Ground Guys Value

[Treecutr]

I worked for 8 hours yesterday with a VERY low knowledge ground guy. IT SUCKED!! He can use a saw, but would way too often forget to keep checking up on me to see when I'm ready with next piece for him to lower, so I found myself sitting in the tree with thumb up ass. he couldn't hear me yelling over the 460 running. He kept leaving ropes and my throw line in bad spots, and eventualy, they all became tangled!, more waiting. Didn't know how to control descent of swinging pieces, no damage, but easily could have. Often while I was setting my lines, and climbing into position, he would just be watching me, instead of getting brush piled up ( don't have big chipper up yet, so piling it to chip it all in one day ). he seemed to just want to keep using saw, instead of cleaning up. Furtunatley I won't have to use him again, but his actions make me feel I didn't overpay him, thats for sure. I never had this many issues in one day. I was getting pissed, and I think he knew it. Well, I know he did because I kept swearing about crap to him. I have never done that either. I had a couple moments where I wanted to just get down, clean up, and leave for the day. AAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!

 

[danieltree]

I have had the same problem. I try to explain that first priority is me and what I am doing in the tree, its fine and good to cut stuff up and clear it but to always look up every now and again and see if I am ready for the next cut. I don't seem to be good at training from up in the tree. Its easy to get mad while in the tree, I do not ever lose my cool on the ground but do become very impatient while I am in the tree. Another bad thing is getting a ground man broke of another climbers methods. I feel your pain.​

 

[treeslayer]

He can use a saw, but would way too often forget to keep checking up on me to see when I'm ready with next piece for him to lower, so I found myself sitting in the tree with thumb up ass. he couldn't hear me yelling over the 460 running.

You let him (the only ground man) run a saw while you were up?
your fault. with a 2 man crew, get it down, clear the dance floor if needed, and clean it up together when you're down.

The ropes? Give orders and mean it, every time you see them getting twisted. tangled ropes hurt YOU.

I've had fantastic GM's, and pi$$ poor ones, My God what a difference, but I'll drop out the tree in the blink of an eye and lay down the law quick on one ignoring me or risking my well being.

Glad you don't have to deal with him anymore, takes months sometimes to break in a guy and train him, and ya gotta pay em good.

 

[lxt]

This I dont get, I hear stories of terrible groundies doing this or that. number 1- why did you hire him? why would you do a job with a new groundie that requires that which you dont know if he is capable of doing?

This is where in my opinion its not the dumb azz groundie...its the dumb azz owner/company, the attitude of hiring a guy under the table at $10 an hr & reaping the windfall is the attitude of many guys in my area, the problem is when you need the experienced ground guy to work with you......he`s working for someone who pays him well & appreciates him!!

If you go out with a ground guy or new hire that you have never seen work & then because you think he sucks you wanna complain about him...your the one with a problem!!!! you just got what you deserved!


LXT............unless im missing something??????

 

[Treecutr]

This I dont get, I hear stories of terrible groundies doing this or that. number 1- why did you hire him? why would you do a job with a new groundie that requires that which you dont know if he is capable of doing?

This is where in my opinion its not the dumb azz groundie...its the dumb azz owner/company, the attitude of hiring a guy under the table at $10 an hr & reaping the windfall is the attitude of many guys in my area, the problem is when you need the experienced ground guy to work with you......he`s working for someone who pays him well & appreciates him!!

If you go out with a ground guy or new hire that you have never seen work & then because you think he sucks you wanna complain about him...your the one with a problem!!!! you just got what you deserved!


.

LXT............unless im missing something??????

Yeah, missing a little more info I gues. I had no option but to use him, it's my normal guys son too. Also job HAD to be done yesterday because power company was there to have lines down for me on that day only until 4PM. Hard enough to get them out as is. Also I had told him he could do a little cleanup while I got set, but he just got carried away with working away, and forgot to chek up. So dumb azz owner, maybe LOL wasn't a matter of trting to be cheap, just trying to use the available resources I had on hand

 

[lxt]

Got it!! I know how that can be, weve all been there!

BUT....Be careful & take care!


LXT.............

 

[danieltree]

This I dont get, I hear stories of terrible groundies doing this or that. number 1- why did you hire him? why would you do a job with a new groundie that requires that which you dont know if he is capable of doing?

This is where in my opinion its not the dumb azz groundie...its the dumb azz owner/company, the attitude of hiring a guy under the table at $10 an hr & reaping the windfall is the attitude of many guys in my area, the problem is when you need the experienced ground guy to work with you......he`s working for someone who pays him well & appreciates him!!

If you go out with a ground guy or new hire that you have never seen work & then because you think he sucks you wanna complain about him...your the one with a problem!!!! you just got what you deserved!


LXT............unless im missing something??????

Ground guys and rope men are not born that way they are trained, Its not the pay but finding the guys that have enough sense to do the job that are not on dope and dont all ready have another job. If you find another ground guy thats got enough experiance he does not have to be trained or told what to do chances are he is the Dumb AZZ in the tree. Guys change jobs so I have to train one from scratch every now and then. Its not the pay. Pay is good once you show me you can hold your own and are worth the investment.​

 

[RAG66]

I know I'm new here but I do have 15 yrs. climbimg expirience. and 4 years full time company. What I did to curb the difficulty of the new guy was to invest in a communication system. This is a substantial investment, but it is the only way I have been able to make it as far as I have. When things start to go haywire all I have to do is push the button and say STOP right now and do whatever it is that I need. I have 2 great ground guys now but the list of bad ones is long and very frustrating. So if you want to, look into the PELTOR Power comm. Mine is worn on the PETZEL Vertex vented helmet. When the chipper is runing full on and guy#1 is runing a saw guy#2 can hear me say what I need. NO yelling, screaming, or red faces!

 

[Rftreeman]

this is how it would go as soon as we got there..

"first things first, I'm in control, listen to what I say and you'll be just fine, I'll tell you every move you need to make and when you can run the saw, when you are running the saw look up at me about every third or fourth cut cause I will most likely be ready to make a cut and you'll have to lower the piece and never and i mean never walk under me without looking up, do not to get the ropes tangled or caught up in the brush, ok, did you understand all that, ok, let's work"

after he pissed me off by not doing as we discussed...

"cut that ####ing saw off, untangle my ####ing rope and listen to what the #### I'm saying so we can get this done and if you don't then I'll come down and kick your ####ing ass gotdamnit"

something like that....lol

 

[highpointtree]

Interesting

I own the company and have been a climber and every other part of the business you can think of. when my climber is climbing and I happen to work the ground I cater to him 100 %, but when he's in the bucket and trying to bury us with brush I have a way of ignoring him (and staying safe LOL). So we don't get buried in brush. I look up enough to know he see's me in his way. if I don't do this, I won't get a chance to keep up. anyway, I'm not a newbe, and I have years of experience controlling the climber or bucket operator this way...

there is a groundman's handbook and its pretty darn good too. try looking up, How to become an excellent groundman.. good luck...just checked the link and its bad. I have a copy from a few years ago. I will try to scan it and post it in a couple days. worth the read

 

[tree md]

I have one guy dedicated to ropes and that's all he does when I am in the tree besides dragging limbs. I have another guy who is dedicated to running the saw and others to drag brush if I need them.

Rope guys are a little different than your other hands, at least for me. I put a lot of trust in my rope man and will sometimes have him belay for me. If he lets go of the rope, I'm dead. Takes a lot of trust in a guy to do that. It is kind of a bonding thing I do with the guys once I trust them enough to hold my life line. I look them in the eye and make sure they know that they have my life in their hands when I tell them to belay. Seems to make our bond stronger. I have 2 now that I trust with my life. Tree work is different than a lot of other types of work. You get closer with your guys. Your lives often depend on each other.

Some guys are not ever going to be able to do anything other than drag brush and some are going to be good at whatever they lay their hand to. You just have to weed out the slow ones and work to develop the good ones. When I can, I try to put both to work as long as they're not lazy and try.

As far as pay. I always pay my guys well. Even when they screw up. They usually do feel overpaid but when I do well I share the wealth. Funny how a hundred dollar bill can motivate guys to show up for work when needed and instill loyalty.

 

[Bounty Hunter]

I have one guy dedicated to ropes and that's all he does when I am in the tree besides dragging limbs. I have another guy who is dedicated to running the saw and others to drag brush if I need them.

Rope guys are a little different than your other hands, at least for me. I put a lot of trust in my rope man and will sometimes have him belay for me. If he lets go of the rope, I'm dead. Takes a lot of trust in a guy to do that. It is kind of a bonding thing I do with the guys once I trust them enough to hold my life line. I look them in the eye and make sure they know that they have my life in their hands when I tell them to belay. Seems to make our bond stronger. I have 2 now that I trust with my life. Tree work is different than a lot of other types of work. You get closer with your guys. Your lives often depend on each other.

Some guys are not ever going to be able to do anything other than drag brush and some are going to be good at whatever they lay their hand to. You just have to weed out the slow ones and work to develop the good ones. When I can, I try to put both to work as long as they're not lazy and try.

As far as pay. I always pay my guys well. Even when they screw up. They usually do feel overpaid but when I do well I share the wealth. Funny how a hundred dollar bill can motivate guys to show up for work when needed and instill loyalty.

:agree2:

Making your guys trust you, and feel good about what they are doing, and do a faithful and competent job, relies a lot on how you treat them...personally and finacially.
Telling them they have "done good", and rewarding them for it goes a long way more than yelling at them and pi$$ing them off.

The old saying "Attitude is Everything" means a lot when the crew has to trust each other with their lives!

Good Luck and Be Safe Brother,

Bounty Hunter

 

[ozarktreeman]

You let him (the only ground man) run a saw while you were up?
your fault. with a 2 man crew, get it down, clear the dance floor if needed, and clean it up together when you're down.

The ropes? Give orders and mean it, every time you see them getting twisted. tangled ropes hurt YOU.

I've had fantastic GM's, and pi$$ poor ones, My God what a difference, but I'll drop out the tree in the blink of an eye and lay down the law quick on one ignoring me or risking my well being.

Glad you don't have to deal with him anymore, takes months sometimes to break in a guy and train him, and ya gotta pay em good.

:agree2: