the all aussie dribble thread!

[Rudolf73]

I remember the days when we used shim stock to tighten up big end bearings - works pretty good in a pinch.

Oh and I think this all aussie thread is a great idea and is going well - we haven't started any big arguments and are solving day to day problems along the way. Good stuff :msp_thumbup:

 

[husq2100]

LSD is just a cheap solution to poor suspension design...............

 

[tdi-rick]

LSD is just a cheap solution to poor suspension design...............

opcorn:

 

[husq2100]

speaking of oils Rick, what amount do they play on the running engine temp?

 

[tdi-rick]

Old wives tales reckoned good syn oils ran a touch cooler/better heat transfer but I've never noticed and if the t/stats are ok and coolers correctly sized you shouldn't see any difference anyway.
Having said that a bloke I trust and respect greatly that has logged many, many hours and hundreds of thousands of km logging data from the trucking industry saw lowered gearbox and diff temps running the syn oils from Castrol and Mobil here, (data from across entire fleets) and I've seen data from the US showing a similar thing from some premium mineral oils too. (Lubrication Engineers diff oils and Texaco's borate ester additised diff oils)

Way, way back when I was able to dyno engine oils there was definitely a power advantage with good synthetic oils.
The other thing that a mate found on the dyno was that the race spec mineral oils 'fell over' at relatively low oil temps (approx. 105-115*C) whereas your syns while thinning as per their viscosity index number didn't actually collapse.

 

[AUSSIE1]

LSD is just a cheap solution to poor suspension design...............

Yep, but not the original reason for their existence.

 

[MCW]

LSD is just a cheap solution to poor suspension design...............

Actually Serg LSD makes many things bareable.

Oh, you're talking diffs...

My bad...

Although a big fan of LSD's a number of the little hothouse pommy made kit cars that go like rockets are running open diffs with no issues. Maybe because they are light, well balanced, and don't tend to have masses of grunt, just an awesome power to weight ratio. Then you have karts though with no diff at all

 

[husq2100]

yep, and you pretty much need to be twin locked on a 4wd if running 32's.....simply becasue of all the wank factor guys that run 35's and bigger all the time and dig the ruts out so bloody deep. the amount of times Ive come across a simple hill climb that could be walked up in an old series landrover with bugger all wheel travel, now made nearly impossible because of the big tyre gang........

 

[MCW]

yep, and you pretty much need to be twin locked on a 4wd if running 32's.....simply becasue of all the wank factor guys that run 35's and bigger all the time and dig the ruts out so bloody deep. the amount of times Ive come across a simple hill climb that could be walked up in an old series landrover with bugger all wheel travel, now made nearly impossible because of the big tyre gang........

Can't say I'm surprised Serg. My mate who was in the SAS for years but a driver in Afghaniland said they got anywhere with stock setups on their Landies. Those guys with large tyres are usually compensating for a lack of driving skill. Like Al, he has big tyres...

 

[husq2100]

big tyres certainly have there place....but 90% of the guys running around here in hilux/landcrusiers and nissans run at a bare minimum 33's, 35 being the most common....and their driving style is usually like homer simpson: 3rd low,floor it and hope...the more mud and dirt slung up the better....

I have a solution for this but will be a couple of years before it comes to light....

 

[Terry Syd]

Rick, I had read the same thing about mineral oils, that they hit a wall around the temps you described. That's why sythentics are so desireable for use in turbocharged engines. The temps in the housing are over those thresholds, so the oil starts breaking down rather quickly. Worst yet is shuting the engine off without letting the turbine cool down. The heatsoak from the turbine into the bearing housing cooks the oil and causes coking inside the housing.

I like an LSD for the stability it provides while driving. The uniform push on both rear wheels keeps the vehicle straighter than the searching of an open 4WD system.

I don't do any off road gymnastics, however I do want a drive system that will assist me to get out of off road situations - like carrying the load of wood I had through the switchbacks and up and out of the ravine I was in yesterday. The LSD is all I need, although I do need to shim it a bit tighter. The torque wrench on the rear lug nut test should indicate around 120 ft/bs to break it loose and mine are down to 90 ft/lbs.

 

[AUSSIE1]

yep, and you pretty much need to be twin locked on a 4wd if running 32's.....simply becasue of all the wank factor guys that run 35's and bigger all the time and dig the ruts out so bloody deep. the amount of times Ive come across a simple hill climb that could be walked up in an old series landrover with bugger all wheel travel, now made nearly impossible because of the big tyre gang........

