GRANBERG FILE-N-JOINT I need a how to if someone can help?

[Jeff Lary]

I know this may be a tall order but here goes.I have tried the search but I may not be doing somthing right? I just had a file-n-joint given to me and wanted to know if somebody has the instructions they would share. I get the degree thing I have chosen 30 and the pitch ? angle of 10 degrees? not sure if you call it pitch or not? and the depth guage into the gullett. But I am having a better time with it one way than the other like the right teeth are eaiser than the left it just seems akward to me. is the the old" i am right handed thing or what?" as I am right handed if you have any advice i would appreceiate the help. Thanks Jeff

 

[Dan_in_WI]

There's a video on Bailey's, HTH.

Bailey's - Granberg File-N-Joint Precision Filing Guide

 

[Streblerm]

It is easier to file from the inside of the tooth out rather than the other way around. Outside in usually makes the file chatter on the hard chrome coating.

There are two ways to deal with this. One is to turn the saw upside down and clamp the granberg on the bottom of the bar. The other way is to leave it where it is and turn the file around and pull it across the cutter rather than push.

I tried for a long time to file inside out on one side of the chain and outside in on the other so you didnt have to move the file guide. All it got me was a chain that cut in a U shape.

 

[Chris J.]

Somewhere around here I have photocopies of the Granberg instructions, I made copies because the original is pretty brittle. My former neighbor gave me one complete with the box & instructions that he found when they moved into the house next door. I knew the original owner, and would guess that he bought it sometime in the late '70s to mid '80s (based on the two chainsaws he had, a Stihl 011AVT & a Poulan Micro, not sure which model).

As someone mentioned, I seem to recall finding the instructions somewhere on the WebNet.


Edit, go to the bottom of the page:

http://granberg.com/content/video-clips-english#granberg

 

[phillipmc]

Important thing is to mount the bar securely in a vise or something so you have 2 hands for the FnJ Also some bees wax or something on the guide rod to smooth its travel. Keep the chatter out of it as much as possible and file each tooth evenly. It takes practice. If possible start with an old chain you dont care much about. I took a Stihl green chain and filed it with the FnJ and holy crap does it throw nice chips now.

 

[Jeff Lary]

There's a video on Bailey's, HTH.

Bailey's - Granberg File-N-Joint Precision Filing Guide

Yes I saw that video nice job too but it does not show him switching over to the other side does it? I dont know maybe it does. I have just heard soooo much about this wonder gadget that when he offered me one for free I could not turn him down. So far though I could do a better job on right and left free hand as I have always done. Well up untill last year when I got an old file holder the flat kind with the degree lines imbossed into the guide that works pretty sweet actually.I guess I just need more practice.

 

[Jeff Lary]

It is easier to file from the inside of the tooth out rather than the other way around. Outside in usually makes the file chatter on the hard chrome coating.

There are two ways to deal with this. One is to turn the saw upside down and clamp the granberg on the bottom of the bar. The other way is to leave it where it is and turn the file around and pull it across the cutter rather than push.

I tried for a long time to file inside out on one side of the chain and outside in on the other so you didnt have to move the file guide. All it got me was a chain that cut in a U shape.

Yea i can imagine the issues there, I think if I was to move my f-n-j to the far tip end of the bar as far as i can be from the bench vice that will give my left elbow room to move a little eaiser. But the upside down I dea is very interesting maybe I will try that as well. Willing to try any way this is supposed to be the end all to be all ya know !!

 

[Jeff Lary]

Somewhere around here I have photocopies of the Granberg instructions, I made copies because the original is pretty brittle. My former neighbor gave me one complete with the box & instructions that he found when they moved into the house next door. I knew the original owner, and would guess that he bought it sometime in the late '70s to mid '80s (based on the two chainsaws he had, a Stihl 011AVT & a Poulan Micro, not sure which model).

As someone mentioned, I seem to recall finding the instructions somewhere on the WebNet.


Edit, go to the bottom of the page:

Video Clips - English | Granberg International

Yea if you can find them send them to me if ya want and I will try the print thing.
I saw theis site on the web eariler but the file and joint I have is not like the ones in the video mine is not powered.

