Outdoor Wood Boiler Disaster

[ericjeeper]

a little trick for evaporation

To reduce water from evaporating out of an open system pour a gallon of veggie type oil into the boiler. It will cover the top of the water and seal the water in.

 

[hockeypuck]

Never had to top off my Central OWB. Check the water level every day.

I'm astonished that any manufacturer would sell something like this with a manual damper, especially a pressurized system.

I fired up my wood master in october ,and still have not had to add any water.

 

[ktm rider]

A system I've seen for limiting preasure in a wood boiler system is to have an expansion tank in the attic and have it vented so overflow runs out to a roof gutter. To top up the system water can be added until overflow is seen dripping in the gutter. As the boiler heats and cools any excess water from expansion will overflow and be caught by the gutter.

The pressure in the system will be determined by the height of the overflow pipe and builds at .45 pounds per foot of height. This is a good way to get small amounts of pressure and at the same time handle all of the output from boil overs.
.

WOW!! Sounds like a ton of trouble. Why not just get one of these????

 

[046]

absolutely cannot believe there was not a safety built into system.
if the mfg left one off, the installer should have caught it.

it's common for large HVAC suppliers to stock fuseable plugs rated at different temps. generally they use 1/4in NPT fitting with a blob of solder that melts at rated temperature.

 

[hockeypuck]

WOW!! Sounds like a ton of trouble. Why not just get one of these????

looks like just another closed system that could turn into a grenade.

 

[ktm rider]

looks like just another closed system that could turn into a grenade.

I couldn't find a pic of the larger 90# expansion tanks ( didn't really look hard though) I have 2 - 90# expansion tanks on my pressureized boiler. Never had a problem and I even over fired it once to about 250 degrees, which was my fault, not the boilers. If you have a pressure relief valve how do you figure a pressureized system with an expansion tank is also a grenade?

 

[Butch(OH)]

First off it appears that I owe badgerbob an apology, sorry that I jumped the gun Bob.

In my defense realize that OWBs are a favorite cyber "redheaded step child" at this time and I wish that those who don't like them would just tout their favorite way to burn wood instead of bashing OWBs in an attempt to make their decisions look better.

Off of that. You have purchased a dud system Bob no doubt about it, make them fix it or change it to non pressure. I cannot vouch for things like the effects on corrosion or pumps but I can vouch that a non pressure system does not need lots of make up water. I have added less than 5 gallons of water to my system since September, probably closer to 2-3 gallons. I cant say exactly because I top it off with a fill valve plumbed into he loop and located in my basement. By the time I crack the valve and walk 15 steps to a window where I can see the over flow it is overflowing. My system cuts off at 170 and on at 160 and works wonderfully without the dangers associated with pressure boilers.

Now I am going to add some science here because I have been reading some things that as I understand them defy a basic scientific fact. That fact being you cannot have a system temp over "X" at "X" system pressure. When the water boils, the temp quits rising, period. But raise the system pressures and the boiling temp will raise accordingly. As an example my atmospheric system will not go over 212 (or whatever exact boiling temp is at my altitude), it will boil more vigorously if I keep adding heat but will not go above 212 as long as there is water in it. Non-belivers can check this out for themselves with a pan of water and moms stove and cooking thermometer as I had to do when I didn't belive it.

 

[Butch(OH)]

I think that question was on 'Are you smarter than a fifth grader'

Gee now I am realy sad Treeco,,,,,

wad ya have to go an say that for

LOL

 

[stonykill]

google search

if you google search " outlaw outdoor wood boilers" this thread is the 2nd link you find. Badger bob may have a legitimate problem, however he is going about this all wrong. DON'T FEED THE ANTI'S. Thats my 2 cents. Off my soapbox.

 

[jhellwig]

That is just cause someone put the words "outlaw wood boilers" in their post. With the amount of traffic to this site google spiders logged it very quickly. If anything you should blame the first person to jump on badger bob about seemingly being anti owb. That is just how the internet works. This site and any combination of words, good or bad, equals top of google search.

 

[stonykill]

That is just cause someone put the words "outlaw wood boilers" in their post. With the amount of traffic to this site google spiders logged it very quickly. If anything you should blame the first person to jump on badger bob about seemingly being anti owb. That is just how the internet works. This site and any combination of words, good or bad, equals top of google search.

only the bad gets passed around and remembered, thats the problem. And yes thats how the internet works, which is why posting something such as his original post, and asking to pass it around without proof is bad. Remember the phrase...every action...? There are too many anti every things out there , and feeding them info like the original post and asking to pass it around, is a bad idea. It doesn't matter if the intent was malicious or not. Those who hate and want to outlaw the boilers will use this against us.