Can't say I'm surprised Serg. My mate who was in the SAS for years but a driver in Afghaniland said they got anywhere with stock setups on their Landies. Those guys with large tyres are usually compensating for a lack of driving skill. Like Al, he has big tyres...

big tyres certainly have there place....but 90% of the guys running around here in hilux/landcrusiers and nissans run at a bare minimum 33's, 35 being the most common....and their driving style is usually like homer simpson: 3rd low,floor it and hope...the more mud and dirt slung up the better....

I have a solution for this but will be a couple of years before it comes to light....

Hahaha.....what a load of garbage from you two, lol! :hmm3grin2orange:

Don't blame others cause you need twin lockers. I don't need twins. :hmm3grin2orange:

Of course a landy would do ok in Afgany. It's flat and dry! :hmm3grin2orange:

That extra footprint would do nothing for extra traction! Your funny Serg! :hmm3grin2orange:

Stop making everyone else at fault cause your stuck with a boring Landy! :hmm3grin2orange:

 

[husq2100]

more often than not, a larger tyre, whilst taller and that I agree with, are stupidly wide....offering a lot more rolling resistance. I dont NEED twin lockers but they are handy, just like my mate, he doesnt NEED rear steering on his 4wd but it does make it very VERY capable...:msp_sneaky:

Ps there is nothing boring about a landy.....something new goes wrong with it every week....its rather interesting

 

[husq2100]

Rick, I had read the same thing about mineral oils, that they hit a wall around the temps you described. That's why sythentics are so desireable for use in turbocharged engines. The temps in the housing are over those thresholds, so the oil starts breaking down rather quickly. Worst yet is shuting the engine off without letting the turbine cool down. The heatsoak from the turbine into the bearing housing cooks the oil and causes coking inside the housing.

I like an LSD for the stability it provides while driving. The uniform push on both rear wheels keeps the vehicle straighter than the searching of an open 4WD system.

I don't do any off road gymnastics, however I do want a drive system that will assist me to get out of off road situations - like carrying the load of wood I had through the switchbacks and up and out of the ravine I was in yesterday. The LSD is all I need, although I do need to shim it a bit tighter. The torque wrench on the rear lug nut test should indicate around 120 ft/bs to break it loose and mine are down to 90 ft/lbs.

Terry I know you are a very clued on guy, and I get where you are coming from with the LSD....But a Hilux is not a good example. Not having a dig, but the suspension on those is pretty poor. Im not just talking about wheel travel. A suspensions primary requirement is to apply power to the ground smoothly and apply braking safetly....there are alot of things going on. The hilux has conflicting front and rear suspenion...its about balance of the entire set up - front to rear, Anti-squat and anti-dive, Roll center heights, vehicle roll axis, COG etc etc this is one thing LR managed to get pretty good for a production vehilce... their first Range Rover being the best as they were purpose designed all other rovers since then have been derived from it with some comprimise.

Coil Nissans are ok and the 80 series crusies ok..IMO the nissan front end is to bound up (due to a large seperation of the front axle radius arm bushes), their control arms to short and the rear set up is ok but I dont like how the roll center is lower in the rear than the front.

a good LSD or manual difflock is defintly a good thing, but to me proper suspension design and balance more important....I know which is the easier cheaper solution though

 

[Terry Syd]

I've got one of the early 1991 4 door, 2WD utes. The reason my wife likes it is because it handles so well (I've replaced a few bushings). It gets great diesel (and biodiesel, vegetable oil, ATF, used motor oil, Jet A) fuel economy. I don't have a lift kit in it, but the bigger 215/75R/15 tyres in the back (with 4.56 diff) did require a bit more pre-load on the torsion bars in front to keep it balanced. Suspension is good, nothing fancy, just oversize Monroes.

I did research on different brake pads, shoes and drums and sometimes the wife will hit the brakes a bit too hard and end up hanging in the seat harness.

It's a good little knock about vehicle that I can throw wood, dead goats or a load of bricks in the back. It's not a rock crawler, it's a utility truck that has its fair share of dents and scratches. - I usually wash it once a year before rego.

 

[husq2100]

If it works for you thats great, that is all that is important...traction is a wonderful and complex thing :msp_smile:

 

[husq2100]

here is a fairly well balanced road car:

‪BMW 2002 Slalom Bure‬‏ - YouTube

 

[AUSSIE1]

more often than not, a larger tyre, whilst taller and that I agree with, are stupidly wide....offering a lot more rolling resistance. I dont NEED twin lockers but they are handy, just like my mate, he doesnt NEED rear steering on his 4wd but it does make it very VERY capable...:msp_sneaky:

Ps there is nothing boring about a landy.....something new goes wrong with it every week....its rather interesting

When ever there has been any debate about Nissans and Landy's etc, you have been the one to bring it up. If it's that difficult owning/justifying owning one, get rid of it. Don't be a pain to others about your grief.

What's stupidly wide for you, isn't for others. As hard as it is for you to understand, it doesn't make you right and others wrong. Learn to live with that as others do. It aint hard Serg. Trying to offend others hurts yourself more than it hurts others and is a sign of a little man (or is that little manhood?). Rolling resistance isn't anywhere as much of a concern in an offroad environment as it is on the blacktop so the comment basically has no relevance. Just like you with twin lockers, your mate with rear stearing it's the same with taller tyres.

 

[husq2100]

When ever there has been any debate about Nissans and Landy's etc, you have been the one to bring it up. If it's that difficult owning/justifying owning one, get rid of it. Don't be a pain to others about your grief.

What's stupidly wide for you, isn't for others. As hard as it is for you to understand, it doesn't make you right and others wrong. Learn to live with that as others do. It aint hard Serg. Trying to offend others hurts yourself more than it hurts others and is a sign of a little man (or is that little manhood?). Rolling resistance isn't anywhere as much of a concern in an offroad environment as it is on the blacktop so the comment basically has no relevance. Just like you with twin lockers, your mate with rear stearing it's the same with taller tyres.

Sorry Al, i wasnt trying to offend anyone. Matt brought you into this jokingly.... I have alway said that Nissan/Toy/Landrovers all have good and bad points none are the best or worst. The Lsd thing was part joke part truth....If you cant see the differences in the different suspenion set ups the manufactures use then the point is lost...many people have driven all over this country of ours on 7.50-16s with great success. I drove all over fraser island for a week on them with 38psi in for the first 3 days....never got stuck and never had to drive like a monkey to get through....big tyres are as much a fassion accersory as an advantage. The vehicles im talking about here spend most of there time on the black top and when they do go off road will further rut out and soft rutted track, leaving stock vehilces bottomed out on their diffs....80% of these tracks are quite easliy drivable in stock 4x4's. Re read, I have said lsd and lockers are good, bigger tyres are good for certain things, but lsd is still an easy fix for a suspension that doesnt work as good as it could and big tyres dont need to be on 80% of the 4x4's that run them....and rolling resistance is shown up more so in softer stuff than high traction....contact patch is a important thing but how it interacts with the vehicle is greater. Just by changing the tyre size, you are changing anti-squat, anti-dive, COG and rollcenters...thats before the spring lift to fit them....that just gets worse...example most cases the AS goes through the roof, which leads to pig rooting on hill climbs and yep, diging out the ruts even further

how many vehicles have done the CREB line on stock size tyres over the years.....it is not getting easier for those that still run them due to the large number of 35+ tyred rigs going up there...

if you think that saying a Range Rover has a better suspension set up stock than a nissan or toyota just an emotion branded thing I think you need to get out of your nissan and start to look a little harder....my comment about the Hilux is due to them having IFS and leaf solid axle rear....and yes like ALL vehicles it is further let down by being built to a cost and packaging so that will comprimise the design and end product.

I joke about the landy as most defend their brand past reality and i know them(LR's) better than alot (rick excluded) but I have had it for 11 years now and its still serving me on a daily basis as a work vehilce....just the same as a Toy or Nissan would have, all with their fair shares of breakages...none are perfect.

 

[tdi-rick]

Rick, I had read the same thing about mineral oils, that they hit a wall around the temps you described. That's why sythentics are so desireable for use in turbocharged engines. The temps in the housing are over those thresholds, so the oil starts breaking down rather quickly. Worst yet is shuting the engine off without letting the turbine cool down. The heatsoak from the turbine into the bearing housing cooks the oil and causes coking inside the housing.
[snip]

Terry, it's no where near as bad a problem as twenty years ago when all mineral oils here were only Group I based.

With modern Group II, II+ and III oils their operating temp range is far greater than ever before, and the Group II+ oils from Chevron/Texaco/Caltex and the Group III oils coming out of Korea rival PAO's in stability and high temp performance and with better solvency (additive miscibility)
They can't quite as well with ultra low temps, but are fine for anything seen on this continent.

Yep, turbines cop a caning temp wise, I've seen over 750*C exhaust gas temps a few times, my self imposed limit is usually 700-720*.

I've heard of mechanics that serviced older Volvo's and Saab's talking of 'turbo turds' coming out of trashed turbo's from lack of oil changes or cheap oil.