beating a dead horse 441 vs ????

[redprospector]

Red you know the 2 places that would be able to get you that answer.

Yeah, I know:blush: I just figured that since there were so many Stihl folks here, I'd give it a shot.
I must be on the sh!t list of those in the know here.

Andy

 

[2000ssm6]

No, I'm saying that other 70cc saws (bone stock) have a lot more power at this elevation. At 8700' the 441 was a DOG compared to the 044, 440, and yes even the 372. The 441 sounded pretty good untill you hit the wood.
This shop has set up almost all of my new saws, so I know they know how to tune for altitude. I was wondering if there was something else that needed to be done to the stratocharged engines, or if I would be better off to stay away from them.

Andy

Ummm, interesting. I have not run a 441 yet but it should not be too far from a 044/440 in power. I think you have answered your own question about buying one though. Unless it is a factory mistake internally in the saw then it must not be for high elevations. I don't know why Stihl would not have tested it in these type of areas seeing that Stihl's are sold all over the world. This might be far fetched but do you have another 441 to try out?? Just to eliminate that particular saw from being a "dud".

 

[redprospector]

Ummm, interesting. I have not run a 441 yet but it should not be too far from a 044/440 in power. I think you have answered your own question about buying one though. Unless it is a factory mistake internally in the saw then it must not be for high elevations. I don't know why Stihl would not have tested it in these type of areas seeing that Stihl's are sold all over the world. This might be far fetched but do you have another 441 to try out?? Just to eliminate that particular saw from being a "dud".

Yep, the dealer brought 2 identicle saws to the show and neither were impressive. He brought 2 saws last year too, same thing. I guess I'll stay away from the stratocharged saws if at all possible.

Thank's
Andy

 

[2000ssm6]

Yep, the dealer brought 2 identicle saws to the show and neither were impressive. He brought 2 saws last year too, same thing. I guess I'll stay away from the stratocharged saws if at all possible.

Thank's
Andy

Well, if you can find a left over 440 and need a 70cc saw then try that or a 372 will do I guess:hmm3grin2orange: If you do get the 440 order a dual port cover also, part#1128 140 0801.:biggrinbounce2:

 

[redprospector]

Well, if you can find a left over 440 and need a 70cc saw then try that or a 372 will do I guess:hmm3grin2orange: If you do get the 440 order a dual port cover also, part#1128 140 0801.:biggrinbounce2:

I have an 044, a 372, and a 7900. The 044 is real tired (but still better than a 441), I guess I'll go through it and look at the 460 when I get a new one.

Andy

 

[Ekka]

440's rule!

Higher you go less oxgen, means saws run richer, means likely that saw is "doughy" in the cut under load.

But I suppose you got the screw to adjust fuel flow at full throttle.

Here's a thought, does the 440 carby interchange to a 441 or have they screwed that up too!

I wouldn't go by what a lot of dealers and ******s say about saws ... You know the first 10 seconds you shove it into a cut if it sucks or not. For some, if it beats a handsaw they're happy, for others slicing off rounds of balsa wood at the local fair makes them a man.

But for workers all that BS dont fly, you want grunt and reliability, the less it weighs the better, at the beach or mountain top, if you went by dealers we'd all have poxy plastic 290's and take an alarm clock to wake us for when the cut finished.

 

[SawTroll]

Really, cool. Now tell me what is a World Champion sawman, exactly what do they do to win the title as World Champion??? Seriously now, all kidding aside what does this championship consist of??

This tread should give youy a picture of what it is about.

 

[jhellwig]

Why does every think that parts should interchange from older saws to new ones? What purpose does that server?

 

[Ekka]

Because when you have a shed full of saws and can build one newer one from parts of 3 dead ones and save 1000's you'll understand that interchanging is important. Bars, chains, sprockets, covers, filters etc all matter.

You wont find too many tree people who have one of each brand, they'll tend to have a lot of one brand.

Believe it or not I keep bolting the 1999 carby off the 440 onto the newer 440's coz it runs so much better, just coz it's new doesn't mean it's better, that old carby has been on maybe 5 saws now and out performs all the new ones every day. I assure you if you can get your hands on a pre 2000 ms200T carby, bolt it on, the saw will run better than the newer carby.

Yes, interchangability is important to me.

 

[peter399]

Really, cool. Now tell me what is a World Champion sawman, exactly what do they do to win the title as World Champion??? Seriously now, all kidding aside what does this championship consist of??

Take a look at the Russian video posted some days ago and you will see real loggers living from wood PRODUCTION Tommie , no cookie slicers

 

[SawTroll]

Take a look at the Russian video posted some days ago and you will see real loggers living from wood PRODUCTION Tommie , no cookie slicers

That video is linked up in post #194, above.

 

[jhellwig]

Because when you have a shed full of saws and can build one newer one from parts of 3 dead ones and save 1000's you'll understand that interchanging is important. Bars, chains, sprockets, covers, filters etc all matter.

You wont find too many tree people who have one of each brand, they'll tend to have a lot of one brand.

Believe it or not I keep bolting the 1999 carby off the 440 onto the newer 440's coz it runs so much better, just coz it's new doesn't mean it's better, that old carby has been on maybe 5 saws now and out performs all the new ones every day. I assure you if you can get your hands on a pre 2000 ms200T carby, bolt it on, the saw will run better than the newer carby.

Yes, interchangability is important to me.

And that helps them make money how?


You saved thousands. Congratulations. Now go buy a new saw and start the process over for the next 20 years.

 

[redprospector]

Pretty easy to see who makes a living with their saws.

Andy

 

[Ekka]

As a matter of fact I have just bought a new saw, a 440 and maybe you want to ask a member here called blsnelling what happened to some of my old ones and how people benefited from parts.

This thread http://arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=40520 and page 10 shows why and what happens. Maybe you need to see outside the boundaries of your confined imagination.

So, I have a new one now, and 2 old spares in the shed.

If anyone has old (non corroded) 440 cases I'd be interested, I could build a complete new saw.

Here's another simple incident. I accidently left a saw sitting ontop of my toolbox in my ute and drove off. Went around a corner and the saw flew off and smashed into the gutter, busted some covers, no big deal just put on the spares at home.

I get 12months out of a 440, about 18 months to 2 years out of a 250 ... 3 to 5 years out of a 200T and my 660 is 4 years old and my 460 is 8 years old.

You can see how I isolate damage to two certain saws, now a model change means a stack of useless parts on what are otherwise great saws anyway.

Here's some better pics of Ekka's palm-trashed cases.

Holes on the back side where they had eaten all the way through.

 

[2000ssm6]

That is amazing what the palms have done to the cases:jawdrop: :jawdrop:

 

[jhellwig]

As a matter of fact I have just bought a new saw, a 440 and maybe you want to ask a member here called blsnelling what happened to some of my old ones and how people benefited from parts.

This thread http://arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=40520 and page 10 shows why and what happens. Maybe you need to see outside the boundaries of your confined imagination.

So, I have a new one now, and 2 old spares in the shed.

If anyone has old (non corroded) 440 cases I'd be interested, I could build a complete new saw.

Here's another simple incident. I accidently left a saw sitting ontop of my toolbox in my ute and drove off. Went around a corner and the saw flew off and smashed into the gutter, busted some covers, no big deal just put on the spares at home.

I get 12months out of a 440, about 18 months to 2 years out of a 250 ... 3 to 5 years out of a 200T and my 660 is 4 years old and my 460 is 8 years old.

You can see how I isolate damage to two certain saws, now a model change means a stack of useless parts on what are otherwise great saws anyway.

I wouldn't condemn a saw just because parts don't interchange. Everyone probably did the same this they are doing now when the 044 came out. Parts don't interchange, new fangled technology instead of the tried and true. Why complain about the inevitable. Every company does it.

 

[Ekka]

Because it weighs more not less, for around the same HP, so in my book if you climb it's a backwards step.

 

[manual]

Because it weighs more not less, for around the same HP, so in my book if you climb it's a backwards step.

Not saying the MS441 or the 575XP are bad saws, They are stepping stones into new designs. In witch I prefer to step over and move on.
Husky knows it thats why The 372 is still for sale. The 575 will go through changes yet. I have no doubt about it.
Stihl will most likely let the 441 bleed to death before any changes are made.

 

[2000ssm6]

Stihl will most likely let the 441 bleed to death before any changes are made.

What????

 

[manual]

Nothing wrong with what Stihl does.
History shows when Stihl Makes a model of a saw They ride it out.

Husky on the other hand is always trying to make more advancements.