Buying a saddle

[treeman82]

JPS- Where can I find info on that saddle you are talking about? My saddle that I use now is about 3 years old and sometimes it bothers me. Wouldn't mind checking out something new. The one I use now is the Weaver "Climber's Best?"

 

[DDM]

I'm Currently using a Weaver with the leg straps
I cant think of the model off hand But it bunches up And a fellow offered me a Karl Kuemmerling New
never worn. >Shrugg< Might be nice to have a change up.

Later,
David

 

[treeman82]

Dave, if yours is the 4 D ring saddle then we are using the same thing. My saddle is equipped with the spreader snap rope clip. I am just tired of only being able to turn so much and experiencing the discomfort / disorientation of the saddle when doing so. I also don't like when it's cold out that I have to fight with the saddle a lot to get it where I won't fall out. But then when I do that the saddle then scrapes up my sides. I also don't like how it wears when I am carrying a lot of weight off my sides (pulleys / chainsaws / ropes / etc)

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Fresco is the only person caring it in North America.

http://www.frescoinc.net/arborist/arborist.htm

no online catalog, they got a small one.

Komet has a website but I cannot find it. Tom D may have it. He loves his butterfly.

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

The komet does not have any ANSI labels on it.
The little snaps on it break at around 1500 lb.s, I've heard.

 

[rbtree]

For everyday climbing, I wouldn't touch any of the basic saddles, Weaver, etc.

The modular Sierra Blair, butt stap or leg loops, is a good olderschool saddle, and still great for straightforward removals. OK for pruning.

But the Buckingham's are the new workhorse. Many options, customizable. Versatile, then the Traverse are the best two of the seat batten models. The new Master seems nice for a streamlined leg loop saddle. I can comfortably hang a 16 lb saw from them, but the optional suspenders would be a bonus.

Sherril's has a special on them. likely cause the new modulars are out. with them you can get a belt, then add both or either the Master or any of the batten models. VERY Nice, i'm sure they will be pricey though.

 

[Bradley]

I second that motion. I started out with a Weaver buttstrap and thought that saddles were supposed to be torture devices. I got a Buckingham Versatile a while back and love it to death. the one I have is covered in black suede and is very durable and has lots of support in the back. With the bosun seat, you don't cut off your circulation either. Using the hdpe rollers with the Petzl William carabiners for sliding tie in points is slick as well.

 

[MSAUERS]

Hey guys what's up? I'm a new user to this forum, but have been reading posts/replies for a lil while. I have been in the tree industry for 3 years. I use a Buckingham Traverse saddle, it's the most comfortable saddle i've been in. The sliding D makes me wonder why anyone would want the traditional style when that's available. I also love the back support and bosun seat, they really built a great saddle.

 

[DDM]

Well The saddle finally arrived i havent used a saddle without legstraps before so i'll try it out
i was in my Regular Weaver for about 5 hrs today
if i turn just right it pinches me on the thigh
this New Karl Kuemmerling Looks identical to a Weaver 4-Dee without the leg straps only problem i see is that it only has 3 goody holders And i'm used to 8!!!!!! I'll try it out tommorrow and decide if it goes to Ebay or not.

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

Do sliding "D" rings...

suck or just blow?

I guess I don't get what the deal is with them. It makes it physically harder to climb, for me, so I'm trying to figure out the advantage.
With a centered "D", when you just relax your weight on tho the belt, it rolls you to a centered position with no effort. With slippery "D" rings, you have got to use abdominal muscles to straighten back out, and to keep yourself straight. If you were hanging from your rope, and you wanted to turn sideways for some reason, it may be easier if your "D" slides, but then turning back is a drag. And how often do you hang off your line and turn sideways?
If you are not hanging from your line, then it does not seem to be advantageous to have your ring slide, heck, you just turn. If it bothers you for some odd reason, just go between your two climbing line leads.
I'm now climbing on a saddle with sliding attachment points and didn't like it, so I rigged a little kevlar utiity cord to prevent it from sliding, and find it much easier to climb.

 

[treeclimber165]

The last time I tried a belt with a sliding D ring, I got pinched on the backside of my arm to the point of bleeding! I agree with you about being harder for me to turn back facing my rope. I'll never buy a belt with a sliding D, unless the seller can GUARANTEE it will never pinch me! I don't wanna try that twice.

 

[DDM]

Ive Noticed The same that mike is describing.My saddle has 2 fixed & 2 sliding rings I use the fixed rings to tie into And the sliding rings for safety lanyards ect.

 

[rbtree]

i used to use a sliding d setup, it was OK, but could cause some problems as you guys have brought up. i know a lot of guys who still use and like it. My Versatile has that option, and in fact, I have the plastic rollers (Paul Sisson's idea), but prefer to use my fixed loops. I usually use the ones that put my line attachments about 8 inches apart. This is comfy, and allows for quick turnarounds to work facing directly away from your tie in, a great setup for those long reaches and/or pole saw work.

Rog

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Like anything else, it is an individual thing. I know guys who will never go back and others, like y'all who hate them.

I think they are too shifty for my tastes. I've only tried them out, never did any owrk in one.

 

[dan kraus]

I personally love the sliding "D". It gives me freedom of movement. I find with the fixed center, if I turn at all it's fighting to bring me back to center. When I'm moving about the tree and going out limbs my sliding "D" is to one side or another. To have a straight pull in the center I'd have to walk backwards from my tie in. It's also nice to be able to push it aside when standing on a branch, and working right in front of myself.

I don't care for the fast rollers on my sliding"D", to touchy. I like some friction to help keep it at just the right spot.

I know some fantastic climbers that like the fixed point though, so to each his own.
:Monkey:

 

[Shespen]

I've been using the sliding "D" for years now and I like the adjustability of it. Maybe I'm just used to it but I hated the old double "D" with the splitter between them. I have short arms and I like having my climbing knots within easy reach.

The thing that I like the most about the sliding "D" is when it rolls across my stomach and rolls up my shirt, hair and belly button lint and rips it all out. Thats when I know it's time to lay off the beer.

Steve

 

[Tom Dunlap]

I'm with Dan on this one.

The advantage of having a well designed sliding d saddle is that your spine isn't twisted when you turn to face your work. With my tweaked out Butterfly I can turn about three hundred andtwnety degrees without my spine going out of vertical alignment.

When I climbed on a fixed D saddle my back would get twisted or the saddle would twist on my hips. Either way, that doesn't work.

The sliding d does take a little getting used to. After that short time, I think its better for the climber's back.

Before I got my Butterfly I climbed for many years on a Blair Ultra-Light with a floating single d. Thats a nice saddle too.

165 and Mike, what make and model saddles are you using now and what make and model sliding d saddle didn't you like? Just becaues one manufacturer hasn't solved the riddle of a sliding d, try and keep an open mind to the possibility that another has solved the riddle.

Tom

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

I'm in a Comit Butterfly.
I notice the strap is wearing out fast. My thought for replacement is along the lines of a chain which would allow for several different fixed attachment points, definitely not another sliding deal.
Tom, I noticed that your "tweaking" resolves the issue of self centering.
There is little difference in turning away from your tie in point in either saddle, it's the effort required to get back to center that differs, along with the effort to stay centered as you work. A center attachment point(or Tom's steel rig) only requires you lean back on the rope and you self center.
Use of a sliding D is about the same as hanging all your weight from your lanyard when it is attached to your side D rings.
Also, a sliding D only allows about 90 degrees of rotation before you are in the same situation as a fixed D, anyway, so once you turn around and start working it' still doing the things you don't like about fixed D saddles.
Admittedly the difference is subtle, but why make your job harder?

 

[rbtree]

Mike, that would make the Butterfly more like the Versatile. I use the fixed loops, rather than the sliding setup, mainly out of habit. But I do like the convenience, simplicity, and speed of my current system. I've seen how Paul Sisson attached his sliding setup, it just looked more cumbersome. Not using the rollers would be simpler, and less jerky, for sure. I'll check to see exactly how Dan Kraus does it.

And that will be Friday, when he shows up to film another great tree, only this time it is a preservation job! It is a 78.5" dbh giant tulip tree, that Scott Baker and I will nominate to be the new Washington State Champion! I'm also nominating it for the Seattle/Plant Amnesty Heritage Tree Program. I'm gonna try to get them to help me produce a video of the tree, the pruning, Cobra cabling, and the future dedication. we will be able to get a couple of the luminaries in the tree for the ceremony. Plus I plan to nominate, and shoot, the large elm in one of my best customer's yard. It may be the best elm is town, at over 4.5 feet dbh, and around 110 feet tall and wide. Spectacular setting, Cascade Mt view, super, huge yard with many great trees, including another elm, two big atlas cedar, declining paulownia, koelreuteria, Jap maple, plus a 5' dbh bigleaf maple which hangs over the awesome house. I've pruned it several times and installed at least five Cobra systems.

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

I really like that feature of the Versatile. If it's the saddle I'm thinking of, with a row of attachment points across the front made from webbing material. Each carabiner has it's own place to clip and stay orginized.
It also allows a centered lanyard attachment point, just outside the climbing line, without the mess of carabiners jammed all together.