Disparaging Remarks

[Tree Machine]

I don't think he meant polychlorinated biphenyls.

 

[treesurfer78]

Here in the UK I have found that it's quite the opposite. Maybe it's because the UK doesn't have a large tree caring population so they don't see many tree surgeons as they would over in the US. Whenever I've told somebody I'm a tree surgeon they become intrigued and ask more about it - what I do, how I do it, how I got into it etc.

And the girls love it too!! :biggrinbounce2:

 

[treeseer]

I don't think he meant polychlorinated biphenyls.

Yeah, even though the "c" is a long way from the "u" on the keyboard, I think he meant "pubs". In that case I agree; transferring research and science and ideas into technology is a major challenge, and the major goal of ISA.

 

[xtremetrees]

transferring research and science and ideas into technology is a major challenge, and the major goal of ISA

Treeseer,
Maybe the ISA should ask for help from the www.arboristsite.com
This is the only resource of upto date tree knowledge in the world thru a medium of a forum which the ISA a million dollar foundation? cant afford a crusty dude sitting at home dusting saw chips from his armchair is doing better than all the tree degrees the planet can gather in one place can offer.

There is a Master layman thats done more for information sharing than the largest orgnization on the planet. How does that smack you?
ISA cant keep a medium for info exchange and a master layman can? Why should I stay a C.A. and not join the Master Laymans Certification.
You all know which master and buzz laymen im talking about.

ISA cant share info thru a forum... WHY?

 

[treeseer]

ISA cant share info thru a forum... WHY?

Why Bother? There at least four I check into--do we need five?

There are lots of media for info exchange--books, mags, etc.

For anyone who wants to hear more rant, check the archives on this topic. I'm gone.

 

[rebelman]

Open forums get bogged down, obviously. I mean you got passionate and educated professionals on the one hand, who mean well, raising the bar, then you got opinionated, aggressive skeptics who try to discredit or confuse. Some say ANSI standard is the saviour of this industry, others say it is politically correct bull ****. Without certified arborists we would be in really bad shape. I ain't from Boston, here in the south ANSI standard is not followed. It takes more than a lexus and fleet of stump grinders to stop the disparaging remarks. Yes, Arboristsite could take the lead in promoting awareness, or just let trolls, hacks, culls and treecudders trade insults while other sites do important stuff.

 

[Climb020]

I have to say after just 2 years of tree work all the certifications and standards are just BS for most people. Maybe there are good tre guys that care about the trees, there co-workers, and safety. And I would amagine there are a few business owners as well. But for the most part there aren't.

I know of a few cert. Arbs from ISA that will tell yoy to spike a trim if it will save time and make him more money. The same individual is a NJ cert. tree expert. If some one wants a hack job or anything like it we will do. They want us to clear the power lines we do it even thought there is not a certifiied line clearance person that works for the company. Send a guy to climb a tree in the powerlines and justs say "As long as the power line is insulatede you will be fine."

I ******* pull my hair out everyday wondering why this is. Why have standards if they aren't taken seriously? Why have safety meetings and then when at the job site told not to follow the correct procedures? Why send a new climber up a tree with a chainsaw and no saddle or rope?

I wish none of this bothered me because it can be very fustrating through out the day. Is there a way to deal with it or change these things or just go out a hopefully find someone that is on the same wave length.


Back to the real topic.....
Right out of high school I turned down a job for Nuclear Engineering. I had great grades and could have started with a 6 figure salary. But as you can see I am doing this instead. It does bother you a little when everyone askes why you do tree work when you are too smart to be doing tree work. But it is more about doing what you like to do then doing something else that you can't stand and make more money. Some poeple just don't understand.

 

[treeseer]

Funny, I don't hear that at all! I must be a real dumba:monkey:

When I hear it implied, I show them there's more to it than climbing and cutting. A lot more. If they're still hung up on the notion that if one uses one's body one must have an inferior brain, I turn away. They're the onew who are disconnected, not me.

 

[Koa Man]

Funny, I don't hear that at all!

No one has told me that either.

 

[Ekka]

If they're still hung up on the notion that if one uses one's body one must have an inferior brain, I turn away.

Haha, that's funny.

 

[Treeinnovator]

No one has told me that either.

i've had customers look down on me like they look down on all blue-collar workers. sometimes i'll mention the 3 homes that i own (over 1 million worth) and then all of a sudden there attitude changes instantly.

what's crazy is ... they must have some inclining about the pay we get because they actually hire us and witness it. $1,000 for a few hours... how can they not figure out we get paid alot more than most people?

 

[treeseer]

Dis-Disparagement

Good one, Bermie; I was about to start tapping some palms but I think I'll hold off for now.

"after just 2 years of tree work all the certifications and standards are just BS for most people."

Here's two jobs I got last week; more examples of what utter trash standards and certs are:

1. Cities look for ca's to do their contracting, so I'm working with trees in stream restoration projects. Very fun work. Getting paid 4x what an arborist foreman in Florida makes.

2. States look for ca's to look at their trees, so I was asked to review the ANSI standards and give opinions on one. I offered to do it at an hourly rate of 6x what an arborist foreman in Florida makes. The client set me straight when s/he sent a contract offering 9x, 12x for testimony.

Certification is such a waste; I wonder why I bothered.

 

[beowulf343]

How much does an arborist foreman in Florida make?

 

[treeseer]

How much does an arborist foreman in Florida make?

Can't say; that would give it all away. :monkey:

We are NOT talking about the former french fry flippers in southern Florida, but a skilled and experienced foreman, on the central west coast.

 

[Jim1NZ]

The day people realise trees are an asset and require proper care things will change, but to many they're just an...

obstacle obscuring a view

a leaf dropping hinderence

a potential blow over damaging their house

a source of firewood and building materials

a scavanger of water and nutrients to other more deserving flowers

an allelopathic eyesaw to undergrowth

a harbinger of feral pests and rodents

a solar obstructor

A radio and TV signal shadower

.... Oh, I think you get my drift.

Too right, trees should be regarded as an asset, adding value to a property!

Ha i had a client want a Ginko 5 meters away from the house removed because it was affecting the cimmney smoke!!!

 

[Ekka]

Ha, chimney smoke, lucky it didn't catch on fire if it was that close or was he smoking pot himself.

I guess that a Florida tree crew foreman's pay rate is around the $35 mark.

I also guess that a consulting arborists pay rate is around $200 per hour.

Now a Certified Arborist's rate can be anywhere, Treeseer, when you say CA is that Certified Arborist or Consulting Arborist?

 

[treeseer]

when you say CA is that Certified Arborist or Consulting Arborist?

Just certified. The asca Registered Consulting Arborist tag is not well known yet in most parts of the usa, but isa Certified Arborists are sought out and required by govts and others for work that involves knowledge about trees.

Even if your town does not call for ca's now, they may when their ordinance is rewritten. Will you be in position at that time?

O and ekka on your wage guess you are WAY high, over double, unfortunately.

"i had a client want a Ginko 5 meters away from the house removed because it was affecting the cimmney smoke!"

It continually astounds me that the removal option comes first to people's minds, even when the pruning option is so very simple cheap and effective. Too many removal experts, and too few arborists making their service known.

 

[Ekka]

But Treeseer, you are no ordinary CA and they'd know that!

When some-one watches you look over a tree, poke around some, tap on it and write a works brief then charge $80 and they say ....

"hey, $80, but it only took you 15 minutes!"

You can confidently respond, "no, it took me a lifetime".

Oh, bad pay rates for foremen in Florida, climbers make more.

 

[vharrison2]

Can't say; that would give it all away. :monkey:

We are NOT talking about the former french fry flippers in southern Florida, but a skilled and experienced foreman, on the central west coast.

I don't know, treeseer, I have two CA's that are paid VERY well, with lots of perks! However, we are in the southern most part of Florida.

 

[Treeinnovator]

I don't know, treeseer, I have two CA's that are paid VERY well, with lots of perks! However, we are in the southern most part of Florida.

yeah but living in the Keys, you are forced to pay those guys well (very high stardard of living + they'll bolt to Miami for work if not paid well).

how do you find business in the Keys anyhow?...there simply ain't that many trees compared to other places.