Side work

[1I'dJak]

buzz jobs are everyone's right...some jobs don't need a whole crew or the owners can't pay that much...nothin wrong with keepin the cash economy going...government doesn't need its hand on every little transaction...that's part of the reason why i've got into this occupation.... i've done it for cash, for rent, for fish, prawns and moosemeat... on the weekend what i do is my own bidness...its also how i plan to get my own show going...as long as the work is good and noone gets hurt...give'r snot

 

[Trignog]

If my tax dollars went to pay for universal health care I wouldn't pay taxes either. (As in Canadia) I pay for my health insuranse not yours.

 

[Tree Wizard]

"if my guys ever do a side job with my equipment w/o my consent. they are fired on the spot. that's borderline stealing!"

I agree with John. However, I would say it is stealing. Are they buying fuel, doing repairs, replacing equipment they break? What about getting injured? Do they come in Monday and say, 'Oh by the way, I got hurt doing a sidejob and my personal insurance will take care of it.' Or do they just happen to get injured Monday morning on the job so the Company Workman's Comp takes care of it. (Been there on that one about 12 yrs ago)

Everyone that works for us knows that side jobbing with company equipment will get them fired, side jobbing (ie getting paid) with their own equipment will get them suspended.

 

[userdude]

I brought this topic up while talking to a friend of mine who owns an upscale tree care business here in Atl. He doesn't mind the small fish getting the small jobs. Most of his clientele are repeat and refferals and the 'buzzards' are, in effect, weeding out the smaller jobs, keeping these customers from bothering him.
I guess if you're established and doing good business and have months worth of work orders you don't sweat it as bad.

 

[kayakvt]

My first climbing job the boss hooked us up... He insisted that we carry liability ins. if we were getting weekend work, but he helped us find good ins and even loaned me money to pay my first month... We was a high end company that charged good money for good work and if he quoted some work for someone who just couldn't/wouldn't pay that much, he'd give them my number and tell them to give me a call... He said he'd rather see me get the money and see the work done well than see it go to a hack and get, well, hacked... We had to have all our own gear for it, but again, he helped us out... The first day I passed his climbing test, he gave me a saddle to keep, when I started doing weekend work he gave me an old bull rope that he didn't use any more... Basically hooked me up pretty well... U used to pick up an easy 1000-1500 or so a month on those jobs...

Unfortunatly he moved, or I'd probably still be working for him... Went into straight up nursery operations...

 

[TreeLady]

if my guys ever do a side job with my equipment w/o my consent. they are fired on the spot. that's borderline stealing!

There is no borderline, it is stealing. We are a small company and we have put everything into our business. If one of our guys did that and had an accident...let's say a rope through our new Vermeer BC1400 chipper or was rigging from the bucket and messed it up, or worse hurt someone... we could go under and lose everything we have worked so hard for years to build. You guys who work for big companies and think buzz jobs are so great should remember not everyone has deep pockets, and what your recommending is illegal.

We give our guys extra $$ for the jobs they bring in. If they are doing any side jobs, it's not with our stuff...we check the mileage and the hours.

Just think about it. You want to go out on your own someday...would you like someone to use your stuff without permission??

 

[userdude]

One commonality most side jobbers share is they don't have enough intelligence to make it in business for themselves. They prey on people with similar limitations. These people and their trees are the victims.
Fortunately most side jobber's personal limitations impose ceilings on their financial success and usually they end up flipping burgers!

There you go generalizing...same thing you preach against in the 'bucket baby' thread.
Legit tree co.'s do that same type of crappy work. Afterall, the customer is the boss. If they want those trees topped, then top them. Or, you could preach to them about how harmful topping is and not get the job. Of course, that's a whole other topic.

 

[mike385]

I am not an arborist, never said I was one to anyone that I did side work for. I am a logger with felling ability. People have asked me to trim trees, I tell them find someone who can. All I can tell them is I know one cut and that is at the bottom of the tree. And yes, I have insurance and I pay taxes. But this is still a sideline.
mike

 

[Trignog]

Really Tree co.? 20 years and never seen someone do good side work?

Maybe it's cause good work doesn't catch you eye like bad work does.

 

[clearance]

Not only is it stealing but most of these yahoos are doing sub standard work, no insurance, no taxes, no business license, climbing with spikes to trim, topping, etc.

A good portion of the bad rap arborist are getting today is generated by the sub-standard practices and ethics of the side jobber.

One commonality most side jobbers share is they don't have enough intelligence to make it in business for themselves. They prey on people with similar limitations. These people and their trees are the victims.

Fortunately most side jobber's personal limitations impose ceilings on their financial success and usually they end up flipping burgers.

In my 20 years of tree work I've never see a side jobber that isn't a bigger threat to the trees and their owners than they are to legitimate tree companies.

Attached photo is of a side jobbers work. It's obivious the customer saved big bucks on their tree budget and got some free firewood to boot!

Hahaha, unless you are a tree!

OK, rat, let me ask you something, how about when you do "legitimate" tree work and someone pays you in cash, do you always report every cent to Uncle Sam? Regardless of what you have to say, I am sure you don't, so you are doing "side" jobs in regards to being on the books, being legitimate, and so on. In others words a hip-O-crit.

 

[jmack]

ct

Oh, and buy the way as far as N.A.R.C.S, I am getting darn close to ratting out insuransless bastards that take deposits and perform deplorable work with out an arborist licence.

