A (sort of) Simple Plan

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I think what makes this such a BIG ISSUE is because it is Stihl . Yes , we all understand that any dealer can and does have bad service at some dealers no matter what brand name they are or sell . BUT Stihl claims to be big on service and one can only buy from dealers , no on line sales ect ...ect.... The whole ideal on the buy only from dealers and no net sales of for SERVICE , great ,but when the Stihl dealers dont have the service thats what makes it a big deal . The whole idea behind the service thing is no better than any other dealer , some good ..... some bad. So whats the big deal with Stihl service over any other dealer ? NOTHING . they dont have one . now if you could walk into ANY Stihl dealer and get the service that they say they have and know your going to get it ,well then Stihl has something then . But they dont have that. Thus is why such a big deal about Stihl dealers. They claim top service but as pointed out here on this thread it just dont happen. I have been to 3 Stihl dealers ........... i didnt get that Stihl service that everybody talks so highly about. Unlucky ? maybe . Stihl service is not what is claim ? seems to me thats what the issue has been in my state. Are Stihl chainsaw any good ? I dont know ...........i couldnt get past there service to buy one. ( let alone the 3 I wanted )
 
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Your dealer is an idiot, and should never have let that saw go out the door when considering the intended use

There were more than a few posts that attempted to convey the above idea. I didn't respond at first, but since that appears to be a recurring theme here, I'll give my opinion.

No offense, but I'm not buying it. We're talking cedar here. If Stihl is such a great chainsaw maker, then a $500 64cc Stihl, no matter what it's intended 'market', should be able to hang with a 3-year-old $150 45cc Homelite, (and a $350 55cc Husky). The Stihl couldn't. That leads me to several conclusions. Either the Stihl is highly overpriced, highly overrated, resting on past laurels, or the saws are simply just plain not all they're cracked up to be (no pun intended).

That can be the only conclusion as to why a 45cc Homelite can put a $500 Stihl to shame when it comes to durability. Either that or the Stihl in question was defective. However, sugar-coating it by saying that the Stihl is not 'made for that purpose' simply reminds me of the salesmans excuses.

By the way, for the record, the Stihl salesman I dealt with is the store manager.
 
coveredinsap said:
There were more than a few posts that attempted to convey the above idea. I didn't respond at first, but since that appears to be a recurring theme here, I'll give my opinion.

No offense, but I'm not buying it. We're talking cedar here. If Stihl is such a great chainsaw maker, then a $500 64cc Stihl, no matter what it's intended 'market', should be able to hang with a 3-year-old $150 45cc Homelite, (and a $350 55cc Husky). The Stihl couldn't. That leads me to several conclusions. Either the Stihl is highly overpriced, highly overrated, resting on past laurels, or the saws are simply just plain not all they're cracked up to be (no pun intended).

That can be the only conclusion as to why a 45cc Homelite can put a $500 Stihl to shame when it comes to durability. Either that or the Stihl in question was defective. However, sugar-coating it by saying that the Stihl is not 'made for that purpose' simply reminds me of the salesmans excuses.

By the way, for the record, the Stihl salesman I dealt with is the store manager.

Again, your dealer is an idiot. If he can't set up the 310 so it outcuts a 45cc Homelite box store POS, he doesn't have a clue. Its unfortunate you ran into one of the bad ones right off in your first experience. The 310 isn't 64cc's, thats the 390. Then 310 is only 59cc's. Again, the dealer makes the difference. You will find good and bad in all brands. You found a bad Stihl dealer, and a good Husky dealer. You wouldn't be so pleased with your 455 if the Husky dealer was as useless as the Stihl dealer you dealt with. Don't write off the brand, because their product is good, unfortunately, some of their dealers are not. Others have had similar experiences with Husqvarna. The problem isn't the saw, but how it is set up. If the carb is too lean, it won't have any power. If it is much too rich, same deal. Your dealer here was the issue, not the saw, and you are so upset over his poor handling of the entire deal, that you are letting it cloud your view of the product. People love to bash on dealers for poor service, and blame their problems on the product instead of the dealer. A bad dealer will make a good product look bad. Judge the product by its merits, choose your dealer by his service.
 
The Stihl was a MS390...and there is no getting around that it was a piece of crap. Now whether it was a piece of crap from the factory or it crapped out on the job...it was still crap. About the only thing the dealer did do was refuse to back his piece of crap saw.
Sure it could have been a Husky. But it wasn't. It was a Stihl.

Set up? What needs to be 'set up'? They come with the carb pre-set from the factory, particularly here in California. Only for high elevations do they need to be tuned different than factory settings. I'm at sea level.

It wasn't about cutting performance...the Stihl cut well. It was about durability...with the 45cc Homelite showing no ill effects after doing the same work that people are claiming that the $500 Stihl is not suitable for. That's the real joke here....the little cheapo Homelite put the big bad Stihl to shame in a ripping test of endurance. Deal with it.
 
We are vise verse around here. All our Stihl dealers are great, they cater to mostly Pro Fallers and will do nearly anything to keep business. Husqvarna is pretty bare around here. I am opinionated towards Stihl, just because they have never let me down. Out of 13 years of falling timber I have used a warranty maybe three times. And I buy at least 2 saws a year. I think in timber communities where pro model saws are used - your dealer is more than likley good - many of them are ex-cutters and know how important service and quality is. I am sure Husky's are great, but I won't run them. All my stuff is modded and lasts a long time. During my tenure or falling timber I have worked with propbably 7 different people who have run Husky's and all but one went to Stihl.
I guess I just depends on who you are and what you do and where you do it.
 
coveredinsap said:
The Stihl was a MS390...and there is no getting around that it was a piece of crap. Now whether it was a piece of crap from the factory or it crapped out on the job...it was still crap. About the only thing the dealer did do was refuse to back his piece of crap saw.
Sure it could have been a Husky. But it wasn't. It was a Stihl.

Set up? What needs to be 'set up'? They come with the carb pre-set from the factory, particularly here in California. Only for high elevations do they need to be tuned different than factory settings. I'm at sea level.

It wasn't about cutting performance...the Stihl cut well. It was about durability...with the 45cc Homelite showing no ill effects after doing the same work that people are claiming that the $500 Stihl is not suitable for. That's the real joke here....the little cheapo Homelite put the big bad Stihl to shame in a ripping test of endurance. Deal with it.

Sorry, I thought you said it was a 310.

Anyhow, you got a lemon, and bought a saw that wasn't intended for the use you wanted it for. The problem was the dealer, not the saw. If he wasn't useless, you never would have been sold that saw. If you were to keep running that Homelite in that situation, I have no doubt it would soon die. They aren't built as well as even the admittedly less well built homeowner models like the 290-390. A good dealer would have never sold that saw for that use, and would have taken care of the problem if it was to have arisen as it did. You bought a saw from a bad dealer, and had problems, so now you're going to keep that sour taste in your mouth, instead of waking up to the reality that your dealer was the problem all along. Stihl makes very good saws, but they too have some issues, but a good dealer will make them right. Guess what, Husqvarna has bad dealers and puts out saws that are lemons too. If you had a good dealer, he would have sold you the appropriate saw for your use, set it up correctly, and looked after you in the case of a problem. He should have recognized the fact that you were using it for milling, and the saw was not going to be suitable for that use. He didn't and that is his failure, not the saw's. He also failed to catch the likely pre-existing crack in the oil tank, which again, while it is a factory defect, that does occur and can't always be prevented, but a good dealer can look after you when you do have issues. Your issue here is with a bad dealer, who sold you a model that wasn't suited for that usage. That he happened to sell Stihl shouldn't be a black mark on their saws, or their dealer network in general, it should fall solely on him.

Like TreeSlingr says of his dealer, the ones around here all have to deal with customers who won't take any BS. They know what they want and need, and if he can't provide it, they'll go elsewhere and he will go under. If you had instead been fortunate enough to have found one of these dealers, he would have sold you an appropriate saw for your needs, and backed it up with service to match. You'd be on here praising Stihl instead of pissing and moaning about how bad that one particular dealer was, and washing their product with the same brush. I'm glad that you're happy with your Husqvarna dealer, and your new saw. But by failing to focus on the real issue here (your Stihl dealer) and instead saying since his service was crappy and he sold me the wrong saws for my needs, all Stihls must be bad, you are doing a disservice to the good dealers that do exist, and the products they do make that are much better quality and more suited to your needs.

On the issue of carb seup, just because the carb is set at the factory doesn't mean it is set right. They set it at the factory to meet emissions requirements, not maximum power or engine life. Those fancy little limiter caps are removable and any decent dealer will pop them off, set the carb right, and then pop them back on. Factory settings aren't correct for almost anywhere. The carb needs to be tuned for where it is run, even if that is low elevation in California.
 
coveredinsap said:
That's the real joke here....the little cheapo Homelite put the big bad Stihl to shame in a ripping test of endurance. Deal with it.
Had to do this all, Smile and have a great night.
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Getting beyond the whole "bad dealer/good dealer" discussion, I'm wondering what finally made you go with the Stihl. I went back to reread the original post (which was well written and detailed by the way ) and you said that you researched and eyeballed several brands before settling on the Stihl. Something must have been a little more appealing to you to make the choice you did. What was it? I myself did a bunch of comparison shopping of new saws before my finances dictated a used saw. The one thing that made Stihl stand out to me was that if it says "Stihl" on it then it's a Stihl. After reading a lot of posts on AS I was surprised to learn that many leading saw makers are pulling the "corporate switch" in their saw lines. If I pay extra money for an orange saw, I don't want to find out later that it's lime green and purple on the inside! This is not to bash the poulan, but I want to get what I think I'm paying for. Again, sorry you had such an awful experience but it seems like you suffered an extreme coincidence, getting a lemon saw and a lemon dealer at the same time. Enjoy your Husky-hope it cuts long and hard!
 
You'd be on here praising Stihl instead of pissing and moaning about how bad that one particular dealer was, and washing their product with the same brush.

LOL! That's a good one. The only "pissing and moaning" seems to be coming from the Stihl fans who don't like seeing their favorite saw malaigned...even when it rightly deserves it. I'm simply relating a true account of one lousy dealer and one lousy chainsaw.

And if he (the dealer) wouldn't have sold me the saw, or told me that the saw was "unsuitable" or unwarranted for milling one cedar tree, I would have turned around and left outright . After all, what's softer than cedar...balsa wood? If a $500 64cc saw can't rip cedar than I want nothing to do with it...and I certainly wouldn't even consider purchasing a even more expensive model in it's place simply to find one that the salesman deems 'suitable'.

That'd be like a lumber yard not wanting to sell me a Skil saw when I tell them I need to rip a little lumber with it....and instead try to pimp a big table saw that I don't need on me instead. Rediculous.
 
What made me decide on the MS390 was that it was the biggest bang for the buck...64cc's for $489 + tax. Combine that with Stihl's reputation for quality and it's a no-brainer...or so I thought.

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. :)

And speaking of 'rebadging'...aren't some Stihl products made here in the USA? Why, yes they are!
http://www.stihlusa.com/employment/employment_manufacturing.html
 
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You still fail to realize that the design of that saw is such that it isn't suited for use with a chainsaw mill. The plastic crankcase isn't designed for the type of loading that is experienced in milling. Your dealer should have known this, and steered you away from that model. Milling is incredibly hard on the saw, in terms of the loads placed on the saw's engine, and its structure to hold the mill. The saw you bought was designed for firewood cutting, not milling! It doesn't matter that cedar is soft, it still loads the saw well beyond what is experienced in regular felling and bucking. If you had come here prior to buying the wrong saw on the advice of a dealer who should have known better, you would have been given the same advice, that it wasn't suited for that use, even for one tree. You also would have found out that the Stihl name is applied for varying levels of product design, and that isn't the design that earned the name for them. When used appropriately, they are fine saws, but when used beyond their design capacity, they don't match up. That's like trying to carry 2 tons of bricks in a compact car, you might get lucky and do it, but more likely using it beyond its intended design often results in problems.

Stihl isn't rebadging anything. They designed and built all their saws themselves. Yes, they have a plant in Virginia beach, but it is all Stihl, no one else.

Your unwillingness to buy what you need, and instead make do with something else, gives me the impression you don't know the difference between an MS 390 and an MS 361, and why the latter costs more. If you had done more research before buying, you likely would have discovered that you get more for your money by paying the extra money, and we wouldn't be listening to your story of how your one bad dealer has suddenly made all Stihl saws junk, but your box store Homelite is great because by some miracle it has held together thus far.
 
TimberPig said:
Your unwillingness to buy what you need, and instead make do with something else, gives me the impression you don't know the difference between an MS 390 and an MS 361, and why the latter costs more. If you had done more research before buying, you likely would have discovered that you get more for your money by paying the extra money, and we wouldn't be listening to your story of how your one bad dealer has suddenly made all Stihl saws junk, but your box store Homelite is great because by some miracle it has held together thus far.
That is kind of the Stihl dealers job too dont you think ? His Stihl dealer fail . I would think the dealer should be the PRO at this and that is why a buyer goes to a dealer . Thats just @$$ backwards thinking to say the buyer should of know better or did better research . If the buyer was to do all this as you say then i guess we dont need dealers . I have been in sales all my life and the buyer just needs the $$ and information on what he/she wants . Its the sellers/dealer job to do the rest , thats what they are paid for . HELLO?!
 
coveredinsap said:
What made me decide on the MS390 was that it was the biggest bang for the buck...64cc's for $489 + tax. Combine that with Stihl's reputation for quality and it's a no-brainer...or so I thought.

Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. :)

And speaking of 'rebadging'...aren't some Stihl products made here in the USA? Why, yes they are!
http://www.stihlusa.com/employment/employment_manufacturing.html
Well your Stihl did not work. Then buy an old monster. McCulloch, Homlite, Pioneer, etc. I don't care who makes it but what it was made to do. You don't seem to have much experience with saws. All the american makers/dealers with the experience to help you with a special need are out of business, dead or in Alaska. Stihl, Husky, Dolmar, are all good saws. You picked a saw that was made for light felling and firewood. Sorry.:censored:
 
Rspike said:
That is kind of the Stihl dealers job too dont you think ? His Stihl dealer fail . I would think the dealer should be the PRO at this and that is why a buyer goes to a dealer . Thats just @$$ backwards thinking to say the buyer should of know better or did better research . If the buyer was to do all this as you say then i guess we dont need dealers . I have been in sales all my life and the buyer just needs the $$ and information on what he/she wants . Its the sellers/dealer job to do the rest , thats what they are paid for . HELLO?!

Again, we're back to his dealer failing him. He got a bad dealer, but has instead turned it into an attack on Stihl. Stihl only makes the product, and attempts to ensure their dealers do their part at the point of sale. When the dealer fails in their duty, the dealer is responsible. The dealer recommended the saw, and failed to stand behind it, rather than backing him. That is the dealer's fault, not Stihl's.

If you think it is entirely the dealer's job to hold your hand through buying the saw, then you'd better have a good one. If the consumer doesn't know what he wants or needs, the dealer can only help him make his choice, the consumer is ultimately repsonsible for the choice he makes. If you don't do your duty to know what you're buying, thats your fault not the dealer's.
 
TimberPig said:
Again, we're back to his dealer failing him. He got a bad dealer, but has instead turned it into an attack on Stihl. Stihl only makes the product, and attempts to ensure their dealers do their part at the point of sale. When the dealer fails in their duty, the dealer is responsible. The dealer recommended the saw, and failed to stand behind it, rather than backing him. That is the dealer's fault, not Stihl's.

If you think it is entirely the dealer's job to hold your hand through buying the saw, then you'd better have a good one. If the consumer doesn't know what he wants or needs, the dealer can only help him make his choice, the consumer is ultimately repsonsible for the choice he makes. If you don't do your duty to know what you're buying, thats your fault not the dealer's.
Yes, again we are back to the Stihl dealer I dont think it stoped sence that is the post. Did you read the post ? Have you read the thread ? This is about a Stihl chainsaw and the Stihl dealer . You want to talk about balloons ? Change the subject? talk about the weather maybe ? Your point is in left feild timberpig.
 
