take part in the thread and I am aware that precautions are needed when using machines to pull ropes. If you think using machines is dumb, "What are you doing on the computer?" I don't think it is unproffessional/dumb to use machines. Not thinking about and planning for what happens next if/when things go wrong is. I had prepared for the rope to break and when it did no one was hurt and the tree did not fall the wrong way. Of the more than 3 dozen dead or dying trees taken down and a dozen trees trimmed, on this and the seven ajoining properties, no one hurt and no damage other than Rich's broken rope. It is not that I am the luckiest guy alive, I am good at what I do. Not fast, Just good at what I do.
Mike I did take part in the thread and I am aware that precautions are needed when using machines to pull ropes. If you think using machines is dumb, "What are you doing on the computer?" I don't think it is unproffessional/dumb to use machines. Not thinking about and planning for what happens next if/when things go wrong is. I had prepared for the rope to break and when it did no one was hurt and the tree did not fall the wrong way. Of the more than 3 dozen dead or dying trees taken down and a dozen trees trimmed, on this and the seven ajoining properties, no one hurt and no damage other than Rich's broken rope. It is not that I am the luckiest guy alive, I am good at what I do. Not fast, Just good at what I do.
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murphy4trees
Addicted to ArboristSite
I jsut pulled over a backleaner with a good sidelean towards the house with Big Jon yesterday.... NO vehicles involved, cause bad access to the backyard. I put up second pull line just before making the cut... IN retrospect, Jon set the rigging up right... No real chance of rope or equipment failure... IN that respect it might have wasted 15 minutes... but it made me FEEL better.... MUCH BETTER...
IN geo's situation, a sceond line snugged up as an anchor line, could have made it possible for him to finish the backcut before calling for the pull on the Deere.
Also using the porty on a machine is a good idea, not so much as the fuse idea that Spidy mentioned, but that you know your bend ratio in the rope. Sounds like the way the rope was tied to the machine was as much the problem as poor communication, and improper training.
IN geo's situation, a sceond line snugged up as an anchor line, could have made it possible for him to finish the backcut before calling for the pull on the Deere.
Also using the porty on a machine is a good idea, not so much as the fuse idea that Spidy mentioned, but that you know your bend ratio in the rope. Sounds like the way the rope was tied to the machine was as much the problem as poor communication, and improper training.
Kneejerk Bombas
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Hey Geo, I never said I don't use machines, I just don't think the truck pull is smart. Read my comments on how I use a truck to pull over a tree in the truck pull thread.
What happened to you is just one of many things that can go wrong.
If a technique is unreliable, it should be removed from your standard techniques used. You can argue that you only use it when it's not a critical situation, but that's like saying standing on a ladder and making a cut without being tied in is ok, if it's not likely you'll fall. Both techniques are homeowner tactics, mostly because they don't know better, hence they are unprofessional by definition.
During the course of a workday you make hundreds of choices on how to do things. I consider those who consistantly make the choices on professionalism to be the best, and those who take shortcuts every chance they get, end up...well...like this.
What happened to you is just one of many things that can go wrong.
If a technique is unreliable, it should be removed from your standard techniques used. You can argue that you only use it when it's not a critical situation, but that's like saying standing on a ladder and making a cut without being tied in is ok, if it's not likely you'll fall. Both techniques are homeowner tactics, mostly because they don't know better, hence they are unprofessional by definition.
During the course of a workday you make hundreds of choices on how to do things. I consider those who consistantly make the choices on professionalism to be the best, and those who take shortcuts every chance they get, end up...well...like this.
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jaymay75
ArboristSite Lurker
Many thanks to Geofore as I met him on Saturday morning to learn a couple things and pick up some great rope. He has a pretty nice shop, and a lot of good equipment and a lot of knowledge. Pretty impressed. Thanks again for the help.
dbeck
ArboristSite Operative
MM,
if I used a pulley, rope and a truck to pull a skid of beer up my driveway to my garage be cause it would be waaaay to much work to carry all the cases up my driveway...would you think down on me or would you consider that acceptable creative thinking?
if I used a pulley, rope and a truck to pull a skid of beer up my driveway to my garage be cause it would be waaaay to much work to carry all the cases up my driveway...would you think down on me or would you consider that acceptable creative thinking?
MasterBlaster
TreeHouse Elder
You'll shake the beer up too much.
Might depend on how ya do it. 3 potential pulley positions.
Load, Anchor or Truck.
Placing pulley on load, and line to anchor and truck, has a potential for 2/1 power.
Placing pulley on anchor, and line to load and truck gives no MA, 1/1 potential, but double loads anchor pulley sits on.
Placing the pulley on the truck and line connects to other 2 positions of load and anchor has a 1/2 potential, or half power, but beer would travel to your house at twice the speed of the truck.
Or something like that
:alien:
Load, Anchor or Truck.
Placing pulley on load, and line to anchor and truck, has a potential for 2/1 power.
Placing pulley on anchor, and line to load and truck gives no MA, 1/1 potential, but double loads anchor pulley sits on.
Placing the pulley on the truck and line connects to other 2 positions of load and anchor has a 1/2 potential, or half power, but beer would travel to your house at twice the speed of the truck.
Or something like that
:alien:
Kneejerk Bombas
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Dbeck, if you were pulling beer up your driveway with a rope and a truck, I'd think nothing of it. I'd just shake my head and start thinking of ways to get invited over.
If, on the other hand, a commercial beer delivery service pulled their loads around with ropes and trucks...
See the difference?
