WTB...Propane induction parts

[ShoerFast]

Moe

Berrys Cams was a field-trip for my high schools auto and ag-shop class. (Watertown )

The first cam I had Berry grind was back in 1979 !

Small world huh?

Berry got hes biggest brake grinding cams for stock cars and NHRA engines, He is one of the grandfathers too camoligy!
Before there was a whole lot of information on how to profile cams for longevity, Berry would weld in nickel inlays to offer some longevity to his wilder grinds!

 

[MOE]

Certainly is a small world. I live near St. Cloud,(45 min from berry) I have had 3 or 4 cams ground there and been happy with every one. Each one did exactly what Bill,(I think) sead it would. Interesting shop, I always drop them off and pick them up in person just to walk through the place.

 

[ShoerFast]

Certainly is a small world. I live near St. Cloud,(45 min from berry) I have had 3 or 4 cams ground there and been happy with every one. Each one did exactly what Bill,(I think) sead it would. Interesting shop, I always drop them off and pick them up in person just to walk through the place.

Too cool!

I don't know what the kids names are?

The first cam I wanted, Berry talked me out of!,,,, With a huge chuckle he said it wouldent fit in the hole!
Berry had the concept down! His question were always geared to what your pulling, and what heads your running, gear ratio, and what you expect the engine to do, gas your going to run. CR , Converter stall speed, intake type of carb , type of exhaust,,,,, and he could sure nail a cam right!

In the early 80's , I leased Walter Jopp's , Ford Dealership in Watertown (15 from Lester, 30 to T.N.T's in St. Cloud!) and ran an auto and saw repair shop and had a Stihl Franchise.

Back then, just about every-other CSB , would flatten a lobe about the same time the valve seals needed to be replaced, if you were in a hurry to put something together, he could hand you a rebuilt chevy cam. A standing joke with Berry was about the people complaining that there milage got worst from a stock cam , after one of his "RV" grinds,,,, the joke was that it's because there driving with there foot in it so far, cause they were just plain fun rides!

I hope that the kids put the same research in and dedication that the Old Man did, but we could be sure that it is a lot harder to market cams now with so many national cam shops.

Glad to hear that the doors are still open!

 

[MOE]

I was in there about a year ago. They seemed pretty busy. At that time they had some blank billet 6 cyl diesel cams they were custom grinding for something,(I was guessing a diesel). I called them a couple months ago with a question on Taurus SHO cams. Once again, they knew exactly what I was talking about and told me they were working on SHO cams for street racers who were turboing them.
There is a engine machine shop next door that does a lot of performance work,(stroker cranks, balancing,etc.) I think it is a close friend or relative that started it. Makes for great one stop shopping.

 

[Mitchell]

Propane woes

hey guys

I could use any advice you can give concerning my 1991 f350 propane converted truck. The engine is a 351. I am at work right now and i can't find the paper with the exact model of impco parts installed.
I believe it says model E on the part that heat exchanges rad water with propane below what I imagine is a hockey puck sized pressure reducing valve. I also remeber reading impco 300 on "I believe" the carboartor.
I understand the truck was converted from the get go [so 1991 parts].

What is happening is as follows. The truck would periodically back fire when starting which took a good 10 seconds of cranking; I was told the long cranking was due to nature of propane? The shotgun sounding backfires blow the air filter and its cover apart over time. Changing the air filter around the impco carb requires removing the 1 inch propane delivery hose. The truck will not start after that. Some sort of safety feature i presume?

the last time I did this I fianlly got it to start after 6 hours screwign around with things. THis time I figured I knew how to get it going again; this post should suffice to answere that... [thankfully I thought better of changing it in the part store parking lot!]
I could actually get it to just start but not idle by pressing the springed "relief button" in middle of the rad water/ propane exchanger.

Thanks for taking the time to read this and offer any suggestions, this truck is my chip truck and I need it going again, yesterday! Im just getting going in the business so I really can't afford to pay mechanics to do work unless I absultly have to.
Scott

 

[MOE]

The button in the center is a purge button. It floods some fuel into the carb/manifold before you crank. It sounds like the fuel valve may not be opening up or the diaphram may have a leak. LP leaves a grease like residue that can build up over time. The vaporizer may need a good cleaning or a new kit.