 

[Jeff Lary]

Important thing is to mount the bar securely in a vise or something so you have 2 hands for the FnJ Also some bees wax or something on the guide rod to smooth its travel. Keep the chatter out of it as much as possible and file each tooth evenly. It takes practice. If possible start with an old chain you dont care much about. I took a Stihl green chain and filed it with the FnJ and holy crap does it throw nice chips now.

Good advice I do use a vice and the bees wax I have so I will try that as well.I do need to practice on an old chain your right.

 

[StructuresGuy]

Hello,

I have been reading on this forum for quite a while and have learn a bunch from all the threads. I have been considering a sharpening jig, but have not decided on one yet. So here's my question. Is the Granberg the one to get or are there other models out there that work as well?

 

[CTYank]

What's so complicated about flipping the file-holder from side to side? E.g. file the lefties, flip to the other side, then the righties. Sooooo simple. Unless you're doing chisel chain, keep guide flat side to side.

I've never seen any use for a vise to hold the bar, and just wipe the guide bar free of oil/chips. Good idea to clean file of chips regularly. Do not press file into teeth on the "rewind" either.

K.I.S.S. works well here.

Best HowTo involves knowledgeable witness to correct procedure.

 

[CTYank]

Hello,

I have been reading on this forum for quite a while and have learn a bunch from all the threads. I have been considering a sharpening jig, but have not decided on one yet. So here's my question. Is the Granberg the one to get or are there other models out there that work as well?

Oregon markets a similar guide made in Italy. You could DAGS on that and for similar info on Granberg's.

I'm still using a Granberg from the '70s so you can guess who gets my vote. (Yes, it still makes razors.)

 

[Jeff Lary]

What's so complicated about flipping the file-holder from side to side? E.g. file the lefties, flip to the other side, then the righties. Sooooo simple. Unless you're doing chisel chain, keep guide flat side to side.

I've never seen any use for a vise to hold the bar, and just wipe the guide bar free of oil/chips. Good idea to clean file of chips regularly. Do not press file into teeth on the "rewind" either.

K.I.S.S. works well here.

Best HowTo involves knowledgeable witness to correct procedure.

Well there is nothing "complicated " if it bugs you that i asked a question just dont answer i guess. I have been hand / free filing for 35 years with no issues at all.I just had this given to me today and wanted to know if anyone else noticed a diffrence from one side to another thats all. All I have ever heard is what a great rig this is and I want to be sure I was not missing somthing important as I have no instruction manual with this unit. Unlike some there are a few things in this world that I do not kown everything about I need to, or think I should know.

 

[Jeff Lary]

Oregon markets a similar guide made in Italy. You could DAGS on that and for similar info on Granberg's.

I'm still using a Granberg from the '70s so you can guess who gets my vote. (Yes, it still makes razors.)

Yes it absoultly does make razors I can see that but my left teeth are not as clean of faces as the right I can see 2 faces on the left and 1 on the right so I know that I am not as dead on when doing the left ones but I am sure they are fine and will most likely do better in the future.

 

[Philbert]

Not sure what your issues are without watching you work. We all might be assuming things, based on the way that we do it. It's a fairly simple, methodical tool that helps you maintain consistent angles. Here's how I use it:

- I normally clamp the Granberg (or similar) guide on an 'extra' bar I keep for this purpose. I have one .050 and one .063 to cover most chains.

- The 'extra' bar is clamped securely in a machinist's vise on my workbench. This keeps everything solid and secure. If I was filing on a bar still mounted on a saw, I would clamp it to the work table, or some solid surface using a filing vise, or something similar.

EDIT - replaced missing link with this update: http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/tree-machine-filing-clamps.240030/

- I adjust the top plate angle (typically 30 degrees) for the cutters on one side of the chain; set the backstop so that the file hits the cutter at the right spot (not an option on all models); adjust the height of the file so that 20% of its diameter is above the top plate. (I don't mess with the 10 degree angle as it is another thing to mess with and the differences are not significant to me. That's up to you).

