I'm gettin' tired of this!!

[ropensaddle]

grow as business grows

When I first asked a small sucessfull businesman what the key to making it in any business..the most important thing I asked, he replied "Grow as your business grows". This is not directed at the above poster, but I have seen so many times guys get into the biz, buy all this expensive equipment, max out credit cards...and then it gets slow.....and then they sweat...the bank comes a knockin'. To blame it on hacks underbidding in my humble opinion is a lame excuse (again, not directed at anyone in particular).

If you make smart choices, keep your feet on the ground, work hard and ethically, you'll be fine. If all your equipment is paid for, and you have low overhead, you have the advantage of keeping your sanity when things get slow or you're in a slump. If you stick with it, it will turn around.

When I was The "pickup" guy, many times I would see competition walking up as soon as I left, to give a second, third bid.......these guys always had the new trucks...etc. I could give a lower bid, make money and laugh at these guys...while they sat there wondering "Why can't I get the jobs ?" The only difference between me and them was I had low overhead, an almost obsessive desire to make my biz a winner, and I owed no one.

In my view "cut-throats, who steal work" is called capitalism, if they are playing by the rules and are qualified and knowledgable. Let's face it, swim with the sharks.......change in an instant, turn on a dime. Blaming your business failure to "hacks" who under bid you (again, not meant for a specific poster) is an attitude sure to help you go belly up. I prefer to look at what I can do to beat my competition, and it's not that hard when I see these guys riding around in new pickup trucks, leased....with quizzical looks on thier faces.....lol, while a half a million dollars in equipment sits in the yard ready to go......back to the bank. Lol. Just my 3 cents.

You are giving good advice there, but I climbed and stacked on a trailer nearly two years before buying a bucket and have used equipment! Also; I agree it is not the hacks and to me, its the greedy people who use the cheapest bid and they get what they pay for usually! My customer base all call me back< and referral work is good but, have lost income due to circumstances beyond control and been thrusted in full time; and finding it hard to compete with,
price shopping crowd who doesn't compare apples!!If there were enough of the other customers where I live I would be in great shape.
I bought equipment while working for a twelve year employer who became unhealthy to work for , and when I purchased the equipment it was because i was burning out and needed easier methods of getting work done !!! With both jobs my purchases were a breeze and was growing fine and didn't have to work for the cheapskates ! I will make it I just feel the risks and all should be better compensated I do not throw caution to the wind and try to make sound decisions on money matters I however live in under paid over taxed state.
I am not getting younger and have put in time and try to stay positive but so much money goes to people who do nothing and get big returns they keep the little guy down and thats where I'm coming from!!opcorn:

 

[treevet]

Ropeandsaddle you mentioned insurance and having no claims. I mentioned to Ins co the same thing a while back and his answer was "you re due for one then". Alot of complaints about bad competition thru this thread. Better than having real good competition. I don t want to sound aloof but I wouldn t want to have me for competition around here. I want to kick my comp s ass every day. Along time ago I decided to dedicate myself to learning. I studied every night and when Shigo came along it became much easier. I wrote down a list of all the dream equipment I wanted and year after year I have gotten it. It is all used but it is all paid for and not a liability but an asset (not overhead). It is constantly improved and sometimes replaced and upgraded.Work is not so hard anymore but sort of a choreography of equipment in and out. It works bcs I don t travel far and old stuff doesn t travel so well. I am in a wealthy uppermiddle class area and they all know me. The first thing being done right is being on this forum and looking for answers. Complaining and whining is not the answer. I live in a neighborhood w doctors and lawyers and pilots and I am just a me and another guy tree svc. The biggest key to my improvement was sobriety. Things have gotten drastically better every year for 17 plus years now.

 

[Timberhauler]

I'm well too established to actually be worrying about jacklegs...It just got overly frustrating during this past slow season when there were several of them trying to bum stuff off of me in one way or another...Then they always seemed busy,while we were twiddling our thumbs,and I was paying a few of my guys to come in and clean out trucks,wash them and help me with my yard work...Things have done a 180 in the last week,and now I am about two weeks behind.....I don't have to worry about the bank showing up at my door to reclaim anything...It's all paid for.I've stayed as small as I possibly could over the years,and it's paid off,and is less of a headache.

 

[treevet]

I know what you mean. Sometimes in the darkest hours of your slow period you can t help but wonder if anyone is (ever) going to call you again. It s real hard to sell work then.

 

[ropensaddle]

Ropeandsaddle you mentioned insurance and having no claims. I mentioned to Ins co the same thing a while back and his answer was "you re due for one then". Alot of complaints about bad competition thru this thread. Better than having real good competition. I don t want to sound aloof but I wouldn t want to have me for competition around here. I want to kick my comp s ass every day. Along time ago I decided to dedicate myself to learning. I studied every night and when Shigo came along it became much easier. I wrote down a list of all the dream equipment I wanted and year after year I have gotten it. It is all used but it is all paid for and not a liability but an asset (not overhead). It is constantly improved and sometimes replaced and upgraded.Work is not so hard anymore but sort of a choreography of equipment in and out. It works bcs I don t travel far and old stuff doesn t travel so well. I am in a wealthy uppermiddle class area and they all know me. The first thing being done right is being on this forum and looking for answers. Complaining and whining is not the answer. I live in a neighborhood w doctors and lawyers and pilots and I am just a me and another guy tree svc. The biggest key to my improvement was sobriety. Things have gotten drastically better every year for 17 plus years now.

Hey I didn't mean to sound as if I was whining but you may have a point after rereading post!
I didn't create the topic just understand it,and I'm the few companies in my neighborhood that doesn't mention topping in their ads so when my competition gets educated you may have a point.
I try very hard to keep my reputation for ethics and fair business practicesuntarnished and am a member of the bbb .
Customer told me I was the only one out of 22 that had this distinction. I to had a blessed day and am goin strong for next week so maybe its picked up again!!??:greenchainsaw:

 

[ropensaddle]

Ropeandsaddle you mentioned insurance and having no claims. I mentioned to Ins co the same thing a while back and his answer was "you re due for one then". Alot of complaints about bad competition thru this thread. Better than having real good competition. I don t want to sound aloof but I wouldn t want to have me for competition around here. I want to kick my comp s ass every day. Along time ago I decided to dedicate myself to learning. I studied every night and when Shigo came along it became much easier. I wrote down a list of all the dream equipment I wanted and year after year I have gotten it. It is all used but it is all paid for and not a liability but an asset (not overhead). It is constantly improved and sometimes replaced and upgraded.Work is not so hard anymore but sort of a choreography of equipment in and out. It works bcs I don t travel far and old stuff doesn t travel so well. I am in a wealthy uppermiddle class area and they all know me. The first thing being done right is being on this forum and looking for answers. Complaining and whining is not the answer. I live in a neighborhood w doctors and lawyers and pilots and I am just a me and another guy tree svc. The biggest key to my improvement was sobriety. Things have gotten drastically better every year for 17 plus years now.

Congrads on sobriety I too have been sober thirteen years
and is the only way I would ever have made it through slow times and it means more to me than anything even my business.

 

[treeslayer666]

Thank god for repeat & referals

You guys should see the hacks around here. 2 or 3 years experiance with half page adds in the yellowpages, junk for equipment, minimum if any insurance, again NO EXPERIANCE, and they will cut your throat in a minute. These guys actually ask the cutomer what their cheapest price is!!! These guys have no ethics. They come and go around here but the new yellowpages that just came out says it all ANOTHER YEAR OF THE CUTTHROATS.
I see some so called "tree services" doing jobs I bid, half day jobs, takes them 2 days. Full long day jobs ( 10 hours ) takes them all week!!
I dont get it. They work 7 days a week to make what I do in a day.
Again thank god I can make a living off referals and repeat customer because if your bidding against these clowns in the yellowpages to survive, you will be out of buisness in no time.

 

[Mtnman4ever]

I do know wher both sides are cokefr0m and itcanbe cutthroat

I stated out clearoinf landandselling fire wood nevr got out of sellijgfire wood Istill do not as much but i have a enopugh to get a new toy eer saw ,camera , pay for month vacation !
I stated smnall too kon jobs no oneelsewanted got alot crappy cleintw s learned why no onewantedthjob crapy unralistc cleint or cleint not willingot pay a fair proce . yeah I got brunt i wenved they guys with buckettrucks untill i discoived climbing . I do notany mor3. and i figures Mhmm ican go where the bucket can't .
I got betterstuff biggrsaws . and wnet on from ter Nowi am changing agqaon still cutting but not as much like Ralph . Afeter m injury I decided toslowdown . mayb do work with PNW timberfallers . they seem to have a intersting setup.

ten tere is he hack been brunt a fewtimesby th same guy . who underbids every one . but he go his . as he widid 1k to fall a 100 ft whtie pine with lean that was right over the neighbors house . i had a plan andevery thing they jerk client even set u a day well aii arriveto see this lid witha Sthil MS 460 with 20 inch bar tringot fall this tyng with putsome muchas a rope or wedge i asked what happend hesaid hey he isdoing it for 200! . WTF Iaskeis he insured? wel not he say he has lots os experince ? ok wht ewver i left mad a hell told heim what hecopuldod to himself .
any eway abpout tow hours later i get a call abut takinga white p9ne that some kid dropend inot a house .aferigothe adressi said yeah for 5 k at minum.
Kid did 20k owrth of damge it isstill incourt . . and he is still cutting !

and i see this


on craigslist

http://nh.craigslist.org/bar/293046453.html


Ill adertise toclear lots and fall trees . but i also ask aprice and will not cut up someguys wood pile .10 years? m who knows
but it is that easy .:angry2: