Newbie Questions on Milling with a Chainsaw Mill (homemade)

[n8ghz]

More days off from the build, this time to go gather up some fodder for the mill. A friend had 4 big Pines taken down, and knowing that I intend to try milling, he had the tree guy leave the logs in 8-10' lengths on the ground. These trees were ~60 high, and a neighbor had one taken down too, an 80+ footer. So I get them all. I spent all day today trimming the branch nubs down for potentential milling. Had I not commited to getting these, I would have ran my first log today, as it was a very nice day. I have hauled about 6 of the smaller diameter logs home (~10-12" dia.), so when i complete my obligation to get the rest of them out of their yards, I will be good to go for a few cuts...or I should say LOTS of cuts.

I am anxious....and sore from limb-lopping all day.

 

[Old Blue]

Go man go ! !

You're close. Lets see it.

Old Blue
Perma screwed by beaurobastards in...
Kali-bone-ya

 

[n8ghz]

Today was the day to try this thing...and it actually WORKS. !!! hu-rah.
Ran the first couple of knot removing cuts to test leveling, pushing it by hand...in both directions. Woo....cutting off of the top of bar put a thick layer of chips along the side of my bucket truck about 2" thick....so I moved the truck.

I had to go load a few more of the pines I had commited to getting and got 4 more.....7 to go and they are getting bigger & bigger.

I unloaded those and went back to playing with the sawmill. I had enough of manually pushing, with the sticky pine chips all over me and the truck, so I put the motor drive on it.....now we're talking......just watch it go.
Next I added the pressurized aux oiler, after adjusting the chain for the first time....it works dandy as well, I only lost 5psi during 3 cuts.

I had an audience and one of the guys made a video of it sawing,oiling,auto feeding,etc.
He is supposed to send it to me tonite, & I will post it if I can. Or it'll go on u-tube with a link.

If it doesn't rain tomorrow I'll have another guy here to grab more video.

 

[Old Blue]

Wooo Hoooo

That sounds great!! And it doesn't sound like you had any glitches stop the run. Gotta love that! Hope your bud sends ya the video cause after watching the can crusher I'm chomping at the bit to watch it.

Old Blue
Where the theiving government makes the James Gang look like a bunch of Cubscouts in....
Kali-bone-ya

 

[n8ghz]

Yes, I was very happy to see it make full length cuts on the first try. I had expected to have more issues.
The guy that ran the video on his phone is having trouble sending it...too big or something? I'll get it off of his phone the next time he is here, but he works for a living, so I don't know when that'll happen?

Yesterday was a lousy rain day, so nothing done.

Today is warm, but dreary with a 30% chance of rain. I will try to do 'something'.....weather permitting.
I may drag a computer outside so I can take a few more pictures and try grabbing a video using my archaic webcam.

You can look at my webpage under "when will it cut", for a blow-by-blow of my experiences & thoughts from the last few recent days and what I hope to work on today.

 

[n8ghz]

Yesterday turned out to be too nice to fool with a computer outside, so I just played with the machine. I finished off the first log, and learned a few more things as I got down to the last 2 or 3 cuts. I only cut a 2 sided cant, so when I cut boards, I have bark on both sides, which makes them wider than if I had cut 4 sides to begin with. I became limited by the 20" bar (15" cut) and my outboard bar support started to get in the way. It was also getting too close to my holding dog screws,etc. (the log table is 20" wide). But I did manage to finish the first log, though.

Then I removed that saw, and replaced it with one with a 28" bar. That eliminated any of the bar support interference with the dogs...issues.

I put a new, bigger, log on the table, and tried the new 28" saw. It has a new skip chain on it, and It didn't cut as fast as the non-skip 20", even in narrow width starter cuts.

I only made the 2 sided cant, and cut one board. That was when I quit for the day.

Today I plan to make a ripping chain for the 28". I don't have any other chain to make for it unless I splice a couple of chisel chains from a 16" to be 92 drive links, so....we'll see if the ripping chain helps the 28" saw?

 

[n8ghz]

Having trouble with these Iphone videos....too big to email to me from their phone.

But here is a short one that was small enough to get it to me.

This is near the end of a cut on a 12" width, using ripping chain that I made this morning.

[video=youtube;b8Xqb5V--Qg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b8Xqb5V--Qg&feature=channel[/video]

Not much of a video, but better than nothing, I hope.....

 

[scor440]

If you set the saw at a 10 degree angle without power feed it will pull it self through the log?

 

[Old Blue]

Looks Great

........But aren't you supposed to be sitting in a lawn chair drinking a beer?:cool2: Can't wait till shes all dialed in. Congrats, thats cool !

Old Blue
Tyrannically taxed, fee'd and permitted for the benefit of others in ...
Kali-bone-ya

 

[n8ghz]

If you set the saw at a 10 degree angle without power feed it will pull it self through the log?

There is a gearmotor w/custom made winch moving it via a 3/32" SS cable, and it is reversible. I cut both directions, that cut is off of the bar top. When that finishes, I clear the board off, raise the log, and go back cutting off of the bar bottom.

 

[n8ghz]

Just finished a cut off of bar bottom.

View attachment 229027

 

[n8ghz]

Another view of cut finished running off of bar bottom.

View attachment 229028

 

[n8ghz]

A short log.....might as well be a post?

View attachment 229102


I will be posting a decent video of a full 8'-6" board which is 19" wide thru the knotted parts......14" wide otherwise.....1" thick cut. It should be full screen, not blocked black on sides like the poor one posted yesterday.

 

[n8ghz]

Finally....a decent Video....

1" thick, 14-19" wide, 8'-6" long.....power feeding on bottom of the 28" bar with ripping chain.

[video=youtube;P1k8iHbm7JM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1k8iHbm7JM[/video]

Tomorrow, need to go get the last 7 logs...the biggest ones diameter-wise.
That'll be 23 logs to play with.....3 CSM'd so far....20 to go.
Then we will try some maple and cherry.

 

[mad murdock]

Pretty kewl riggin'you got there!

 

[BobL]

Given the power you have available, for a 14 - 19" wide cut I would expect it to cut faster than 0.25 "/sec.
My guess is the cutting speed is chain limited. What depth rakers are you running?

By way of comparison, mtngun gets more than 0.3"/sec using a 660 at altitude in softwoods for similar width cuts to yours.
I think on some cuts he can get 0.35"/sec which means he really knows how to sharpen his chains

The last time I timed something was when I was milling a silky oak (about as hard as red oak) and I was getting 0.28 to 0.31 "/sec for a cutting width of around 24" using my 880.
I can get 0.25 "/sec in green hardwood (and I mean hard, as hard as dry hickory) around 20" wide if I keep the chain sharp.

Do you know about progressive raker depth setting?
If not it will pay you to find out about it if you want to maintain cutting speed as the chain wears.
CS milling is not just about applied power, the sharpness and profile of the cutter is critical to maintaining cutting speeds.

The other think that surprises me is the amount of noise it makes, somehow I was expecting it to be a lot quieter. I guess those of us using a conventional powerhead don't appreciate how much noise a chain makes when it cuts wood.

At those small cutting widths I reckon you'd have been better off all around connecting the engine from the hydraulic power supply direct to a bandsaw.

Still, as mad murdock says "a very kewl rig"

 

[n8ghz]

Thanks BobL, I'm glad to see you post again in my thread, I thought you were mad at me, and am happy to hear your advice once again.

I dont' know anything about chain. I made this chain yesterday (first chain ever). It is an out-of the reel, Carlton ripping chain.......3/8" .050. The cut in the latest video is after ...i didn't count.....at least 4-5 cuts on similar widths. I have not touched the chain since making it yesterday. I did tighten it this morning before playing today, but that is all I did to it.
This pine was alive a month ago, if that matters?

I will surely need to get any/all info on chain sharpening techniques......because this is just FUN to do......you guys told me it would be....

& thanks to all who did so.

John

 

[BobL]

Thanks BobL, I'm glad to see you post again in my thread, I thought you were mad at me, and am happy to hear your advice once again.

Not mad, just a bit frustrated, mainly because I found it hard to make any sense out of your photos - they were all detail and at no stage did you show elements of the whole rig so I could see the big picture. Anyway - the vid is very clear and I'm glad to see you got it running - you can only make it go faster from here.

I dont' know anything about chain.

Well this is definitely a good place to learn about it!

I made this chain yesterday (first chain ever). It is an out-of the reel, Carlton ripping chain.......3/8" .050. The cut in the latest video is after ...i didn't count.....at least 4-5 cuts on similar widths. I have not touched the chain since making it yesterday. I did tighten it this morning before playing today, but that is all I did to it.

OK - chain straight off a reel or from the shop may not be that sharp and can use a touch up. I touch up my chains after about every 32 sq ft of cut in hardwood and 64 sq ft of softwood whether it needs it or not. That the equivalent of 5 x 18" wide cuts 8'6" long so you should be touching up before your next cuts.
Forget feel, sharp cutters is about removing cutter glint (see here for some examples). The cutter edge should have zero glint on it for it to be working correctly.
The next thing to worry about is hook - for a detailed discussion see here. The hook is what makes a cutter self feed, which BTW will fight your setup for driving the bar.
Next there is progressive raker setting. for some details see the sticky in the "EquipmentForums/Hot Saws/Chain Sharpening" forum.
Other than that ask questions.
If you have the power available you can run very low rakers to improve cutting speed. The guys with Lucas mill slabbers can run their rakers very low (ie >0.050") and they get ~0.5"/sec cutting speed The increase in chain vibe is very significant. If you plan on doing this I would slowly increase the raker depth as it may shake your bar hanging out in the breeze setup too much. A carriage type mill with the bar held at both ends reduces this problem a little.

This pine was alive a month ago, if that matters?

It shouldn't really matter

I will surely need to get any/all info on chain sharpening techniques......because this is just FUN to do......you guys told me it would be....

Yes it is VERY absorbing. As one of my mates said, every time you cut a new slab the anticipation is like being a kid Xmas.

 

[BobL]

I just noticed it looks like you have the aux oil delivery point on the tip of the bar nose?
If so, thene th chain will flick some of the oil off the bar while the bar goes around the remaining 1/4 circle of the nose.
Less oil will be lost if the oil delivery point is located after the chain has gone around the nose.

 

[n8ghz]

I just noticed it looks like you have the aux oil delivery point on the tip of the bar nose?
If so, thene th chain will flick some of the oil off the bar while the bar goes around the remaining 1/4 circle of the nose.
Less oil will be lost if the oil delivery point is located after the chain has gone around the nose.

Yes, it drops on center of the roller tip, and will be simple to move. I don't know as yet if it's the oil or the gooy sap, or probably a combination of both....but I am getting a build-up of sawdust/sap/oil that kinda forms a radiused 'blocker' which may be working as sort of a 'dam' or 'sponge' type of thing. It is hard to see if much or any actual oil is flying off.....maybe I need one of those macro-cameras?
I looked thru the link to your marco photography of chain details, and it was very helpful.

I have yet to read the other reference you make regarding sharpening, but will do so soon.....(rain coming again)

John