Battle of the Top-Handles /climbing saws

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Thanks Tony,

The saw would see moderate use. Some climbing, and a bit of working around in tighter places. Also, wieght/size would probably make it a good choice to add to a Trail kit when off-roading, camping, hunting. I guess solid reliable performance, over high performance would befitting.
 
Originally posted by Dragoon
....... I guess solid reliable performance, over high performance would be fitting.

I guess that rules out the Husky 335!! (had to take that jab, rbtree..... it was too easy!)
 
speed can be your friend in controlling the swing and fall.

I'm just a greenhorn compared to you pro's. When I read about the speed of cuting a limb, it reminded me of watching a tree removal co. drop a limb on their boom truck. I was on the ground with the "son" pulling on a bull rope, while "dad" was up in the bucket, felling the upper 25' of an oak. When the top fell, in fell straight down and bounced over on the truck, causing great damage. "son" told me he took too much time felling the limb.

You pro's give mesome insight on this. I'm thinking it was'nt the back cut but pobably a different front cut set up was required. Obviously the truck could have been repositioned, but to make a limb or trunk "cast off" from the stump, what is a good hinge? Is this where that additional angle cut comes in, I forget what you call this? Sorry, I'm sure I'm being unclear... info?
 
It is called a jump cut, and is hard to make work reliably. one must have a thorough feel for the wood fiber of a given tree speces, size of limb, time of year, etc etc. this applies to all swing, drop and jump cuts.

a jump cut is thus: Make as deep an undercut as possible, kerf cut only. then go back toward the trunk at least an inch(opposite of normal), and make a very fast top cut. If all goes well, the piece will briefly rest against the lower kerf, then pop out a bit. The main objective is to achieve a flat trajectory, as well as some outward movement if you are lucky.
 
Rich,even though my new 346XP-G is awesome, and fitted with a 16 bar at the moment, I still use my 335 XPT-W with 16 bar for blocking wood up to full bar length. It is just so fast. there is no way a 3400 will even come close. Besides, I need the quick acceleration that the 3400 lacks.

Brian, all my 335's have worked good enough for me. Sure there have been a few problems, but that is what backups are for. And the new one has been dead on perfect for 8 months now!! I am anxiously waiting for the new models. I do wish, however, that Husky had worked out more of the bugs before mass marketing the saw...
 
rbtree

Since you run a 16" bar on your 335 this is cool. You are covering 2 saws with 1 saw. Please don't get me wrong. I don't have the expertise you guys do, that is another reason I'd opt for a slower saw. This is only on a top-handle climbing saw. All other saws I want to run balls-out,as much power as possible. Rich.
 
before mass marketing the saw...

thanks for that info rbtree. so basically , you set up the trajectory with a cut normal to the stem, then come back with a parallel cut an inch above and cut like hell.? I think I can see how this would work.. would be scary in a bucket or strapped to the tree and felling a 20" top. Man you guys don't make enough money... Hey as far as that rushing to market goes, I do know a little about that. Believe me in every field it's not the engineers or designers idea but "marketing". Of course a higher up makes that decision to let the product go. I am a Cad designer for Maytag. I design plastic and sheet metal parts for dishwashers. woohoo, if you would have told me that I would be designing dishwashwashers 20 years ago, you would proably been cut...it pays the bills... There is always pressure to get it out, but a kind of refreshing thing happened about a month ago. We are releasing a new three rack dishwasher in a couple of weeks and everybody envoled is scramling trying to meet the release date. The main Maytag man, (not Old Lonely) came through and looked at us and said basically, y'all don't let this machine go till it's ready. This perspective is what it's gonna take to get the crap out of the consumer market. But it's like they say, yeah right... timberrr.:)
 
WRM- jump cut

You never want to make a jump cut on a vertical limb (over your head). That cut is for horozontal limbs that you want to come straight down, landing flat (hopefully).
 
Very good Safety point TC, something maybe assumed by some of us, but not all.........

Jump cuts take lots of practice, very much timing, still tricky.

Perhaps, a 'drop cut'(?) (weight, aren't they all drop cuts?:D), where you make it drop straight down, and it does not kick back, then have groundies pull it just as it comes off, but timing once again, but can be done, especialy in that 1/2 second that ol'gravity doesn't know that the piece is a free agent (something at rest will tend to stay at rest........)

So undercut as much as possible, just a kerf cut as stated. Then cut into the sides in line with the kerf, eliminating even more fiber(less load on saw on final cut=faster available speed to less load of fibre to cut). Do this sidecutting after bottom cut so bottom cut doesn't start to fail and pinch saw. So, in this order u can walk it closer to failing with less problems of pinching saw on pre-cuts. You want piece to release all at once and drop straight down with nothing releasing last and pulling it back towards tree. It all instantaneously releases, and it will drop straight down, if it hinges at all, it will tend to try to throw in that direction, everything else being equal.

Then come down straight into that cut fast. A fast saw and all the fiber eliminated will maximize this speed, aidng an instantaneous release all at once. You can always slow a saw down by backing off trigger, but not always make it go faster. So with a fast saw, and a lot of fibre removed, you have maximum control of the widest band of speed possible available for guiding and deciding when and how to employ it. Taht speed can help in this instantaneous release, or in hinging limbs around, by speeding up and using that swinging force to your advantage when applicable, by speeding up cut and throwing the limb around on hinge with more force,a t least to start. You can always slow cut down, but unless you set yourself up right, you can't always speed it up, speed can hurt; but it can help, if ya know how to use it

Also for another tweak, come across slightly on final cut, so instead of feeding straight into gravity's power, the last piece of fiber pulls it sideways (even if not visibly) a percentage. It only has so much force, so any moving sideways is not moving down, or back! Will get even bigger pieces to drop straight with that!

So, if it will drop straight with no force kicking back by employing these techniques, and ground control can snatch it jsut as it cuts through, you should be able to get fairly positive 'pop' out away.

Practice in non-essential areas with all new techniques. Jump cutting out can be a real tough one, but dropping straight down, releasing immeditately all at once, should be a more standard skill to achieve, with more positive mechanix. And pulling it out with line just at release, might save some tears until you can get jumpcutting down (witch i steer away from, no not steer, like i'm not bull enough...........):D
 
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Done some bidding on eBay, but missed my chance at the 020t, and an 015. The Echo 3000 I put a bid on went high, and, well, that brings me up to date.

Still looking. Thanks for the input guys!
 
Hang in there Dragoon.
I bought a Echo 3000 off ebay and paid only $125.00 for it. It was brand new still in box. Like you I probabaly missed out on 3 or 4 until I got this one.
Let us know how you make out
 
The CS-3400 Echo won't hold a light to the Husky 335XPT in the cut, but day in and day out it has no superior. They are like the energizer bunny they just keep going and going. We have arborist that beat them to death and they never die. About the only thing that happens to them is they break them, hey you'd break to if someone dropped you out of a tree. CS-3400 is the best bang for the buck in a small saw. Stihl 009 and 011. I wouldn't give one to my worst enemy, if I had one. LOL Later Butch :D
 
I agree the CS3400 is a good saw better than the CS 3000.
I also like my 009, even though it is a little heavier and lower on the revs as compared to some other saws. It has served me well over the years and I hope it continues to do so!
 
019

I agree with you about the 019 durability, but I had 1 today that is 4 years old and still has compression( No , really, Good compression!). Needless to say, the customer won't give it up. Guess for every bad one there are still good ones out there. Not many, but some.
Still using my 1981 009, still does all the tops. Just keeps going.
 
The 019T is at least a pound heavier than the 020T, and is underpowered. Few people like them... The 3400 Echo is a much better saw, now called the CS-340, I think.
 
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