McCulloch Chain Saws

[edju1958]

Back a couple weeks ago I posted about a 10-10A I have that would ding like a dinner bell when trying to start it & when it ran on a prime.No one here could figure it out,although there was one member here who belongs to another forum as I do.Another member on the other forum pointed out to me that the spring guides were missing,& of course the other member here had to maker himself look clever & posted here what the other member had posted on the other forum.The member here was only being a parrot.I have found him to be quite the liar & can't be trusted.
As for the clutch ringing like a dinner bell,I never did find out what the causde was,but I think I nmight be onto something.I took the clutch off the saw that rang like a dinner bell & put it on another saw along with the starter & had absolutely no issues at all.The saw pulls over just fine & ran on a prime without any dinner bell noises.In the process of taking the clutch off the dinner bell saw I heard some noise that didn't sound right on the flywheel side & pulled the cover off to find the flywheel was loose.No,the flywheel wasn';t making the dinner bell noise.The woodruff key was not a tight fit in either the flywheel or the crankshaft slot.The flywheel must've loosened up in it's previous running time before I got the saw,& wallowed out the slot on the crank & in the flywheel.I went to the hardware store today to see if I could get a wider woodruff key that'd fit.I found one,but it's too long for the slot on the crank. About the only way to solve the wallowed out slot in the crank is to change the crank,IMO it's not worth it.Does anyone have any ideas as to how to remedy the walowed out slot in the crank?Parrots need not reply.

 

[Maintenance supervisor]

Back a couple weeks ago I posted about a 10-10A I have that would ding like a dinner bell when trying to start it & when it ran on a prime.No one here could figure it out,although there was one member here who belongs to another forum as I do.Another member on the other forum pointed out to me that the spring guides were missing,& of course the other member here had to maker himself look clever & posted here what the other member had posted on the other forum.The member here was only being a parrot.I have found him to be quite the liar & can't be trusted.
As for the clutch ringing like a dinner bell,I never did find out what the causde was,but I think I nmight be onto something.I took the clutch off the saw that rang like a dinner bell & put it on another saw along with the starter & had absolutely no issues at all.The saw pulls over just fine & ran on a prime without any dinner bell noises.In the process of taking the clutch off the dinner bell saw I heard some noise that didn't sound right on the flywheel side & pulled the cover off to find the flywheel was loose.No,the flywheel wasn';t making the dinner bell noise.The woodruff key was not a tight fit in either the flywheel or the crankshaft slot.The flywheel must've loosened up in it's previous running time before I got the saw,& wallowed out the slot on the crank & in the flywheel.I went to the hardware store today to see if I could get a wider woodruff key that'd fit.I found one,but it's too long for the slot on the crank. About the only way to solve the wallowed out slot in the crank is to change the crank,IMO it's not worth it.Does anyone have any ideas as to how to remedy the walowed out slot in the crank?Parrots need not reply.

My sp81 has a chunk of the crank missing next to the flywheel key Ed, I cleaned everything up with alcohol and put a spot of lock tite on the shaft before snugging the nut down.
As the key only indexes the flywheel for timing and the taper of the crankshaft is what actually holds the flywheel at some point it was loose enough to beat on the key.

 

[Syncop8r]

Back a couple weeks ago I posted about a 10-10A I have that would ding like a dinner bell when trying to start it & when it ran on a prime.No one here could figure it out,although there was one member here who belongs to another forum as I do.Another member on the other forum pointed out to me that the spring guides were missing,& of course the other member here had to maker himself look clever & posted here what the other member had posted on the other forum.The member here was only being a parrot.I have found him to be quite the liar & can't be trusted.

Your clutch is missing both #15s for one thing (as mentioned in another forum).

View attachment 930819

 

[mogulmasher]

As maintenance supervisor said put a bit of loctite on taper before installation. Use red loctite as it can also be used as a bearing retainer so it should lock flywheel in place once it's torqued down. On a LH start saw twist the flywheel clockwise to load it against the loose woodruff key before tightening.

 

[edju1958]

I appreciate MS & MM replying to my dilemma with the woodruff key situation.If I put red loctite on the flywheel wouldn't that be a real bugger to get off again if I needed to?I looked at the IPL & saw that Mac used the same key on the flywheel & the clutch.I thought perhaps someone who'd worked on the saw before me might've gotten the 2 keys mixed up,but not the case.

 

[mogulmasher]

To be honest it'll hold it, but typically flywheel torqued onto a tapered shaft is going to come apart hard even without loctite. If needed though a little heat applied from a propane torch will soften loctite and release it.

 

[heimannm]

Rather than using LocTite, start by lapping the flywheel to the crankshaft. Use some very fine valve lapping compound if you can find it, or some good old fashioned toothpaste to make sure the crankshaft and flywheel are seating properly. It could take 10, 20, or 30 minutes of lapping depending on how badly the shaft & flywheel were bunged up before you caught it. Then using the key as a guide to line things up install the flywheel and properly torque the retaining nut, I think the factory specification was 360 in/lbs. As others have noted, the key is only there to align the flywheel in the proper location and the taper keeps the flywheel from moving when properly tightened down.

I have encountered a few saws with chipped keyways on both flywheel and PTO sides and provided there is around 80% of the shaft remaining they won't come loose if the nut is properly torqued.

Mark

 

[mogulmasher]

On more modern saws timing can be advanced by shaving material off the woodruff key and then loading flywheel against the key in the direction needed to advance the timing. As MS and Mark said it's more there to align flywheel for timing, machined taper holds it on.

