Can't seem to get safety chain to cut

[nomad_archer]

I finished up two chains. The first one I did half of it without the file guide holder the second I had the file guide holder. I hope to get out this afternoon and see how I did. Pictures to come of results and for critique.

 

[nomad_archer]

First chain I did half with a file guide the other half with the file guide and file guide holder. Results where better than before but looking closely i need a few more passes with the round file

 

[nomad_archer]

Second chain I did with the file holder and guide. I was using the stihl ff1 holder and guide. Again this is better but still needs a few more passes with the file. So let me know if there is anything obvious that I am not doing correctly.

 

[showrguy]

Second chain I did with the file holder and guide. I was using the stihl ff1 holder and guide. Again this is better but still needs a few more passes with the file. So let me know if there is anything obvious that I am not doing correctly.

rakers on this chain look awfull high ??
stihl factory setting is usually high from the get-go..

 

[nomad_archer]

Rakers are good based on the depth gauge. I wish that was the problem.

 

[showrguy]

rakers are not good..based on my eyeballs..
give em a few strokes with a flat file and report back..

 

[Philbert]

It's always hard to tell from the photos, but they look a whole lot better than the earlier chains. It looks like you are getting good chips too!

Congrats!

Are you satisfied?

Philbert

 

[nomad_archer]

Thanks philbert. I am not completely satisfied yet. I feel like the cutters need a few more strokes but both chains are cutting a lot better not quite the same as new yet. I did find that hand filling is very relaxing.

 

[nomad_archer]

So I gave the second chain did a few more passes with the round file and at that point it was time to take the rakers down. The results put a big smile on my face. I was getting good chips and the saw was self feeding very nicely. A sharp chain is great. I spent all of last years cutting season with more or less dull chains. The amount of work I could have save if I had just jumped into hand filing with a guide and holder first. Lesson learned I will be a hand filer unless the chain really needs the grinder. At that point I will grind and possibly finish with the round file, I havnt decided yet. Thanks for the help everyone. Now to fix the other two loops that spent some time on the grinder.

 

[showrguy]

So I gave the second chain did a few more passes with the round file and at that point it was time to take the rakers down. The results put a big smile on my face. I was getting good chips and the saw was self feeding very nicely. A sharp chain is great. I spent all of last years cutting season with more or less dull chains. The amount of work I could have save if I had just jumped into hand filing with a guide and holder first. Lesson learned I will be a hand filer unless the chain really needs the grinder. At that point I will grind and possibly finish with the round file, I havnt decided yet. Thanks for the help everyone. Now to fix the other two loops that spent some time on the grinder.

i told ya so !!

 

[nomad_archer]

I'm still not sure I trust your eye ball method since my eyeball method isn't calibrated. I took more off the cutters as and the rakers were showing the need to be taken down on the depth gauge. In the end though the chain cuts and puts a big smile on my face.

 

[CTYank]

Looks to me like the round file could be held a bit higher, by looking at the "hook". Cutting edge wouldn't be quite so acute, but much more durable. In the pix, the depth gauges seem to me to be inconsistent, with some quite high.

Chain filing is an art, and reportedly has always been in short supply. A good file guide, like Granberg's "File-N-Joint" for under $30, makes it a no-brainer IMHO. Makes it easy to precisely set depth gauges too. Someone familiar with it can set it up in a minute or less. In their catalogs Northern Tools shows it set up backwards.

IME, you learn pretty quickly when filing chains to check the cutting edge on each cutter by finger-tip and looking at light reflection, after doing each tooth. Needs more? Do it right there. You want a set of razors, obviously.

 

[eriklane]

Been there, had the T-shirt "I cut with somewhat dull chains and can't seem to get it right". Finally tossed that shirt. Got a Grandberg file tool. Sold my grinder. Won't look back. The CRITICAL thing I think is this-the top plate cannot be roundish or rocked, etc. The Grandberg lets you slightly elevate the file, as the pic shows-taking it up out of the gullet as it's supposed to be, and shear off that bad portion, rendering it like this 7 rather than ). Get that right, and wow...I almost bought that Timberline tool for $125 but now, with a good round file, and the Grandberg, I can do this all day man...each time I file a tooth, I feel it, if that 7 corner doesn't nick and hold my skin, it's not sharp (full chisel chain). Put it this way, if you're dusting, or anything less than having a grin on your face while you rip wood, you're dull. Pushing makes a hot bar, and then it all goes to hek...

 

[nomad_archer]

Pushing makes a hot bar, and then it all goes to hek...

My bars last summer when I was cutting where so hot that I had to wait to touch them even with leather golves on, when filling the gas/oil and changing the chains. So hot that I have very little paint left on the bar. I should have realized that something was wrong then but I didnt. I didnt realize how dull the chains where until I used a new one.

Now that I have been checking each tooth I have 100 little almost like paper cuts on the tip of my index finger. So I think the cutters are getting sharp now.

The final verdict. The first 20" loop of saftey chain that I did cuts pretty well. I am getting smaller chips than I do with the 16" loop of yellow chain but the 20" loop is cutting and self feeding so I am going to knock back the rakers a bit and go with it. The other 2 loops of 20" that I fixed still need some work. A few more passes with the round file and a raker adjustment and they should be in good shape as well. I am pretty happy with the results with the safety chain. I probably wont buy it in the future but it still does the job and with 4 loops of it, it may last a long time. The 16" yellow chain cuts better but that may be from the increased rpms with the saw as the 20" safety chain is the max recommended for the saw. Overall I think I have a good handle on this thanks everyone for your help.

 

[nomad_archer]

So I am sure this didnt help anything but I took the bar I used last summer with dull chains and I was forcing it in the cut. Wow what a mess. I had terrible grooves and burrs. I spent over an hour dressing the bar rails and removing the burrs. The burrs/rails where razor sharp. Now that I did that the bar is oiling a lot better or at least thats what seems like to me. Not sure if the grooved bar affected cutting performance but I'm sure it didn't help anything.

 

[farmer steve]

your getting there n_a. as they say practice makes perfect.

 

[Philbert]

I spent over an hour dressing the bar rails and removing the burrs. . . . Not sure if the grooved bar affected cutting performance but I'm sure it didn't help anything.

Bar maintenance (and sprocket, etc.) is covered in the Oregon Maintenance and Safety Manual (starting around page 56): http://www.oregonproducts.com/maintenance/manual.htm

Aside from being a cut hazard for the operator, large burrs can hang up in the cut, affecting performance.

Philbert

 

[Brendon Phillips]

I doubt this will help with your current problem but when using a grinder, you have to be careful to not get the cutting edge to hot. Once it turns red it peels the metal up and leaves a dull edge. Go easy on it, and take out only as much as you need. I use a grinder a lot for high production, and can sharpen a chain in under a minute. It's still serviceable in the field with a hand file.

Look at the top of the cutting tooth from back to the front. If it's not perfectly flat, meaning if it drops off where the cutting edge is at all, it's not sharp. Keep working it and try to keep all teeth the same length. Don't forget the rakes. There are guides out there for the depth you cut it down, but I just eyeball it. Works out fine. Don't want to take out to much or it'll stop the saw. Take out to little and it won't cut right. Hope this helps.

 

[nomad_archer]

Bar maintenance (and sprocket, etc.) is covered in the Oregon Maintenance and Safety Manual (starting around page 56): http://www.oregonproducts.com/maintenance/manual.htm

Aside from being a cut hazard for the operator, large burrs can hang up in the cut, affecting performance.

Philbert

It was in the stihl manual as well and I new about it but I wasn't able to identify it.

I had to fell two trees in the backyard so they dont eventually end up on the shed I have to build this summer. I had a friend that is an arborist help give me the step by step since one was a leaner and the other was side and back heavy. It really is a nice to know someone to learn from on the more interesting trees. I also got a grinder lesson although it wasn't nearly as technical as some of philberts threads. Now I have two trees to clean up and try out my newly sharpened chains. Firewood doesn't get much closer.

 

[nomad_archer]

Well guess it is time to learn to use the grinder. I rocked my first chain today didnt see the thing. Only the top plate seems to have damage. When i grind the chain i will take off a little at a time. But how much needs to come off? All of the rough looking metal so all that is left looks looks like the original cutter or just enough to clean up the cutting edge?