GIANT poison oak + poison oak question.

[Diesel JD]

I have never heard of PI remaining dormant in your system for years if not treated......that sounds kind of stupid, I don't think that's right. I wanted to say for sure...don't think you can avoid it by cutting when the plant is dormant. doesn't work...as to the ID, the problem here is that PI plants as well as the harmless(to most folks) Virginia Creeper have those hairy rhizomes on the vines. In addition, so does a vine that goes by the pet name of cow itch plant. It seems to be an allergen for some people,a nd not for others, for me it causes a reaction sometimes, and other times not at all, but never severe like PI. I need to get some pics of teh different stuff I'm looking at. It seems like nearly half of my trees are badly vined up with something, harmful or not!

 

[hobby climber]

Here's a link: www.poison-ivy.org

My doctor told me that it WILL accumulate & stay in the body until its treated with mediation...its the only way to get rid of it! I was given some type of steroid medication to treat it. Started off with a large dose and gradually decrease the amount over a period of time.

The people that get it all over there body (and not just the contact area), are the same people that have been exposed to it in the past! HC

 

[treeseer]

Gave the immune system a tryout yesterday. puiled weeds from the edge of the pond including mucho poison ivy; loonnng thick vines. Wore smurf gloves but went shirtless; it was hot. did not try to brush leaves against bare open-pored skin but still it happened.:monkey:

Showered right after and stood guard with tecnu, but felt no itch. guess I can be thankful for a strong immune system--strong as in controlled. Hyperactivity is not strength. So where do I sign up for hazard pay--let em send me into a thicket of it, that's ok. Dress right and keep your mind calm and have no fear and I'm convinced it's just another plant.:biggrinbounce2:

Or maybe I just had a lucky day. :blush:

 

[Mike Barcaskey]

I believe using the word immune/immunity is wrong.
This is an allergy that you have an allergic reaction to. You can decrease or increase your sensitivity to it.
Immune is more for bacteria/viruses sickness

 

[boo]

Treeseer:
A strong immune system isn't what gives individuals the ability to avoid getting urisol rashes. It is an intelligent one. Those who do not react to the ivy, oak or sumac plants do so simply because their body doesn't react to the urisol.
Unfortunately, those that do have a reaction do so because their immune systems react strongly.

beowulf343:
"Why can't doctors take someone who is immune to poison ivy or oak and synthesize an antidote from their blood, dna, etc? "
Doctors are way beyond us. Back in the 1950's a leading research physician, (the same guy who did the retin A - wrinkle remover studies), did the definitive study on urisol exposure/reactions. He concluded that we simply don't know how the immune system works on problems of this nature. His best guess was that if a large population got enough exposure to an irritant like poison oak, that eventually all but 5% would develop a reaction. He had no idea why. Why not all nor why those others would be spared.
In short, you've got to understand not just the problem, but the solution in medicine and we can't synthesize an antidote when we don't know what it is. We are not there yet unless we think big and go cloning.

A fairly significant point is that all should avoid urisol exposure if reasonably possible. I have seen so many that swore they didn't get it eventually develop a reaction.

I also am one of those guys that don't have a reaction to the poison.
Knowing this, I tackle some of the most poison infested jobs possible.
Once in a great while, I'll have a very mild reaction, a few days later... only after swimming in it.
A couple of my helpers can't seem to get through the night after coming into contact with it.... trips to the E.R. for steroids that last another 6 months or so.
I mean these guys swell up like ticks on a dog!! lips, face, and head swells up, welts all over.
Over the years they've learned to ID it and keep their distance.

As far as a cure .... what makes you think they don't have one already?
It's been done.
Don't that have to go through the FDA?
The same ones that took MGN Ultra 3 off of the shelf.
That's what blisters my a$$.

 

[woodchux]

I used to have terrible reactions to PI. Now I can bundle up armloads of the stuff and throw it on the truck. All i do is wipe off with deodorized mineral spirits when i get home , and a good soapy shower. No problems.

 

[M.D. Vaden]

The link in hobbyclimbers reply had some gnarly looking images in the gallery - blisters, blackened skin, etc..

 

[smokechase II]

poison oak cure

"As far as a cure .... What makes you think they don't have one already?"

There is not a cure that I'm aware of. Technu works pretty well, both as a morning after (exposure then clean up) and even as a bit of a preventative treatment. But by no means is it a cure.
Topical 1% steroid creams make for a great follow up to that technu scrub.
This is what works for me. Particularly with just an ivy exposure or off season oak.
Prednisone or other form of steroid (shots) are generally considered the most powerful anti inflammatory. Oak sap in the spring will get me on prednisone. Of course there are concerns and limitations with taking a medicine as significant as this one.

But these aren't cures. They may work to some degree for many, but have you ever seen really bad cases that even substantial steroids will not touch? I have, (medic in fire camps).

Also: The guys that I saw drink the poison oak extract to build up immunity, they just complained of itchy a__ holes later. Recommend against that one to any and all listening.

 

[daddieslilgirl]

poision oak and ivy

i agree with alot, technu works great, i think they made money off my hubby and his partner when they worked in jersey! lol me on the other hand im allergic to everything including benedryl, but not poison oak, ivy, or schumack! go figure. ive layed in it and not even known it hooking up chokers! my brother the smart a@@ says ya know what your in??? i didnt have a clue, thats why he stayed away! he thought id be itching like crazy! hahaha much to his dismay..i didnt! thats not to say it cant start bothering you because it can! im knocking on wood! lol

 

[M.D. Vaden]

Now that my mind's into this subject, I think I might buy or order something for future exposure.