Sap, Sorry the Stihl and the dealer didn't work out for you. The dealer sold you a geo metro when you needed a good 3/4 ton truck. I drive 86 miles to my stihl dealer. I pass two Echo STORES and five Stihl STORES in the drive to my DEALER. It's a pain to go that far, and I have to stock up as I only go a few times a year but when I need service they are Top Notch!

Best of luck with your project and husky!
 
Rspike said:
Yes, again we are back to the Stihl dealer I dont think it stoped sence that is the post. Did you read the post ? Have you read the thread ? This is about a Stihl chainsaw and the Stihl dealer . You want to talk about balloons ? Change the subject? talk about the weather maybe ? Your point is in left feild timberpig.

If you don't look out for yourself, no one else will. A dealer is in business to sell saws, not hold your hand through the purchase. They should be able to help you make your selection, but they aren't the ones making the decision, and plenty of them are more than willing to sell you a perfectly good saw that isn't right for your needs.

I actually have read every response to this thread, and authored a few. Have you read every one? Once it was stated that his problem was the dealer, not the saw, coveredinsap, decided instead to turn it and blame it on Stihl in general, instead of his one idiot dealer. The problem here is the dealer didn't look after the customer, and the customer didn't look after himself. Instead of bashing Stihl, for his and his dealer's shortcomings, maybe he should try and solve the problem by informing Stihl of his dissatisfaction with his dealer, and more thoroughly researching his purchases, instead of blindly trusting a reputation and his dealer's advice.
 
TimberPig said:
If you don't look out for yourself, no one else will. A dealer is in business to sell saws, not hold your hand through the purchase. They should be able to help you make your selection, but they aren't the ones making the decision, and plenty of them are more than willing to sell you a perfectly good saw that isn't right for your needs.

I actually have read every response to this thread, and authored a few. Have you read every one? Once it was stated that his problem was the dealer, not the saw, coveredinsap, decided instead to turn it and blame it on Stihl in general, instead of his one idiot dealer. The problem here is the dealer didn't look after the customer, and the customer didn't look after himself. Instead of bashing Stihl, for his and his dealer's shortcomings, maybe he should try and solve the problem by informing Stihl of his dissatisfaction with his dealer, and more thoroughly researching his purchases, instead of blindly trusting a reputation and his dealer's advice.
Timber, it's as simple as this. Dealers are representatives of Stihl. A bad dealer is a bad representative of Stihl, not just a bad dealer. A consumer is repsonsible for what he buys, just as a manufacturer is responsible for its representatives.
 
TimberPig said:
If you don't look out for yourself, no one else will. A dealer is in business to sell saws, not hold your hand through the purchase. They should be able to help you make your selection, but they aren't the ones making the decision, and plenty of them are more than willing to sell you a perfectly good saw that isn't right for your needs.

.
Hey , I agree with you totaly. This is why i do all my own research on everything "I" buy. But thats me . I dont need the dealer for that reasion, sad but true . If i was treated better at my Stihl dealers i would not of has to do so much research and i would of bought 3 Stihl chainsaws . So to sum it all up ..........Everybody "should" do all the research to find there best needs and dont need the dealer for that . So i guess we are headed to non dealers for saw sales . The only thing we need the dealier for if to drop off our broken junk and get it fixed. I dont think Stihl would agree pushing there "Stihl support & service" but if you dont get it then they are not needed.
 
Rspike said:
Hey , I agree with you totaly. This is why i do all my own research on everything "I" buy. But thats me . I dont need the dealer for that reasion, sad but true . If i was treated better at my Stihl dealers i would not of has to do so much research and i would of bought 3 Stihl chainsaws . So to sum it all up ..........Everybody "should" do all the research to find there best needs and dont need the dealer for that . So i guess we are headed to non dealers for saw sales . The only thing we need the dealier for if to drop off our broken junk and get it fixed. I dont think Stihl would agree pushing there "Stihl support & service" but if you dont get it then they are not needed.

Rspike I gotta ask ya, did you buy your Huskies online and if so why?
 
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