I play with and mod a lot of sleds. Primary clutches on sleds have no key, just a taper that mates with the crankshaft taper. They rarely ever come loose.....and I've had a 240hp mod sled spinning to 10k.

 

[edju1958]

Something I forgot to mention - the retaining nut on the flywheel was not the correct one.I've noticed that almost all of the 10 series saws used a flange nut.I suppose ya could get away with a regular nut,but it'd need a lockwasher.There was no lockwasherr under the nut.I'll have to hunt up another woodruff key,I used the one that was on the saw for the other saw's clutch.Mark,or anyone else,would you know the correct size woodruff key that was used in the 10 series flywheels & clutches?

 

[heimannm]

1/8 x 3/8 for the woodruff key.

Mark

 

[edju1958]

1/8 x 3/8 for the woodruff key.

Mark

Thanks Mark! That explains why the 1/8x1/2 key I picked up yesterday was too big.

 

[heimannm]

1/8 x 1/2 is a standard #3 key, the 1/8 x 3/8 is a 213 if I remember correctly. Still a standard size but less common.

Mark

 

[edju1958]

1/8 x 1/2 is a standard #3 key, the 1/8 x 3/8 is a 213 if I remember correctly. Still a standard size but less common.

Mark

Yes Mark,the 1/8x3/8 is a #213 & it is less common I'm finding out.Why was it that Mac & the other big saw mfrs.of the day used such odd ball sizes in the production of their saws?Maybe because those odd ball sizes were being phased out & they got a good deal on them?

 

[PogoInTheWoods]

key I picked up yesterday was too big.

File it. Then file this.

The member here was only being a parrot.I have found him to be quite the liar & can't be trusted.

You've chosen to troll some pretty deep water there, Ed -- even for you.

As was pointed out, I clearly acknowledged that the missing retainers had already been brought up in the other discussion. So what? I only brought it up here because both forums ended up addressing the same subject(s) and not everyone subscribes to both. But for those who do, and speaking of parrots, the woodruff key/keyway issue was also touched on in the other thread. Not quite the same context, but close enough to cast a similarly ridiculous aspersion. What's good for the goose should also be good for the gander (or parrot), shouldn't it? Pure hypocrisy and bull$hit at its finest and deepest.

We also observed a rather spectacular exhibition of behavior that can only be described as a public juvenile meltdown of epic proportions due to you simply misunderstanding a couple of posts and/or taking them personally when they were not meant that way -- all after you showed up in the Mac thread over there whining about being ignored over here in the first place..., which is ridiculous anyway. I actually responded with a fairly thorough post about the muffler issue you were experiencing on whatever 10-10 you were struggling with at the time before also then trying to contribute toward a solution for your 'dinner bell' problem in both forums...

...liar & can't be trusted

... just to be treated with the above.

That more than crosses the line, Ed. It's also an absurd statement. But I hafta hand it to ya. What you may occasionally lack in chainsaw knowledge (and general common sense), you more than make up for with your exceptional bridge-burning skills.

Well done. And thank you.

 

[PogoInTheWoods]

BTW, flywheel and crank surfaces should be as clean as possible for the tightest and strongest possible fit -- key or no key. Anything between the surfaces will tend to diminish the integrity of the attachment.

 

[mogulmasher]

Yep, having it clean is key. I always wipe both surfaces with acetone before install.

 

[edju1958]

Poge,I didn't mention your name to keep things civil,but you have chosen to show your ignorance as a human being (term used loosely)Any post that was made on the other forum about a Woodruff key was obviously posted before I even showed up there with my clutch problem.When I stated I was being ignored here I felt I was.I don't think it should take 2-3 days for someone to reply to a simple question.Obviously ya have to belong to a clique to get an answer & I'm a lone wolf,always have been.And if you remember correctly (obviously you don't),I made an apology to the offended party & you had to put your 2 cents in just so you could have the last word.I guess that's how you are though (who's juienile now?)To keep things civil & moving on with chainsaws I'll ignore any further comments from you & ask that you stay out of any of my posts as I will stay out of yours.I don't internd to carry on a useless pissing match.And you can take your idle threats & file them where the sun don't shine.You chose to make this all public & not keep it to a PM level.Obviously apologies mean nothing to you.

 

[edju1958]

Today was not a good day for me physically.I didn't get out to work on mmy saws till 3:00p.m.I picked up where I left off on Sat.with a PM10-10A (my newest creation).I've been taking the tank handles off older 10-10A saws & replacing them with PM 10-10 tank handles to eliminate the curved air filter problem,or should I say the lack of.My first attempt at doing one resulted in the clutch ringing like a dinner bell (I'm still weorking on that one).The 2nd one turned out to be a good runner,& now this is the 3rd one that I completed today.I worked on it Sat.& I couldn't get the throttle linkage rod to hook into the throttle trigger.I must've cussed at it for 45 min.before I finally called it quits fort the day (630 p.m.)Today I picked the saw up & used a smaller needle nose pliers & the rod almost fell into place.I had put the carb on this saw that was on my first attempted saw & it fired up & ran great! Here are some pics.

 

[vinnywv]

Looks like a right hand start pm55. Like the black tanks.

 

[edju1958]

Looks like a right hand start pm55. Like the black tanks.

Yeah,that tank handle came from a PM55.So,maybe this saw is a PM55-10-10A?LolI can make a Frankensaw too Vinny.