I rarely get into poison oak, but I like to keep products on hand anyhow.

My hiking adventures could bring me into a patch, too.

There's a nifty looking rock hill in our area, with a trail to the top, practically lined with poison oak. It's one of the first warning they give to school kids for field trips there.

Here's the rock...

http://www.mdvaden.com/table_rock.shtml

There's a rare flower up there, the dwarf wooly meadow foam. People like to go and see it, even though it's not exceptionally colorful. The geology is interesting.

There must be quite a few cases of poison oak from that rock each year.

 

[BorealTree]

Simple "Clean" Solution

Don't laugh but I have the answer! ......

Lysol in a spray can!

I used to patrol power lines in the sierra foothills and Poison Oak jungles abounded, especially in the sun filled areas under the lines. There was no way around it other than through it. No fun!

I would come back to my truck, pull out a can of spray (aerosol) Lysol, spray my arms, hands, etc., rub it in some then rinse with a small amount of water (less than a gallon). No mess like Tech-nu. I would never get it and I could use it up to a couple hours after contact.

People I knew that already had a reaction to it could also use Lysol as it denatures the oil and drys the skin and hence allows healing sooner.

The methodology being...lysol destroys bacteria, etc., by lysing (cutting) the cell membranes which are made of fats/lipids. What is the irritant in poison oak/ivy?...the oil, vegetative oil = fats & lipids.

stay itch free.....
hans

 

[M.D. Vaden]

Don't laugh but I have the answer! ......

Lysol in a spray can!

I used to patrol power lines in the sierra foothills and Poison Oak jungles abounded, especially in the sun filled areas under the lines. There was no way around it other than through it. No fun!

I would come back to my truck, pull out a can of spray (aerosol) Lysol, spray my arms, hands, etc., rub it in some then rinse with a small amount of water (less than a gallon). No mess like Tech-nu. I would never get it and I could use it up to a couple hours after contact.

People I knew that already had a reaction to it could also use Lysol as it denatures the oil and drys the skin and hence allows healing sooner.

The methodology being...lysol destroys bacteria, etc., by lysing (cutting) the cell membranes which are made of fats/lipids. What is the irritant in poison oak/ivy?...the oil, vegetative oil = fats & lipids.

stay itch free.....
hans

Does LYSOL have ALCOHOL in it?

If it does, that explains a lot of what you shared.

I don't have a can laying around to check the ingredients.

Alcohol is one of the better known compounds, recommended to use for poison oak on skin.

 

[BorealTree]

don't think it is alcohol

M.D.

i don't believe it is alcohol in the Lysol as it never dried the skin out to the point alcohol would have.

it is the same molecular compound used inside the cells of the body, especially the white blood cells or phagocytes (the same ones that eat & destroy bacteria.) Cells contain Lysosomes that can bond with "waste products" and destroy it by Lys-ing (lys = cut in latin) the bi-lipid layer cell membrane. Lysosomes also work for cell self-destruction by opening their contents into the cell, which I would surmise would be what happens at the connection point between the twigs & the leaves when they drop them in the fall.

~hans

 

[(WLL)]

PI is probably the single biggest reason I'm not in the arboriculture industry. I got a couple really bad cases of it in high school and first couple of years of college. I don't want to do that again! I suck at ID of it too, which is perhaps teh biggest problem. Hopefully I'm better at ID and a little wiser than I was then.

what is the difference in pi/po

 

[jomoco]

Some people really are immune to it

Hi MD,

I've been removing trees with poison oak or poison ivy my whole career, in fact many companies sub to me for that very reason.

I'm more than willing to hop on a jet with my gear and deal with that tree or any other, I like big challenging trees with or without PI or PO.

Just give me a few weeks notice and the dbh of the trees so I know which saws to take.

Work Safe

jomoco

 

[jefflovstrom]

I think there are plenty of guys like me that had it so much they really don't worry about it. One thing I do is to take asprin the day before and the day you are working in it.
Jeff

 

[jbw]

pi salad

i have had severe reactions in the past to the pi. over the last 5 yrs, i eat one pi leaf (small young leaf) per month. when i climb into a pi tree, i eat another leaf that day. i still get itchy spots (under watch band, forearm) but no blistering nor swelling.

only side affect upon its exit: slight itching for 2 days if you eat old bigger leaves that you can't chew up thoroughly.

the "oral ivy" does work but is too expensive; 4 drops per day and then 10 drops every 6 hrs after severe exposure.

 

[M.D. Vaden]

I just found a web page with information on Lysol Spray Disintectant. It referred to the MSDS source for Lysol; that it has over 70% alcohol in it.

That's a substantial alcohol source, that it would easily affect the chemical in poison oak, based on the information available about alcohol and poison oak.

There is other stuff in Lysol too.

 

[M.D. Vaden]

I added quite a bit to this poison oak page yesterday...

http://www.mdvaden.com/poison_oak.shtml

Especially some winter photos of the stems, branching pattern and buds, including Ribes sanguinium; a winter look-alike.

It's doubtful that a vine on a tree will be confused with anything. But for anybody climbing trees around bare stemmed plants, this might help in winter.

Does anybody know if poison ivy has a look-alike?

Corylus just doesn't compare to poison oak. I think the that the native flowering current is the only shrub that can be confused with poison oak in winter, due to size and branching.

 

[asiegler04]

I would be pretty careful and going about removing that wear long pants long sleeves and gloves is a must. Then I would wash my hands with soap and warm water. Try to do that within 2 hours and wash your clothes in hot water separate to prevent cross contamination.