Stihl MS290 Problems

[HickoryNick]

Timberpig. I'm right there with you. $300 for a saw is quite a bit of money for me, but for peace of mind and longevity, I weighed the options and decided to go Stihl at a higher price.

At this point I think the bar is toast. Uneven wear on the rails, and the chain can't be doing to good either. Sproket looks like it's wearing fine, but ya never know. It could be cocking the chain off to the side. The bar nuts do get to hot to handle.

I just hope I haven't burnt the clutch out of it in the first couple of months gettting into felling trees and having to finish the job, binding chains or not.

The guys at the dealership I bought it from have been pretty good so far, and are of the same opinion. When the regional sales rep comes around he's going to look at the saw. I told my dealer to tell the sales rep to swap me a 660 Magnum or else I'm going Husky. LOL

 

[Lakeside53]

I think you messed your bar up. Change the bar.... ask the dealer to lend you a used bar just to prove exactly what is wrong.

Don't slip the heck out of a 290 clutch by trying to overpower a bogging saw - you really burn it up you'll melt the surrounding plastic!

 

[HickoryNick]

Lakeside53: Let me start by saying that I'm not trying to be a smart alack.

You said that I messed up the bar. I know I'm not a professional lumberjack, but I know my way around a saw. I'm still willing to to admit that there may be ways to tear up a bar that I'm not aware of. Let me throw at you the ways I know someone can burn up a bar and let me see if there is something I'm missing.

not using bar and chain oil or not enough or used motor oil

using a dull, worn out, improperly sharpened, or otherwise damaged chain and forcing it to saw

forcing it to saw even with a sharp chain

running the chain to tight or too loose

bending the bar and running a chain on a bent bar

poor sprocket maintenance (of course on the MS290, there's no way to grease it)

Torquing the saw in the cut.

I never force a saw except what little you have to when making the final felling cut. Gravity doesn't work there. I keep a watch on the cut to make sure it's not pinching the bar/chain.

I don't know. Maybe the Craftsman is MUCH more forgiving on poor technique than this Stihl. Since I've been using it all my life I never realized I was doing something wrong until I got a different saw. I just can't figure out how I've gotten an Oregon bar to last 10 years going on 11 with 4 chains and a Stihl bar to only last 3 months.

One other thing I forgot to mention. I threw a chain for the first time with the Stihl while limbing. Something I NEVER did with the Craftsman.

You could be right though. I may just not be used to new equipment and have been incidentally putting the whammy on it. I

As far as bogging it down, when it bogged down I let off the fuel, backed it out of the cut, revved it back up and went back in. I just had to do it on every cut several several times in the middle of felling a tree. You know, right when you just can't stop cause its a do or die situation. I don't think I burned the clutch up, I'm just a little pessimistic when something doesn't work right. Chain saw clutches are pretty well bullet proof unless you're an idiot.
:monkey:

 

[spacemule]

Lakeside53: Let me start by saying that I'm not trying to be a smart alack.

You said that I messed up the bar. I know I'm not a professional lumberjack, but I know my way around a saw. I'm still willing to to admit that there may be ways to tear up a bar that I'm not aware of. Let me throw at you the ways I know someone can burn up a bar and let me see if there is something I'm missing.

not using bar and chain oil or not enough or used motor oil

using a dull, worn out, improperly sharpened, or otherwise damaged chain and forcing it to saw

forcing it to saw even with a sharp chain

running the chain to tight or too loose

bending the bar and running a chain on a bent bar

poor sprocket maintenance (of course on the MS290, there's no way to grease it)

Torquing the saw in the cut.

I never force a saw except what little you have to when making the final felling cut. Gravity doesn't work there. I keep a watch on the cut to make sure it's not pinching the bar/chain.

I don't know. Maybe the Craftsman is MUCH more forgiving on poor technique than this Stihl. Since I've been using it all my life I never realized I was doing something wrong until I got a different saw. I just can't figure out how I've gotten an Oregon bar to last 10 years going on 11 with 4 chains and a Stihl bar to only last 3 months.

One other thing I forgot to mention. I threw a chain for the first time with the Stihl while limbing. Something I NEVER did with the Craftsman.

You could be right though. I may just not be used to new equipment and have been incidentally putting the whammy on it. I

As far as bogging it down, when it bogged down I let off the fuel, backed it out of the cut, revved it back up and went back in. I just had to do it on every cut several several times in the middle of felling a tree. You know, right when you just can't stop cause its a do or die situation. I don't think I burned the clutch up, I'm just a little pessimistic when something doesn't work right. Chain saw clutches are pretty well bullet proof unless you're an idiot.
:monkey:

Was the chain loose when it was thrown? Did you get your bar pinched on a small limb making it jump off? If so, you might have damaged the chain which will in turn damage the bar.

 

[Cut4fun]

Bar troubleshooting

Bar troubleshooting by Windsor.
http://www.windsorforestry.com/guides/pdf/BarTroubleshooting.pdf

 

[Lakeside53]

Lakeside53: Let me start by saying that I'm not trying to be a smart alack.

You said that I messed up the bar. I know I'm not a professional lumberjack, but I know my way around a saw. I'm still willing to to admit that there may be ways to tear up a bar that I'm not aware of. Let me throw at you the ways I know someone can burn up a bar and let me see if there is something I'm missing.

not using bar and chain oil or not enough or used motor oil

using a dull, worn out, improperly sharpened, or otherwise damaged chain and forcing it to saw

forcing it to saw even with a sharp chain

running the chain to tight or too loose

bending the bar and running a chain on a bent bar

poor sprocket maintenance (of course on the MS290, there's no way to grease it)

Torquing the saw in the cut.

I never force a saw except what little you have to when making the final felling cut. Gravity doesn't work there. I keep a watch on the cut to make sure it's not pinching the bar/chain.

I don't know. Maybe the Craftsman is MUCH more forgiving on poor technique than this Stihl. Since I've been using it all my life I never realized I was doing something wrong until I got a different saw. I just can't figure out how I've gotten an Oregon bar to last 10 years going on 11 with 4 chains and a Stihl bar to only last 3 months.

One other thing I forgot to mention. I threw a chain for the first time with the Stihl while limbing. Something I NEVER did with the Craftsman.

You could be right though. I may just not be used to new equipment and have been incidentally putting the whammy on it. I

As far as bogging it down, when it bogged down I let off the fuel, backed it out of the cut, revved it back up and went back in. I just had to do it on every cut several several times in the middle of felling a tree. You know, right when you just can't stop cause its a do or die situation. I don't think I burned the clutch up, I'm just a little pessimistic when something doesn't work right. Chain saw clutches are pretty well bullet proof unless you're an idiot.
:monkey:

My comment as not meant to insult.. I mess mine up from time to time, usually by an unexpected bar pinch in cottonwood or similar nasty trees. Stihl bars are as good as any of the other better brands and take the same abuse and suffer the same failures. The 3003 series bars on your 290 are good bars general use and have been made for about 20 years in various forms. I use the ES bars which are solid instead of laminated, but I'm not sure they wear any less. You don't need to grease the sprocket - it's a sealed bearing. If you want to maintain the sproket, blow it out with compressed air each day. I grind and tune these bars from old and/or abused saws every day and they come out just fine. Some get real wide in the slots, but they still work fine... Once in a blue moon I get a bad sprocket, but usually cos they have been cutting railroad ties or beach logs.

Sounds like you have it all figured out in your response.... but trouble shooting a bar/chain problem is pretty easy - if you can pull it over smoothly by hand, and it's getting sufficient oil, it will work in the wood.

If your clutch drum is "blue" or flared on the sides, it's been burned. The problem in the plastic based saws is that bad overheating of the clutch can melt the saw chassis.. and you don't have to be an idiot to do that...

Throwing a chain is a user problem (don't get excited... we've all done it)... It only happens due to incorrect chain tension (too loose) or a major pinch that wrenches the chain clean off the bar. If you banged up your tangs (often happens with a thrown chain), then it will make it hard to fit in your bar groove, but rotating the chain by hand will show if there is any binding. if you BENT a link, even slightly, it will make for a tight rotation and overheating.

Also... I assume by "torquing the saw on the final felling cut" you are twisting the saw to force the tree over... Kind of rough on the saws and bars... particularly those that mount the bars into plastic, and, on the laminated bars. Have I done this? sure... but I try not too, and use a wedge or two... and I'm using solid bars....


Just try another bar and chain and see it all you problems go away, then you can back track to the actual cause.

 

[HickoryNick]

SpaceMule: The chain wasn't loose, you could almost pull the top of the chain out of the groove. IT got pinched in a limb. It must've gotten it pretty good. I checked the chain afterwards, it seemed okay. My problems started well before this incident anyways.

Cut4fun: Nice link. Thanks!

Lakeside53: I know you weren't trying to insult me. I understand what your saying.

There was a bad pinch when I threw the chain. I don't know if you have ever seen an autumn olive bush, but they grow like apple trees. Getting in there to cut them can be right painful.

The chain does move pretty well around the bar, but your right, I'll swap out the bar and chain (or hopefully the dealer will) and we'll see if the problem goes away.

And what I meant about torquing the saw, if you twist the saw even slightly out of being perfectly parallel with the cut, it boggs down and the chain seizes. That's why I thought it was a power problem at first. I know you can really twist one in a cut and put enough sideways pressure on the chain all the way around the bar to bogg one down, but this one does it without intentionally doing so. It's a fight to keep the saw perfect in the cut so it doesn't bog down.

Thanks again for all everyones help. I hate problems like this. The ones that just don't make much sense, but the all become clear later making me often feel like a total stooge....

I'll stop beating a dead horse on this thread. :deadhorse:


When I get the new bar and chain I'll let everyone know what happens!

 

[HickoryNick]

Update!

My dealer sent the saw with the regional sales rep to factory service, which I am assuming is Mid Atlantic. The reason is so they can sink the saw into some wood and figure out the problem. My dealer also said that the factory wants to see the problem first hand so they can keep an eye on quality control.

According to the dealer, the factory guys said that there was a problem with the fuel tank vent, to replace it, and also replace the carburetor for good measure.

The strange part. My dealer also claims that the factory sent the saw back without doing anything and told my dealer to replace the carb and the fuel tank vent. I asked another Stihl dealer if this was a common practice. He said he'd never heard of that happening, and said the factory guys will want to fix it themselves to see if their diagnosis was correct.

So, this makes week 2 of not having my saw, the carburetor is on order and I'm waiting for the dealer to fix it.

Oh yea, and I had that second dealer guy take a look at the saw originally. When he tried to file warranty claim my saw wasn't registered with Stihl online. I asked my dealer to register it and it's still not.

What do yall think?

 

[THALL10326]

My dealer sent the saw with the regional sales rep to factory service, which I am assuming is Mid Atlantic. The reason is so they can sink the saw into some wood and figure out the problem. My dealer also said that the factory wants to see the problem first hand so they can keep an eye on quality control.

According to the dealer, the factory guys said that there was a problem with the fuel tank vent, to replace it, and also replace the carburetor for good measure.

The strange part. My dealer also claims that the factory sent the saw back without doing anything and told my dealer to replace the carb and the fuel tank vent. I asked another Stihl dealer if this was a common practice. He said he'd never heard of that happening, and said the factory guys will want to fix it themselves to see if their diagnosis was correct.

So, this makes week 2 of not having my saw, the carburetor is on order and I'm waiting for the dealer to fix it.

Oh yea, and I had that second dealer guy take a look at the saw originally. When he tried to file warranty claim my saw wasn't registered with Stihl online. I asked my dealer to register it and it's still not.

What do yall think?

