Three things wrong with the Holzaforma saws

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There are several reasons I'm willing to buy a Chinese knock off of the older saws even though they are ripping off the OEM. First reason is that the companies don't give a rip about the end user. The greedy %@$$*^#*$ business practices require dealers to prioritize selling new saws instead of property repairing older saws to keep them running. There are exceptions, but the techs at most dealerships flat out suck because the dealership can't afford to pay them what a truely skilled repair tech is worth which brings me to my 2nd point. I don't want electronics in my chainsaw. I cut wood for heat, and a chainsaw or 2 will last me a lifetime. I'm not interested in electronics that fail just due to age causing problems that are difficult to diagnose, especially by the poorly trained, inexperienced techs at the dealership. I want an efficient saw with a simple design and the OEMs no longer offer that option. They yielded to the EPAs demands despite the fact that the US government has no constitutional authority from which to make such regulations. If the OEMs are willing to just roll over, why in the heck would I try to prioritize supporting them with MY business decisions? That's just feeding the cancer that has been eating us from the inside out for the past 50 years or more. 3rd is obviously cost. 4 of my 5 Stihl saws cost me $200 to $250 each ( used ) in good running condition. My 064 cost me $375. I've had them all for several years and now they are getting hard to find on the used market. So, in my price range, I can buy a used newer saw with EPA compliant electronics that will go bad in the next 10 years just due to age, or I can buy a Chinese clone that is likely to give me another 20 years or more. Heck, if I'm willing to stock some spare parts from my Stihl dealership, the saws will likely outlast a new Stihl just because of the ease of repairs.

In short, I'm willing to buy a Chinese saw because the major OEMs have utterly abandoned the portions of the market that most people happen to fall into.
No offense but even points set ups go bad after a wile. There are literally tons of posts of help my saw lost spark. So blaming electronics as a reason not to get a new saw is total bs.
I do agree with they don't want the old saws fixed, but even with quality (I use this term loosely) aftermarket components your over half to nearly being at the cost of a new saw. Thats pathetic.
I use this analogy quite often.... you still drive your model A Ford?
 
I find most of the newest and latest stuff from Stihl and Husqvarna pure garbage period. So that leaves few choices to be able to operate. I got a couple of new Stihl saws two or three years ago and decided the hassle just was not worth the effort. I have bought many OEM replacement parts at extreme prices recently then decided the effort was not justified. I have two 056 that have worked well but finding parts for those things is a challenge. Why does Stihl not make a rebuild kit for my 056s at a realistic price and call it a day of production. They want the old stuff junked so one has to buy new. Holzaforma has filled a need and has so done well. I have been using after market saws for a little more than five years with many complaints. Thanks
 
What do you need, Ted? I have a parts saw 056avs lying around and a complete 056avs that may have a failing coil or carb/delivery issues. I'm leaning towards letting them go for the right trade/offer.
 
By law a manufacturer only has to supply parts for 10 years. Again do you drive the same vehicle you did in the 60's. Technology moves on and the old stuff is mostly left behind. Look at the computer/phone/tablet your typing on. We're not sending telegraphs and smoke signals. Yep auto tune/ m-tronic had issues. They got figured out. Just like fuel injection in the 80's.
 
I'd be petrified. All china has to do is shut it's doors for a month. We'd be dead in the water. But they wont. They worship money as much as we do. Make it here, sell it here or tax the **** out of it.
I guess you’re not concerned or complaining about the price of gas because oil companies “Make it here.”
 
I guess you’re not concerned or complaining about the price of gas because oil companies “Make it here.”
Certainly you recall a time in recent history where said oil companies couldn't give their product away and it all sat out on boats in the ocean for months at a time. And that was at a time when we had a leader that was pro drilling. Now we have a "leader" that is making it his legacy to begin the journey of making oil extinct. Can you really blame the oil companies for being hesitant to open up more wells?

Repeat after me. Elections have consequences. This is one of them.
 
North America needs to cut their ties with china.
We need to treat them like the enemy they are.
Thier end game is global domination,there is no freedom or rights for people in their world.
Cool, $198.14 shipped to my door, all new...all i did was add gas and put the 2 dogs on. Hit on the 3rd pull running on the 4th out the box. Hoping to get fresh cutting videos this weekend in some decent sized oak.







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Where did you find it at that price?
 
I played the *only oem/only American* flute for years and all i found was declining oem quality with ever inflating prices. Hurricane season rolls around i can order briggs generator carbs for about 15 bucks each and 99% of them work as good as oem, i can help alot of people get up and going for far less money than using oem. Briggs push mower carb...60 shipped for oem or 9.00 shipped for aftermarket..both made in china.

People aren't loyal like years ago, they've been played too many times for too many years by being loyal

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Maybe if the CEOs and rich shareholders of the OEM companies didn’t expect to reap their millions in profits by lowering their prices to be competitive. But they won’t, but they’ll spend millions to lobby congress to change import laws to keep their money flowing.
 
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't American saw companies "steal" a bunch of Stihl's tech when WWII hit? I think I recall reading that when WWII hit a bunch of American saw companies took advantage of that and stole Stihl's formerly US-patented "protected" tech in my "Stihl America" book, but I'd have to double check.
You are right. They raided the German patent volts and not just for chainsaws. Can’t really claim the moral high road here. And don’t claim it’s because US was at war with them. China is in a commercial war. Guess what goes around comes around.
 
I find most of the newest and latest stuff from Stihl and Husqvarna pure garbage period. So that leaves few choices to be able to operate. I got a couple of new Stihl saws two or three years ago and decided the hassle just was not worth the effort. I have bought many OEM replacement parts at extreme prices recently then decided the effort was not justified. I have two 056 that have worked well but finding parts for those things is a challenge. Why does Stihl not make a rebuild kit for my 056s at a realistic price and call it a day of production. They want the old stuff junked so one has to buy new. Holzaforma has filled a need and has so done well. I have been using after market saws for a little more than five years with many complaints. Thanks
I meant to add that I have few complaints and very happy with all aspects Thanks
 
By law a manufacturer only has to supply parts for 10 years. Again do you drive the same vehicle you did in the 60's. Technology moves on and the old stuff is mostly left behind. Look at the computer/phone/tablet your typing on. We're not sending telegraphs and smoke signals. Yep auto tune/ m-tronic had issues. They got figured out. Just like fuel injection in the 80's.
I hate to point this out but my daily driver's are a 89 jeep cherokee and a 68' Plymouth fury. I just like them and repairs are pretty strait foward.
I have a hotrod magazine from 1973 where the editor wrote that the cars being built and sold at that time should last generations and it was important to stock up on consumables! Most people have to have new but saving the environment means not buying new . We trash perfectly usable vehicles and tools every day and its not your chainsaw destroying the environment but the giant factories, who are buying back their carbon?
 
I hate to point this out but my daily driver's are a 89 jeep cherokee and a 68' Plymouth fury. I just like them and repairs are pretty strait foward.
I have a hotrod magazine from 1973 where the editor wrote that the cars being built and sold at that time should last generations and it was important to stock up on consumables! Most people have to have new but saving the environment means not buying new . We trash perfectly usable vehicles and tools every day and its not your chainsaw destroying the environment but the giant factories, who are buying back their carbon?
Remember Obama’s cash for clunkers attack on the environment….

and I love factories, the bigger the better….
 
I hate to point this out but my daily driver's are a 89 jeep cherokee and a 68' Plymouth fury. I just like them and repairs are pretty strait foward.
I have a hotrod magazine from 1973 where the editor wrote that the cars being built and sold at that time should last generations and it was important to stock up on consumables! Most people have to have new but saving the environment means not buying new . We trash perfectly usable vehicles and tools every day and its not your chainsaw destroying the environment but the giant factories, who are buying back their carbon?
It’s been proven that driving an older vehicle is better for the environment than producing a new one bc the emissions to make it from raw material to finished product has already dissipated
 
I hate to point this out but my daily driver's are a 89 jeep cherokee and a 68' Plymouth fury. I just like them and repairs are pretty strait foward.
I have a hotrod magazine from 1973 where the editor wrote that the cars being built and sold at that time should last generations and it was important to stock up on consumables! Most people have to have new but saving the environment means not buying new . We trash perfectly usable vehicles and tools every day and its not your chainsaw destroying the environment but the giant factories, who are buying back their carbon?
My newest vehicle is a 2000 with just shy of 300k on it. I also own several vehicles from the 70's. I don't find any of the newer stuff that much harder to work on. The 80-early 90s harnesses were terrible.
 