- I take even strokes, trying to maintain light, even file pressure, until I get a smoothly filed cutter. Assuming that you are not cleaning up a messed up chain, it should take about the same number of strokes per cutter. Every few cutters, I loosen the wing nuts and rotate the file few degrees to get even wear and even filing.

- When one side is done, I flip the file out of the cut, loosen the top nut, rotate it around to the opposite side, and check the settings.

- On my 'extra' bar, I can rotate the machinist's vice to provide better access to the other side. On the picnic table, I can also reposition to make it more accessible or more comfortable. But I never 'push' one way and 'pull' another - this defeats the consistent, methodical thing. I don't flip the bar over with the Granberg either, although. i know some guys do this when hand filing.

So, yeah, there is some Left-Hand / Right-Hand stuff still going on, but the file holder takes care of all the angles. All I have to do is push the file smoothly. I use the same hand position on the file doing both sides of the chain.

Not sure if this helps, or if it answers your question, but that is how I use it, and how I get very consistent cutter angles with it, compared to free-hand filing.

Philbert

 

[w8ye]

I have some of the Pro Oregon ones made by Tecomec in Italy.

I work from the end of the bar and not the side.

I always file the tooth from the inside out.

A friend has a Granberg which I've used and it works just like my Oregons.

I really like the file guides and get very consistent results left and right.

 

[Jeff Lary]

Thanks Philbert
Thats the kind of stuff I can get on board with. Yea the push Pull thing is not the way to go I agree. I did think about using a spare bar also someone eariler mentioned " unless your using Chisel chain" and I am using Full Chisel chain 325 20" loops. So you dont do the angle thing hua / so yours must be set to somthing mine looked about right at ten degrees. 20% above the top of tooth now trhat may make a diffrence I will look her over you gave me lots of great advice Thamks alot. Jeff

 

[Jeff Lary]

I have some of the Pro Oregon ones made by Tecomec in Italy.

I work from the end of the bar and not the side.

I always file the tooth from the inside out.

A friend has a Granberg which I've used and it works just like my Oregons.

I really like the file guides and get very consistent results left and right.

I can see the consistancy being good

 

[Philbert]

. . .I am using Full Chisel chain 325 20" loops. So you dont do the angle thing hua / so yours must be set to somthing mine looked about right at ten degrees. 20% above the top of tooth now trhat may make a diffrence . . .

The 10 degree angle is 'standard' with round ground, full chisel chain. But it is an extra setting to change when going from the Right to the Left side when setting up a grinder or a Granberg type file guide. A lot of guys don't bother with it. I run mostly semi-chisel chain where it is not an issue. If you feel that it makes a significant difference in your cutting, then do it. But if you go back and forth, changing between 10 degrees and 0 degrees, you will waste a lot of chain life and take longer to file or grind. So maybe try it both ways and make a choice.

All the stuff about angles, file size and position, depth gauges, etc., is the same whether you are hand filing, using a jig, grinding, etc. The Granberg doesn't change any of that, it just helps you be consistent so that all of the cutters on a loop are the same. Still need the right size file. Still need a sharp file, etc. It's not automatic. But once you start getting sharp, consistent, self-feeding chains, it becomes addictive!

More info on pages 38 - 41 of this Oregon book:

OREGON Maintenance and Safety Manual

or this STIHL guide:

http://www.stihlusa.com/WebContent/CMSFileLibrary/downloads/STIHL-Sharp-Advice-Saw-Chain-Guide-Bars.pdf#search="sharp%20advice"



Philbert

 

[Jeff Lary]

So are you saying I should leave the angle at zero. I have not " noticed" a big difference in the way it cuts, I just got it yesterday and have not run the saw yet. If it can be set to zero and i will not have to change it from left to right I can do that. The diffr ence i did see was when it switched from one side to the other the file needed to be adjusted up out of the gullet as it was too low. Now when setting the guide on the saw there is no way i can see to set it up at the same hight every time? you can pinch the bar with the thumb screw when the screw gets down on the bar enough to grab the bar or you can lower it more and more untill the chain gets caught on it and will not slide through the gadget.