I tell you what I think, whoever your dealer is is full of schit and lying his ass off to you, why I don't know. I can tell you if your saw was sent away at all for the problems your having your dealer tant worth a hoot. All he had to do was put on a new bar and chain and give it a try. If it solved the problem job done. If not keep working back to the engine, somewhere the problem would be found and solved. Sounds like all he wants to do is send it out. If he sent that saw to Mid-Atlantic he wouldn't have to go through a rep to do so. He'd put it in a box and ship it, no rep needed. Those guys at Mid-Atlantic I know very well and no way would that saw go to the factory, someone is lying their butt off. Those guys at Mid-Atlantic are pro's, they know saws like the back of their hands. I've dealt with them for years now. If they got their hands on your saw it would have been shipped back to the dealer 100% striaghtened out. There is no way Mid-Atlantic would have sent your saw to Va Beach to have it looked at. The factory doesn't do such repairs like your describing, they build saws and they surely wouldn't be interested in one saw that cuts crooked unless there were 100's of complaints about the same problem, which there isn't for I've got no tech update about it. If your saw actually went to Mid-Atlantic the problem would have been corrected and sent back. No way would it have been sent back to the dealer to be fixed by him with their instructions, thats bull. Someone is giving you a big run around and why is the puzzling part. If I were you I would go to that dealer and say put a new bar and chain on it and lets try it NOW. Don't let that guy give you the run around,get on his butt. As for your saw not being registered there is only one way that could be, it was never registered by the man who sold it to you in the first place. You getting what I call the worst of the worst. Get on their a-- and getter done. Time you stop being patient and start raising hell. If after two weeks and nothing still done its time they hand you your money back or a new saw, one or the other. It takes two days to get parts from Mid-Atlantic so ask your dealer why its taking so long to get a carb for that saw. Time to get tuff my freind.................

 

[coveredinsap]

I tell you what I think, whoever your dealer is is full of schit and lying his ass off to you.....

LOL! I'm glad I didn't have to say that.

Don't let that guy give you the run around,get on his butt.

Glad I didn't have to say that either.

You getting what I call the worst of the worst.

Or that...

Get on their a-- and getter done.

Or that...

Time you stop being patient and start raising hell.

Or that. The fact is, you shouldn't have to put up with any of this BS. You paid good money for the saw, and the dealer should make it right, right then, not later. If that takes a new saw then so be it. It seems like a new bar and chain would be something that even a Home Depot employee would think of, so I fail to see why a Stihl dealer wouldn't have tried it already.

Do yourself a favor. Get your money back and go Husky, or Jonsered, or Shindawa....or any other brand. It doesn't make sense to pay that kind of money and get that lousy a level of customer service. You can do better than that at Home Depot for Christ's sake.

"sending the saw to experts..." LOL! Yeah, that's priceless. Sad to say, it's past time to be pissed.

Flame away, Stihl fanboys.

you could almost pull the top of the chain out of the groove.

By the way, my understanding is that you should be able to just barely pull 3 links entirely out of the guide bar....that is purportedly the proper chain tension. It sounds like you may have yours a little too tight. And maybe when the saw/chain cooled it has bent the bar it was so tight. My $.02 worth

 

[HickoryNick]

Thanks for the advice guys. I know several of the people at the dealer so I hate to be an ass, (and I work in getting my ass chewed a lot where I work over similar stuff) but you're right. I'm tired of screwing around. Time to get it taken care of.

Thanks,
Nick

 

[THALL10326]

Thanks for the advice guys. I know several of the people at the dealer so I hate to be an ass, (and I work in getting my ass chewed a lot where I work over similar stuff) but you're right. I'm tired of screwing around. Time to get it taken care of.

Thanks,
Nick

You don't need to be a ass, just walk in and say lets try a new bar and chain because I need my saw. If they refuse to do that then you pretty well know something isn't right. I can tell ya right now from what all you have been told something isn't right bigtime. Time you got what you paid for so its ok to be, how shall I say it, alittle bit of a I WANT MY DAMN SAW kinda guy................

 

[HickoryNick]

You don't need to be a ass, just walk in and say lets try a new bar and chain because I need my saw. If they refuse to do that then you pretty well know something isn't right. I can tell ya right now from what all you have been told something isn't right bigtime. Time you got what you paid for so its ok to be, how shall I say it, alittle bit of a I WANT MY DAMN SAW kinda guy................

True. Course I'm not the type to go in all hell and damnation unless it's buying a new car at a dealership. You know you are going to get burnt one way or the other, so you might as well make the sales person know it.

I went out and talked to the guys again, unforuntalely the main guy who would do the refund wasn't there. They said they sent it to Hillsborough (NC)for repair. They also said that it didn't seem right to them either that they didn't replace the carb while it was there.

We'll see what happens Monday. I'm going to shoot for money back. I don't want another saw from them. I'll get it elsewhere. I just find it so funny that they act so nice and that they have always seemed to want to get the problem fixed.

Nick

 

[THALL10326]

True. Course I'm not the type to go in all hell and damnation unless it's buying a new car at a dealership. You know you are going to get burnt one way or the other, so you might as well make the sales person know it.

I went out and talked to the guys again, unforuntalely the main guy who would do the refund wasn't there. They said they sent it to Hillsborough (NC)for repair. They also said that it didn't seem right to them either that they didn't replace the carb while it was there.

We'll see what happens Monday. I'm going to shoot for money back. I don't want another saw from them. I'll get it elsewhere. I just find it so funny that they act so nice and that they have always seemed to want to get the problem fixed.

Nick

So its gone back where it came from, man this is getting better all the time. Lets see. Now listen to me now so you get the full picture of what all they have told you. I'm only doing this because I'm on your side so stay with him here. You took the saw back to the dealer. They can't fix it. They send it to Mid-Atlantic. Mid-Atlantic send it to VA Beach to for quality purposes. Va Beach sends it back to Mid-Atlantic. They don't fix it. Mid-Atlantic sends it back to your dealer and tells him what to do. Now you been waiting 2 weeks for your saw. You go today to get it and your told its been sent back to Mid-Atlantic for repair. This is getting unreal, totally un friggin real. They are giving you the biggest run around I've ever seen. I'm now wondering if maybe they have lost your saw. I'm gonna pm you and tell you how to reslove this issue once and for all........................

 

[HickoryNick]

The End (Or is it?)

So its gone back where it came from, man this is getting better all the time. Lets see. Now listen to me now so you get the full picture of what all they have told you. I'm only doing this because I'm on your side so stay with him here. You took the saw back to the dealer. They can't fix it. They send it to Mid-Atlantic. Mid-Atlantic send it to VA Beach to for quality purposes. Va Beach sends it back to Mid-Atlantic. They don't fix it. Mid-Atlantic sends it back to your dealer and tells him what to do. Now you been waiting 2 weeks for your saw. You go today to get it and your told its been sent back to Mid-Atlantic for repair. This is getting unreal, totally un friggin real. They are giving you the biggest run around I've ever seen. I'm now wondering if maybe they have lost your saw. I'm gonna pm you and tell you how to reslove this issue once and for all........................

Sorry, my bad. They didn't send it out again, they just confirmed that they sent it to Hillsborough (Mid-Atlantic) originally via their regional sales rep. I called mid-atlantic, they couldn't seem to find anything about the saw being registered and couldn't track it, but the guy at Mid-Atlantic told me that they don't repair, that they just look at the saw test it, and then the dealerships do the actually repair work. He said they take care of six states and couldn't handle the repairs. Still odd to me. With that I believe the dealer was telling the truth about them not repairing it. Something must've changed at mid-atlantic. Probably like every other company in the world, they are finding ways to streamline and cut costs. It takes a lot less people to test saws than repair them I suppose.


End Game

Anyways, so here's how it unfolds. I talked to the dealer today, and he asked me to wait for the repair to happen then test the saw and if it's still got a problem that they would repair or refund. I agreed, but then I got to thinking about the wear and tear on the motor and clutch from the problems I've been having. So I went back out and talked to him again and explained my concerns. I told him I'd rather just get a refund. He called the sales rep to see if they'd take it back, the answer was no, but the sales rep did want HIM to take it and try it in some wood.

We threw the saw in his truck, and we came to my place and tried it in the infamous poplar stump. On the way I thanked him for coming, and he said it was nothing, he wanted me to be happy with my saw. We got there and he got it in the wood 1 inch and the chain stopped. He took it out, revved it up again, went back in, same thing... This is with a new fuel tank vent and carb. I asked him about the bar and chain, he said that mid-atlantic looked at it and found nothing wrong with it saying that the bar, despite the paint chipping away, wasn't overheated. We got back in his truck and I told him that it was good to to see that I wasn't crazy. He said he never thought that about me cause he knows my family. I told him he obviously didn't know a lot of them

Final Resolution

He said he was pretty peeved and if his sales rep didn't take care of it then he would go above his head and make sure I'm taken care of. He is also a Husqvarna dealer and has been doing Husqvarna longer than Stihl.

I still don't know what is wrong with the saw, but at this point, I don't care...If I do find out I'll let everyone know.

About the Dealer

So now I have a new dilemma. Husqvarna, or Stihl???? If I got back with Stihl I may upgrade to a 310 or 390 (if I have the cash) and if it's a Husqvarna, I have no frigging clue what I'll go with. I'm trying to not blow more than $400but I need a rugged saw. I"m cutting enough firewood for two households. Right now I'm 2 years behind on wood (no seasoned left, just wet)

Square one. :help:

Hickory Nick

 

[THALL10326]

Sorry, my bad. They didn't send it out again, they just confirmed that they sent it to Hillsborough (Mid-Atlantic) originally via their regional sales rep. I called mid-atlantic, they couldn't seem to find anything about the saw being registered and couldn't track it, but the guy at Mid-Atlantic told me that they don't repair, that they just look at the saw test it, and then the dealerships do the actually repair work. He said they take care of six states and couldn't handle the repairs. Still odd to me. With that I believe the dealer was telling the truth about them not repairing it. Something must've changed at mid-atlantic. Probably like every other company in the world, they are finding ways to streamline and cut costs. It takes a lot less people to test saws than repair them I suppose.


End Game

Anyways, so here's how it unfolds. I talked to the dealer today, and he asked me to wait for the repair to happen then test the saw and if it's still got a problem that they would repair or refund. I agreed, but then I got to thinking about the wear and tear on the motor and clutch from the problems I've been having. So I went back out and talked to him again and explained my concerns. I told him I'd rather just get a refund. He called the sales rep to see if they'd take it back, the answer was no, but the sales rep did want HIM to take it and try it in some wood.

We threw the saw in his truck, and we came to my place and tried it in the infamous poplar stump. On the way I thanked him for coming, and he said it was nothing, he wanted me to be happy with my saw. We got there and he got it in the wood 1 inch and the chain stopped. He took it out, revved it up again, went back in, same thing... This is with a new fuel tank vent and carb. I asked him about the bar and chain, he said that mid-atlantic looked at it and found nothing wrong with it saying that the bar, despite the paint chipping away, wasn't overheated. We got back in his truck and I told him that it was good to to see that I wasn't crazy. He said he never thought that about me cause he knows my family. I told him he obviously didn't know a lot of them

Final Resolution

He said he was pretty peeved and if his sales rep didn't take care of it then he would go above his head and make sure I'm taken care of. He is also a Husqvarna dealer and has been doing Husqvarna longer than Stihl.

I still don't know what is wrong with the saw, but at this point, I don't care...If I do find out I'll let everyone know.

About the Dealer

So now I have a new dilemma. Husqvarna, or Stihl???? If I got back with Stihl I may upgrade to a 310 or 390 (if I have the cash) and if it's a Husqvarna, I have no frigging clue what I'll go with. I'm trying to not blow more than $400but I need a rugged saw. I"m cutting enough firewood for two households. Right now I'm 2 years behind on wood (no seasoned left, just wet)

Square one. :help:

Hickory Nick

Still don't sound right. I shall call their sales rep tomorrow myself since he is my sales rep too. This should get interesting. I'll give ya a heads up tomorrow when I find out what the deal is. Hang tight...

 

[HickoryNick]

Still don't sound right. I shall call their sales rep tomorrow myself since he is my sales rep too. This should get interesting. I'll give ya a heads up tomorrow when I find out what the deal is. Hang tight...

That would be cool. Please don't get them in trouble unless they deserve it They have done my family pretty good over the years, this is the first real problem we've had with them.

 

[THALL10326]

That would be cool. Please don't get them in trouble unless they deserve it They have done my family pretty good over the years, this is the first real problem we've had with them.

No worry, I just want you to get your problem fixed. Something don't sound right so lets go to the horses mouth. I won't get anyone in trouble, relax..

 

[carvinmark]

The bar sounds pretty good right now

Diesel JD, the bar stays pretty clean at the tip. It's the bar all the way down the length that's getting pretty hot. The paint is nice and brown up and down both sides of the bar, top and bottom. I'm thinking it's the bar and chain, but I was just wanting to make sure I wasn't doing anything wrong or to see if anyone else has heard of a problem with Stihl bars and chains from the factory?

Is your bar getting enough oil?

 

[HickoryNick]

Is your bar getting enough oil?

Yup. I adjusted it all the way up. It puts off a nice mist all the way around at full RPM.