Don't Husqvarna and Stihl manufacture in China? Why are we holding the high ground while these guys just grab the cash selling inferior rubbish?
Modern saws suck.
 
Don't Husqvarna and Stihl manufacture in China? Why are we holding the high ground while these guys just grab the cash selling inferior rubbish?
Modern saws suck.

I know Stihl has 3 plants in China and Husqvarna has at least one. The Stihl commercials on TV say built in America, but I bought a homeowner grade trimmer and in the manual it said built in America with foreign parts. Most manufacturers have sold us consumers out to China. I don't have any brand loyalty anymore.
 
No offense but even points set ups go bad after a wile. There are literally tons of posts of help my saw lost spark. So blaming electronics as a reason not to get a new saw is total bs.
I do agree with they don't want the old saws fixed, but even with quality (I use this term loosely) aftermarket components your over half to nearly being at the cost of a new saw. Thats pathetic.
I use this analogy quite often.... you still drive your model A Ford?
In my hometown, there is still a Model A being driven around. To your point, yes the ignition system will eventually wear out, but not nearly as fast as the rest of the electronics. I've been working on industrial equipment (molding presses, robotics, assembly equipment) for over 2 decades. In my experience, circuit boards in warm to hot environments last about 10 years. Your experience may be different, but I have literally tens of millions of dollars worth of industrial equipment that forms the basis of my opinion. that None of my Stihl saws are less than 2 decades old. Some of my friends have Stihl saws that are 3 and 4 decades old, and they all still produce a strong spark with a good plug. So, for someone who doesn't rely on a chainsaw for their pay check and wants a saw that will be easy to service for the next few decades, OEM saws are pretty much out of the question, but the cheap Chinese clones are a decent option. Like anything though, if you're buying an old design that simple to work on, expect be prepared to do most of the work yourself.
 
In my hometown, there is still a Model A being driven around. To your point, yes the ignition system will eventually wear out, but not nearly as fast as the rest of the electronics. I've been working on industrial equipment (molding presses, robotics, assembly equipment) for over 2 decades. In my experience, circuit boards in warm to hot environments last about 10 years. Your experience may be different, but I have literally tens of millions of dollars worth of industrial equipment that forms the basis of my opinion. that None of my Stihl saws are less than 2 decades old. Some of my friends have Stihl saws that are 3 and 4 decades old, and they all still produce a strong spark with a good plug. So, for someone who doesn't rely on a chainsaw for their pay check and wants a saw that will be easy to service for the next few decades, OEM saws are pretty much out of the question, but the cheap Chinese clones are a decent option. Like anything though, if you're buying an old design that simple to work on, expect be prepared to do most of the work yourself.
We're just going to have to agree to disagree. Sorry I've been around heavy equipment thats computer controlled that's now in excess of 20 years old and still going strong. Heat, cold, severe vibration, rain, dirt. Sorry, I can't agree with your assessment. I don't rely on saws for a living, but I do rely on them to get the wood that heats my house, and supplements others heating.
 
We're just going to have to agree to disagree. Sorry I've been around heavy equipment thats computer controlled that's now in excess of 20 years old and still going strong. Heat, cold, severe vibration, rain, dirt. Sorry, I can't agree with your assesmant. I don't rely on saws for a living, but I do rely on them to get the wood that heats my house, and supplements others heating.

I'm not even going to weigh in on the heavy equipment debate, but for work, I'll take the new saws every day of the week. The 462R I use at work compared to the old 044 I used to use...more power, lighter, better air filtration...I don't carry a tuning screwdriver in my pocket anymore. My issues with carpal tunnel syndrome have almost gone away since running the newer saw.

I haven't experienced any reliability issues with any of the more recent M-tronic saws...I'll admit they had some teething issues early on, but they are totally figured out by now. Not really that difficult to work on either...it's not the black magic that some make it out to be.
 

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