Sustainable logging

[slowp]

so, does the earth first say something about we will log the rest ot the planets later?

Yes. I have the place bookmarked where I got them.

 

[horseloger]

Not sure how much it costs to feed a horseshoe:monkey: I do know how much it costs to shoe a draft horse...round these parts is about $150-$200 every four to six weeks...more if you are using them for logging as they need caulks. BTW, I have shod a few horses, went to MSU horseshoeing school to get my education so I now KNOW EVERYTHING ABOUT SHOEING HORSES



You know pard, you don't even deserve to grab hold of a powersaw, or set foot in the woods...with all of your ignorance, you claim to be a logger, but I have always felt like it was a brotherhood, and I have been a part of the best brotherhood out there in the logging world, and you would definitely not make the grade in my world. What do you think every major city in a forested part of our country is? It is a CLEARCUT! You went to Purdue, did you not read history books? Every major city in a forested environment started out right in the heart of the best timber, with a Sawmill. Look at pictures of the old days and see big stumps lining the streets. All the seed eatin granola hippies in San Francisco (and every other tree huggin liberal city on the West Coast) should thank Loggers and Clearcuts for their wonderful cities. It pisses me off when some ignorant maggot forgets those facts, so the next time you start bashing clearcuts, you better stop and think about what really kicked started this great country of ours. And you call yourself a Logger?? You definitely don't deserve that title, because you don't even know what it takes to be one. A real logger...it's in his blood, and he is proud to be part of the brotherhood! Nuff said?

i dont know where to start with a moronic comment like this! And I dont know if I should waste my time but icant let this rest! Who are you to decide who should work in the woods? did god or somebody come down an bang you on the head and say your the one , I dont think so !
As far as your comment about being a student at msu I think thats wounder full is that where they taught you too gouge your costumers 150 to 200 a horse is outrageous unless its for some type of restorative shoeing, So that proves your character ! As I have stated in past post I do my own shoeing when I need it most of the time I let the horses go barefoot because that is actually better for there hoofs! But ether way I do most of my own work to avoid scammers like you!
As far as citys being clear cuts you are absolutely right they were clear cuts and thats why theres no sawmills there now because they used up everything in the area and moved on leaving ground that was no good for farming so they built towns! And they kept moving on until they reached the west coast and the public got tired of there land being destroyed after they mowed everything down and there was nothing left! Thats why your facing the regulations that are here It doesn't have anything to do with Hippies it has every thing to do with the American people speaking out and saying enough is enough,and you dont like it because you cant go out and rip and tear any way yo want in the name of profit ! There is nothing wrong with making a profit on your work but if you do it at the expense and the destruction of the natural resource that is making your profit then your are a fool not a good logger ! I dont need your approval nor do I want it I have faith that what I am doing is right and have plenty of people that agree with me.And thats more than I can say for you because most of the general consensus is that clear cutting is not expectable ! So the only Ignorant person is you for trying to think loggers are the only ones that make this country great they did a big part but they were not the only ones!

 

[horseloger]

Really big diapers -lmao, maybe xxxxxxL Pampers...

actually good question. short answer it depends where you are.

Most Western states now make you pack in certified (by state) weed-free hay.
yeah, it's gotta have a tag on it or color tied. Grain is ok IF it's commercial grain.
If not, no go.

Used to be free graze was a no brainer on National Forests and Wilderness Areas.
That's all changed/changing like everything else. Safest to pack it in, unless you have a grazing permit or know for certain free graze is allowed in your area of work.
All this applies to horse, mule, lhama, etc.

People were stupid careless and invasive plants have gotten a foothold and have ruined alot of good ground.

The whole grazing thing is another inferno of lawsuits by people that have to much time on their hands and money to burn.

Do you do work for the forestry system with horses or just do a lot of riding ? and your right about the law suits and stuff but its more like people with more money than brains:msp_laugh:

 

[floyd]

First time I saw that saw that was on a tricked out truck in the Gorge. I about died laughing.

 

[Greystoke]

i dont know where to start with a moronic comment like this! And I dont know if I should waste my time but icant let this rest! Who are you to decide who should work in the woods? did god or somebody come down an bang you on the head and say your the one , I dont think so !
As far as your comment about being a student at msu I think thats wounder full is that where they taught you too gouge your costumers 150 to 200 a horse is outrageous unless its for some type of restorative shoeing, So that proves your character ! As I have stated in past post I do my own shoeing when I need it most of the time I let the horses go barefoot because that is actually better for there hoofs! But ether way I do most of my own work to avoid scammers like you!
As far as citys being clear cuts you are absolutely right they were clear cuts and thats why theres no sawmills there now because they used up everything in the area and moved on leaving ground that was no good for farming so they built towns! And they kept moving on until they reached the west coast and the public got tired of there land being destroyed after they mowed everything down and there was nothing left! Thats why your facing the regulations that are here It doesn't have anything to do with Hippies it has every thing to do with the American people speaking out and saying enough is enough,and you dont like it because you cant go out and rip and tear any way yo want in the name of profit ! There is nothing wrong with making a profit on your work but if you do it at the expense and the destruction of the natural resource that is making your profit then your are a fool not a good logger ! I dont need your approval nor do I want it I have faith that what I am doing is right and have plenty of people that agree with me.And thats more than I can say for you because most of the general consensus is that clear cutting is not expectable ! So the only Ignorant person is you for trying to think loggers are the only ones that make this country great they did a big part but they were not the only ones!

Whatever little troll...keep livin in your little fantasy world Too bad that your ignorant ideals are supposedly tolerated in your area. I would love to see a fine specimen of a logger like you show up on a job site where I have worked and start spouting off the way you have on this thread...you would be laughed all the way back to the hole you come from with your tail between your legs.

 

[horseloger]

Whatever little troll...keep livin in your little fantasy world Too bad that your ignorant ideals are fupposedly tolerated in your area. I would love to see a fine specimen of a logger like you show up on a job site where I have worked and start spouting off the way you have on this thread...you would be laughed all the way back to the hole you come from with your tail between your legs.

No i wouldn't go home with my tail between my legs now maddhatte lets talk about threats and insults

 

[Meadow Beaver]

Well, this thread has given me a headache, I see why everyone is talking about booze.

I think sustainable forestry means different things, in different places, to different people.

 

[horseloger]

Yes there is more than one way to do sustainable logging and clear cuts do have there place, but only when disease or infiltration of foreign spices have dominated an area and they need to be removed ! And this is based on scientific principles
And this tread was to discuss the different ways of sustainable logging not bash anyone with a different way of operating!

 

[madhatte]

No i wouldn't go home with my tail between my legs now maddhatte lets talk about threats and insults

I gave you a warning in the hope that you would calm down, and nobody would have to escalate the level of moderation required. Please understand that I am charged with helping keep the peace here, and am attempting to do the very same. It's nothing personal.

 

[horseloger]

I understand and am willing to cooperate but when every other post is a slam of what I say do or think I am going to defend myself ! I didn't start with the bashing I am only trying to express my opinion and just because my opinion is not what they want to here then they bash you ! And if I am that far off the mark then why did the US courts agree with the science im following

 

[paccity]

I've always thought that when you went to visit somebody and they served you lutefisk, that maybe it was a not so subtle message of some kind.

Does anybody really like that stuff?

only during the holidays, and then not a lott of it, ah the smell.:msp_biggrin:

 

[madhatte]

HL, kindly check PM.

 

[paccity]

horeslogger, some times it can be hard to express a way of doing something with out coming across as arogant, . just a thought? :msp_smile:

 

[hammerlogging]

I'm thinking about switching to Tide. It takes sustains off a bit better than Costco's stuff.

NICE ONE!!

Randy's cracked me up to, how long can you sustain logging

I've avoided this one but I will point out something to consider- there is some exceptional timber being cut out of Pennsylvania/New York, extremely high value, up where captain steep is from, that is the regrowth from a sustainable forestry nightmare, its all residual cherry from commercial clearcutting in the early 1900's was understory overlooked trash, now its killer timber.

I'm with Madhatte, its all about the soil. Less roads, less skid trails, more suspension.

Leaching is NOT the same as erosion. Leaching is a chemical process.

As I've said before, my wife told me I can log with horses when I retire from logging.

Argh. I tried to stay out!

 

[redprospector]

I understand and am willing to cooperate but when every other post is a slam of what I say do or think I am going to defend myself ! I didn't start with the bashing I am only trying to express my opinion and just because my opinion is not what they want to here then they bash you ! And if I am that far off the mark then why did the US courts agree with the science im following

Dang! I took a little break for a day or two, come back, and this crap is still going on?
I can't believe you're crying about getting slammed, or bashed, or whatever when you were the one who came out calling us all ignorant, idiots, etc. etc. etc.
Are any of those US court judges loggers? I wonder how much they know about what they're making decisions on?
Buck up Buttercup!

Andy

 

[redprospector]

horeslogger, some times it can be hard to express a way of doing something with out coming across as arogant, . just a thought? :msp_smile:

Not always what you say, but how you say it.

Andy

 

[horseloger]

NICE ONE!!

Randy's cracked me up to, how long can you sustain logging

I've avoided this one but I will point out something to consider- there is some exceptional timber being cut out of Pennsylvania/New York, extremely high value, up where captain steep is from, that is the regrowth from a sustainable forestry nightmare, its all residual cherry from commercial clearcutting in the early 1900's was understory overlooked trash, now its killer timber.

I'm with Madhatte, its all about the soil. Less roads, less skid trails, more suspension.

Leaching is NOT the same as erosion. Leaching is a chemical process.

As I've said before, my wife told me I can log with horses when I retire from logging.

Argh. I tried to stay out!

Well first of all if they left the weed trees that wouldn't be considered a sustainable harvest that is high grading and the reason the cherry came back and made what you call killer timber was that the over story was released and the cherry took dominance. And then were allowed to mature with out disturbance for 90 years because it had a land owner that managed it correctly! Leaching is NOT the same as erosion. Leaching is a chemical process. leaching is the proses of water removing nutrients from the soil in the process of erosion that is the damage it dose. And horses use less roads less skid trails and more suspension.

 

[horseloger]

Dang! I took a little break for a day or two, come back, and this crap is still going on?
I can't believe you're crying about getting slammed, or bashed, or whatever when you were the one who came out calling us all ignorant, idiots, etc. etc. etc.
Are any of those US court judges loggers? I wonder how much they know about what they're making decisions on?
Buck up Buttercup!

Andy

I said based on the science that the judges made the decisions on if they have the proper information in front of them, then they should be able to make the proper judgement thats what judges are there for to evaluate the evidence placed in front of them and make a decision base on the facts ! Then what do you call it if its not bashing like I said any time you guys here something you dont like you start in bashing them you automatically labeled me some sort of hippie tree hugger and didn't even considered that there might be a better way only they way you guys think it should be done ! I was under the understanding that this forum was to discuss new Ideas and exchange knowledge not run the guy into the ground because he operates in a different way than you do! So if I came on here and started attacking your operation your knowledge in the way you folks have done to me, you would defend yourself too SO buck up buttercup .

 

[lfnh]

Do you do work for the forestry system with horses or just do a lot of riding ? and your right about the law suits and stuff but its more like people with more money than brains:msp_laugh:

Did do work for BLM and FS for fuel load mapping -ground truthing for aerial estimating; forest and wilderness trail clearing and maintenance; packed rode, grunted and swore in Wyoming and Eastern Oregon.
Built my own harness, rigging, and pack saddles. Have skidded and hauled earth and rock with horsepower - both kinds.
Have owned and run long horns on forest and blm grazing allotments in E Oregon and put up with cut fences and smashed gates from elk and "concerned guardians of the forest".

Have clearcut ROW tracks for electric transmission lines. Actually it was complete deforestation. Have also done selective cutting for stand health.

Have worked and seen some ground with best and worst forest harvest and mangement. Same goes for ranching.

The times we are in now, it seems extremes in thinking prevail and lawsuits severely hamper best management practices for the resource. The cost of compliance and regulatory mis-direction are being underwritten by the taxpayer and end consumer. One size fits all proscription is not likely to succeed.

just my opinion.

Mods - appolgies for topic detour.

 

[madhatte]

The times we are in now, it seems extremes in thinking prevail and lawsuits severely hamper best management practices for the resource. The cost of compliance and regulatory mis-direction are being underwritten by the taxpayer and end consumer. One size fits all proscription is not likely to succeed.

SHA-ZAM

That's not a detour at all, that's right on. I'd rep you but I'm out.