Here in ct you need to be licensed to do anything but take downs, I worked damn hard to get that license and take pride in my work. I don't appreciate hacks making us all look bad.
It's not a money thing.

oh yeah except in ct

 

[jmack]

Not only is it stealing but most of these yahoos are doing sub standard work, no insurance, no taxes, no business license, climbing with spikes to trim, topping, etc.

A good portion of the bad rap arborist are getting today is generated by the sub-standard practices and ethics of the side jobber.

One commonality most side jobbers share is they don't have enough intelligence to make it in business for themselves. They prey on people with similar limitations. These people and their trees are the victims.

Fortunately most side jobber's personal limitations impose ceilings on their financial success and usually they end up flipping burgers.

In my 20 years of tree work I've never see a side jobber that isn't a bigger threat to the trees and their owners than they are to legitimate tree companies.

Attached photo is of a side jobbers work. It's obivious the customer saved big bucks on their tree budget and got some free firewood to boot!

Hahaha, unless you are a tree!

i got one went out to price prunes on two sweet hickorys, seen them just going out to have a meeting with the clients, got there and both hickorys are down i say what happened when they were at work the line clearance dudes took the trees down and sold the wood to next door neighbor! nice!

 

[antigrassguy]

If your going to do side jobs, start a secondary business, take some pride in what and how you do it. Get the insurance, license if required, pay the taxes. Be ligit and you wont have to worry about whos watching, cause somebody always is. If you are involved in line clearance and are doing weekend res work, not a problem. Do the best job you can do for the trees and the customer, whos requests are not always correct. Take the time to help them understand proper tree care and most will know that your not a hack and respect you. Your resume is in the work you leave behind. Good clean job = good rep, crappy job(topping,peals,stubs) = crappy rep. If you under cut your boss on 1 job or take work away, you should be fired. Run a scam operation and it will bite you in the end. Respect yourself and others and take pride in what you do, it pays a whole lot more than a couple bucks in your pocket ever will.

 

[1I'dJak]

so if my buddy or the little old lady next door has some storm damaged hanger am i supposed to say, here's my bosses card!!?? right! i use my own equipment, do the same job if not better cuz i'm not in a rush to get to the next job and you anti buzz jobs say this is stealing! Maybe if i'm out undercutting my employer's work, or its a tiny client base, or taking days off to do my own buzzie...that's no good.... but if its my own time and somebody wants a little job done...and most of them are little cuz its the weekend dammit...then its my right as a free man to do it... just cuz i work for a guy doesn't mean i'm his freakin slave...all the anti guys are obviously the bosses here, rakin' in all the cake! what happens on the down days when there's not much work? Do i demand my boss to pay me wages when there's no work or else? Gimme a break...I've never been mad at opinions on a thread till now!

 

[TreeLady]

i use my own equipment, do the same job if not better cuz i'm not in a rush to get to the next job and you anti buzz jobs say this is stealing!

Misunderstanding here. Earlier someone was talking about making a copy of keys and taking their the bosses equipment out to do side jobs. That is stealing. If you have your own equipment your time is yours and if you want to do tree work, more power to you. That's how we got started. That's probably how alot of people get started. There is nothing wrong with that and I wish you luck.

 

[Dadatwins]

To do tree work in Virginia you need;
A minimum class C contractors state License - $175.00
Without it you get caught (turned in) working and pay $200.00
a day until it is processed.
Minimum 1 Million Liability insurance
1 person owner operator, no employees cost $900.00
Local county business license for each county you work in
Based on declared earnings, from 10k - 100k most charge 10.00
for each license and then you pay taxes on the income for each
county. Under 10k most have no fee.
So for a bit over a grand a year and you can start your own part time tree business. Most employers are not going to be happy that you are doing side work, beware of any work comp claims presented to your current employer, they could be denied based on knowledge of your side business. Not going to get into the debate over paying the fees, insurance and taxes, or going at it cash only and hoping for the best. I have done it both ways, now I pay them and sleep better at night. Good Luck.

 

[userdude]

...all the anti guys are obviously the bosses here, rakin' in all the cake!

Or, maybe they're not 'rakin' in as much cake' as they'd like and gotta blame someone

 

[BlueRidgeMark]

Misunderstanding here. Earlier someone was talking about making a copy of keys and taking their the bosses equipment out to do side jobs. That is stealing. If you have your own equipment your time is yours and if you want to do tree work, more power to you. That's how we got started. That's probably how alot of people get started. There is nothing wrong with that and I wish you luck.

Treelady, I think you have people here who agree with you (I'm one) and you ALSO have some lowlifes who think it's fine to do side jobs with the bosses equipment.

Look back at what TreeCo was blasted for - turning in some employees who were doing side jobs with Asplundh equipment.

Good for TreeCo!


But painting EVERYONE who does side work as a hack?

Bad for TreeCo!

 

[coydog]

I always thought the argument that you could get" hurt doing a side job and not be able to perform at work" was pretty funny, If I want to go skiing or play rugby or whatever that's good american fun, If I want to be a blazing alcoholic and spend my evenings and weekends boozing it up thats fine too as long as I'm not drunk at work, but prune my buddies friends' apple trees on saturday because what my boss pays me to pump out his production work 40 plus hours a week isn't cutting it to pay my bills and feed my kids and somebody sees me ?" well we have a serious lifestyle problem here..."

 

[coydog]

and for the folks here calling people who do side jobs crooks without the proper licensing/insurance,etc. I would ask you, would you be just as eager to call someone in the same boat but lets say in the carpentry or painting trade a crook if they built somebody a deck or helped somebody paint their house on their day off and accepted some cash for it?