 

[Mitchell]

thanks

thanks Moe

ill try messing around with it some more, ill let you know what i find. I was hoping that there would be some simple solution that some one like yourself would know about; ha ha oh well. Thing that gets me is it worked well before removing the delivery hose then not at all; I assume there must be a pressure check valve that needs to be reset. Is there a web site you would suggest for instruction on these propane matters?
Scott

 

[ShoerFast]

Mitchell

Another .02 cents worth.

There ate 3 places, and 4 valves that shut the propane off from the engine. A slow to start propane engine has a problem as it should start as fast as a gas engine.

The first place the propane of shut off from is the main fuel valve, either a vacuum operated VFF-30 or an electrical solenoid valve, that shuts the propane liquid down from the engine - the vaporizer.

The vaporizer has a primary (liquid - labyrinth- vapor) valve, a small valve operated by the little diaphragm inside the vaporizer. The secondary valve is as big as your thumb and that regulates the vapor - the mixer (the big hose to the mixer/carb)

The final place the fuel is shut off from is the cone (the thing that lifts as the engine speed increases) everything but an electric solenoid valve is operated by a diaphragm/valve, everything has to be leak free and not sticking.

Sometime they spray the vapor coming off of a refinery stack with anti-freeze (ethalglycal) to cool more propane out of the operation, sometime that anti-freeze gets delivered with the propane, but gums everything up, dish-soap and warm water is the best solvent to clean it.

In a nutshell, propane systems are a cake-walk to TS, you just don't wan't to tell anyone that you can use an electric screw-driver as there are just a lot of screws on everything, but taking things apart dose not mean you need a kit every-time,,,,, in fact it is more rare to need parts or kits just to clean things,,,,,, if you do find something wrong, you will loose the chip-truck till the part gets there, but will still be cheaper then shot-gunning parts at it.

Just being handy with tools, it is hard for me to think that it would take a whole 2 hours to go through everything on the system, twice.

My guess, clean the 2 valves in the vaporizer, under the huge diaphragm there is a tetertoter that activates the big secondary valve. Inside the secondary chamber there is a smaller housing and another lever of sorts that closes the liquid from the vaporise, that is your problem, or the first place I would go, a slow-to-start with back-firing is a lean system, and maybe sometime it just wont start?

 

[ShoerFast]

thanks Moe

ill try messing around with it some more, ill let you know what i find. I was hoping that there would be some simple solution that some one like yourself would know about; ha ha oh well. Thing that gets me is it worked well before removing the delivery hose then not at all; I assume there must be a pressure check valve that needs to be reset. Is there a web site you would suggest for instruction on these propane matters?
Scott

With the lesson, a back-fire could blow the vacuum hose off to a shut-off valve? Disconnect the hose to the vaporizer and crank the engine over, it should blow liquid from the line? (aim the hose away from the truck)

 

[Mitchell]

thanks again

Thanks shoer

Excellent info, I want to go start taking it apart right now but Ill have to wait a couple days untill I have enouph time to set aside as I don't think i will pull it off in a couple hours! The age old balacing act; time or money. I suspect my valve shuts off electronically as there is a lead from the soliniod to the vaporiver. I just found this web site that seems to promise help, perhaps it will be of interest to yourself:
http://franzh.home.texas.net/Diagnostic Guide to Alternative Fuels Preview.pdf
Scott

 

[Mitchell]

propane fix

seems I have my truck running.

For those that are interested or facing similar delima. As near as I can tell it this is what was wrong. Essentially when one removes the air filter from the mixer [or carb], it loosens the part of the mixer that clamps the large diaphram creating a vacume loss potential. Without a sealed unit the mixer cant generate the required vacume to allow propane past the vaporizer unit.

I took shoerfast's advice removed and cleaned everything in the mixer and reassmbled it with a silicon gasket maker for good measure. Due to lack of access to tighten 3 bolts and nuts that go right through the unit, reassmbly on the truck was very difficult. I only have two back on tight; hopefully the gasket maker will compensate! Fired right up however.

I also found out that tired spark plugs or platnim plugs [stay to hot] will cause back fires.