The mainstream news media has even been known to use info off of websites in their newscasts. You really need to watch what you put out there...thats all I'm saying. Think before you type.

 

[geofore]

DIY's

Things I have seen used on small closed system boilers that worked were thermostats for cars. They come in alot of temp ranges and pressure ranges. You can get 165F, 195F and 225F in 3lbs, 7lbs and 16lbs ranges. You place them on the boilers and they work. I am not saying it meets code but it does work. I am a firm believer in the fusible metal soft plugs because when all else fails the soft plugs work. Think of it as a backup plan.

To those that think the soft plugs must be on the inside of the boilers, The blowoff pipe can be plumbed into the firebox to extinguish the fire as a safety with the soft plug in the plumbing of the blowby tube. Redundantcy is is good if one system fails to operate the next one takes over. So even if you have a pressure relief valve or thermostat fail, the soft plug is a good idea as a backup to avoid catastropic failure.

You need things that work when the power goes out in an ice or snow storm. Softplugs, thermostats and pressure relief valves are supposed to work when the power is out. If your pump stops when the power is out does the boiler shut down? When the power goes out the damper should close on it's own.

I've got to go, this freeze thaw cycle just burst the neighbor's above ground pool and an 11,000 gallon icebergh went sliding through my back yard.

 

[ericjeeper]

I've got to go, this freeze thaw cycle just burst the neighbor's above ground pool and an 11,000 gallon icebergh went sliding through my back yard.

This I would love to see photos of. Please that is too funny

 

[charkan]

I agree pictures would be good.

 

[geofore]

poolside

Holy #*!#$%, It looks like someone threw a gernade in the pool. One side opened up and the whole thing exploded out like an areosol can in a firepit. I'll try to get pics tomorrow. 4' x 24' pool, no one hurt but the pool is shot. Pieces of the liner and lawn chairs are couple hundred feet down the hill. Washed the grass out of the lawn, down the hill, across the road behind us and over the next hill and into the creek. Oak trees caught the big ice chunks. Kiss that pool GONE!

 

[Husky137]

Time to get an attorney and sue the installer and the manufacturer and maybe the guy who thought swimming pools were a good idea. Orrr maybe just buy some penguins for the berg.:hmm3grin2orange:

 

[Husky137]

Plus I would contact the state swimming pool inspector and the state iceberg inspector.


I hope the homeowner wasn't lowering and raising the water level every day to account for the meterological changes.:deadhorse:

 

[TooTall999]

BAN ABOVE GROUND POOLS

Let's see how this one googles

 

[ktm rider]

The fact that you got your system to 250 degrees shows that your system is not failsafe. You may have damaged your boiler.

Really a small tank with no bladder and an overflow pipe at height is much simpler, cheaper and failsafe than expensive bladder tanks and a pressure relief valve.
.

I never claimed my sytem was fail safe. I just said safe. The reason it went so hot was that I forgot to close the ash door one nigtht so the boiler had no way to regulate the air intake.
As far as my system being more expensive. I boight the boiler, pex pipe, 40ft. of 1" copper with fittings, Expansion tank with air purge, etc.. etc.. for about $5,800. I haven't price them in a while but I think OWB are more than that for just the boiler alone. My perssure relif valvew came with the boiler and it is set at 20 PSI.

I do have a question for you Treeco and please understand that I am in no way disputing your 212 deg water claim, I just don't see how this happened to me.
When I had my OWB I had the circulating pump take a crap on me one night and the house was freezing. SO, I went out and checked the fire. It had the temp guage to 275 deg. !!!! The water was not coming into the house ( the pipes froze since the circ pump had quit) How could this have happend ?? based on the 212 deg water theory???

 

[stonykill]

Ban Above Ground Pools

(Note: Feel free to copy and circulate this message. You'll see why.)

This freeze thaw cycle just burst the neighbor's above ground pool and an 11,000 gallon icebergh went sliding through my back yard. It looks like someone threw a gernade in the pool. One side opened up and the whole thing exploded out like an areosol can in a firepit. 4' x 24' pool, no one hurt but the pool is shot. Pieces of the liner and lawn chairs are couple hundred feet down the hill. Washed the grass out of the lawn, down the hill, across the road behind us and over the next hill and into the creek. Oak trees caught the big ice chunks. Kiss that pool GONE!

Appraised of the facts as I knew them, I contacted the installer who came to the site within 8 hours – he scratched his head in disbelief.

I’ve heard nothing more from the installer and manufacturer. I believe justice indicates they should make things right, so, if they make light of this experience, I’ll be forced to litigate.




ahhh, the beauty of copy and paste, and selective deletion. Fun, fun fun:jester: