Tired of Dull Chains

[Brush Ape]

... power tools/toys/equipment are the measure of a man.

I been using a ruler.

 

[1project2many]

I prefer hand filing and recommend it for most people. But let me illustrate that a power sharpener might be the best choice for some.

I love my father but he and I were not cut from the same cloth. What he lacks in mechanical ability he makes up for in dogged stubbornness. Some years ago he and I met at the BIL's place to turn a pile of log length into cut, split, -n- stacked. He arrived with a newly purchased Rancher 455 and every accessory, carry case, and doodad the salesman said he'd ever need. I showed up with my little yellow 37cc Poulan Pro and all my saw tools in an old car parts tote. With his new saw, Dad managed to cut about 10 pieces of wood that day, all of them within a short time of re-starting the saw with a sharp chain. After multiple times re-sharpening then watching him hitting stones, rocks, the gravel in the drive, dirt, etcetera I gave up on on his chain and suggested he drive the 20 minutes to the store and buy a new chain. At least I'd get 40 minutes of uninterrupted cutting. He decided it was worth the trip as the salesman never told him the chain supplied with the saw wouldn't hold a cutting edge and he could chew the guy out. When the second chain "failed" as quickly as the first he decided he was going to force it to cut and proceeded to burn up a bar. I let him go on leaning on the saw and getting no results until I saw him breaking out tools. He'd convinced himself the bar and chain failed because the automatic oiler wasn't working and was going to tear it apart to figure out what was wrong. So I sent him down for another bar and he came back with a bar/chain combination and the new conviction that chain and bars are all junk which is the only reason they'd sell them in a combination pack. I took his saw and used it until my back hurt to demonstrate that he had a good chain and bar, then told him to only cut clean logs and never to cut near the ground which he did for a short time before sinking the bar into hardpack again. During this time I tried over and over to show him how to sharpen chain, how to recognize a dull chain, how to operate the file and use the previously pictured guide, how much damage stones and dirt will do to a sharp chain... all with little success and a high degree of frustration on my part.

So when my father told me this past summer that he'd bought a little $19 drill powered electric sharpener and it seemed to keep his chains sharp, I said I thought it was a good idea. And when he said he'd try to find one for me because they worked much better than the hand files I carried, I didn't even argue the point. I figure that any gadget he carries which keeps him busy is going to improve the life of the chain. And if he buys one for me, why, I'll make sure it's always available whenever we meet to cut wood, just in case his doesn't seem to be getting the job done.

I would not hesitate to recommend one to anyone who might spend a day cutting with my father.

 

[Bob95065]

If you are just cutting firewood get skip-tooth chains. Half the teeth = half the filing. I would rather file the 3/8" skip tooth chain that is on the 32" bar on my 066 than the full comp .325" chain on the 20" bar on my Husky 44.

 

[sunfish]

I prefer hand filing and recommend it for most people. But let me illustrate that a power sharpener might be the best choice for some.

I love my father but he and I were not cut from the same cloth. What he lacks in mechanical ability he makes up for in dogged stubbornness. Some years ago he and I met at the BIL's place to turn a pile of log length into cut, split, -n- stacked. He arrived with a newly purchased Rancher 455 and every accessory, carry case, and doodad the salesman said he'd ever need. I showed up with my little yellow 37cc Poulan Pro and all my saw tools in an old car parts tote. With his new saw, Dad managed to cut about 10 pieces of wood that day, all of them within a short time of re-starting the saw with a sharp chain. After multiple times re-sharpening then watching him hitting stones, rocks, the gravel in the drive, dirt, etcetera I gave up on on his chain and suggested he drive the 20 minutes to the store and buy a new chain. At least I'd get 40 minutes of uninterrupted cutting. He decided it was worth the trip as the salesman never told him the chain supplied with the saw wouldn't hold a cutting edge and he could chew the guy out. When the second chain "failed" as quickly as the first he decided he was going to force it to cut and proceeded to burn up a bar. I let him go on leaning on the saw and getting no results until I saw him breaking out tools. He'd convinced himself the bar and chain failed because the automatic oiler wasn't working and was going to tear it apart to figure out what was wrong. So I sent him down for another bar and he came back with a bar/chain combination and the new conviction that chain and bars are all junk which is the only reason they'd sell them in a combination pack. I took his saw and used it until my back hurt to demonstrate that he had a good chain and bar, then told him to only cut clean logs and never to cut near the ground which he did for a short time before sinking the bar into hardpack again. During this time I tried over and over to show him how to sharpen chain, how to recognize a dull chain, how to operate the file and use the previously pictured guide, how much damage stones and dirt will do to a sharp chain... all with little success and a high degree of frustration on my part.

So when my father told me this past summer that he'd bought a little $19 drill powered electric sharpener and it seemed to keep his chains sharp, I said I thought it was a good idea. And when he said he'd try to find one for me because they worked much better than the hand files I carried, I didn't even argue the point. I figure that any gadget he carries which keeps him busy is going to improve the life of the chain. And if he buys one for me, why, I'll make sure it's always available whenever we meet to cut wood, just in case his doesn't seem to be getting the job done.

I would not hesitate to recommend one to anyone who might spend a day cutting with my father.

That was interesting, insightful and painful all at the same time, with a good ending. Very good read!

 

[Bob95065]

I also forgot to say that I answered a craigslist ad for chains a few years ago. The seller had a saw shop at one time that went out of business. He sold loops of chain that he used for saw demos that only had one use each. The loops were $4 each. I bought as many loops as he had for all my saws.

I spend a day filing chains before I go out to cut wood. When a chain dulls I put a new one on. When I get home I spend some time filing so I am ready for next time.

 

[sunfish]

Everybody is different... I don't like to swap chains, I always just touch up (file) a chain every couple tanks. Chain is either worn out, or in very bad shape before I change it...

 

[ppkgmsy]

I don't really have dull chains. I hand sharpen the cutters every tankful. Staying on top of them so frequently keeps the chain in good shape. The only time I use the grinder is if I hit dirt real bad. You can usually tell when the rakers need filing, and this is something I think a lot of beginners miss (I know I did).

 

[zogger]

I prefer hand filing and recommend it for most people. But let me illustrate that a power sharpener might be the best choice for some.

I love my father but he and I were not cut from the same cloth. What he lacks in mechanical ability he makes up for in dogged stubbornness. Some years ago he and I met at the BIL's place to turn a pile of log length into cut, split, -n- stacked. He arrived with a newly purchased Rancher 455 and every accessory, carry case, and doodad the salesman said he'd ever need. I showed up with my little yellow 37cc Poulan Pro and all my saw tools in an old car parts tote. With his new saw, Dad managed to cut about 10 pieces of wood that day, all of them within a short time of re-starting the saw with a sharp chain. After multiple times re-sharpening then watching him hitting stones, rocks, the gravel in the drive, dirt, etcetera I gave up on on his chain and suggested he drive the 20 minutes to the store and buy a new chain. At least I'd get 40 minutes of uninterrupted cutting. He decided it was worth the trip as the salesman never told him the chain supplied with the saw wouldn't hold a cutting edge and he could chew the guy out. When the second chain "failed" as quickly as the first he decided he was going to force it to cut and proceeded to burn up a bar. I let him go on leaning on the saw and getting no results until I saw him breaking out tools. He'd convinced himself the bar and chain failed because the automatic oiler wasn't working and was going to tear it apart to figure out what was wrong. So I sent him down for another bar and he came back with a bar/chain combination and the new conviction that chain and bars are all junk which is the only reason they'd sell them in a combination pack. I took his saw and used it until my back hurt to demonstrate that he had a good chain and bar, then told him to only cut clean logs and never to cut near the ground which he did for a short time before sinking the bar into hardpack again. During this time I tried over and over to show him how to sharpen chain, how to recognize a dull chain, how to operate the file and use the previously pictured guide, how much damage stones and dirt will do to a sharp chain... all with little success and a high degree of frustration on my part.

So when my father told me this past summer that he'd bought a little $19 drill powered electric sharpener and it seemed to keep his chains sharp, I said I thought it was a good idea. And when he said he'd try to find one for me because they worked much better than the hand files I carried, I didn't even argue the point. I figure that any gadget he carries which keeps him busy is going to improve the life of the chain. And if he buys one for me, why, I'll make sure it's always available whenever we meet to cut wood, just in case his doesn't seem to be getting the job done.

I would not hesitate to recommend one to anyone who might spend a day cutting with my father.

I am guessing it is because you were trying to instruct him, and the father/son disconnect set in hard. There's no way a boy knows more than the dad..been there, experienced that....

Whereas one of his age group peers might have better success in instructing about how to not hit dirt (not the clerk at the store, one of his trusted friends with a clue on chainsaws)

 

[Goostoff]

?? then you either don't cut much wood or you are the best danged chainsaw/wood cutter there ever wazzzzzz???? ! HECK, I have a chain that has never been sharpened! as a matter of fact I don't remember ever taking it out of the box?? lol

I cut about 10-12 pickup loads a year. I usually look for Red Elm as much as possible, and I bought the smaller saw to make it easier to keep it out of the dirt.

 

[M_S_S]

I run 4 saws, shortest bar is 24" longest is 32", lol don't have any problem keeping them out of the dirt. I have an Oregon chain grinder and take at least 2 chains per saw to the woods with me. I also hand file while in the woods. It works for me. I cut between 50 and 100 cord of rounds a year depending on orders. Most of it is western juniper, but also a lot of logdepole pine and some ponderosa pine.
I sell mostly rounds and some split wood and logs (12 to 20 ft)

 

[Philbert]

Is anyone else tired of dull chainsaw chains and hand filing them sharp? I am.

Same question gets asked a dozen times a year, and you get the same answers. A lot of personal preference - you need to find something that works for you.

It sounds like you are happy with the results of your filing, but are tired of filing? So this is not a question of getting better files or different filing guides, but looking for another way to get sharp chains, right?

I bought an Oregon grinder several years ago and have been happy with it. There are many threads on choosing between th $300 and $100 grinders - I won't repeat that stuff, you can look for it. I will just say that I prefer the better grinders. Using a grinder is not automatic. If you know how you want your cutters to look after sharpening, you should be able to get that with a good grinder, and without overheating the cutters.

I prefer to have several chains per saw, so that I can swap out and sharpen when I want to, or when it is convenient, not when I have to. I find it also easier, and more efficient to sharpen chains in a batch. Just my preference.

I have a whole box of sharpening gadgets, but all that ever gets used is a wood handle with a file it.

Too damn funny... my once-used sharpening gadgets ain't in a box, they're in a drawer‼

Put 'em in one of the 'Xmas Giving' threads someone will want them

Philbert

 

[Philbert]

The one down side to a grinder is you ultimately shorten the useful life of the chain by removing more material than necessary with each sharpening. It hard too put a quick edge on a marginally dull chain without taking a fair bite on the tooth.

This is a recurring comment that I have never understood. You have to remove a certain amount of metal to restore an edge. It does not matter how you remove it (file, grinder, carbide cutter, light sabre, etc.).

If you profile the edge of the wheel round, and 'grind-as-you-file/file-as-you-grind' you will maintain a similar edge profile and remove similar amounts of metal. If you grind the top plate cutting edge with the flat side of the wheel, and file with a round file, you will remove more metal going back and forth.

If, because of free-hand filing, your teeth are all over the place, yes, a grinder will remove more metal getting the angles and cutter lengths consistent again.

We also have to compare apples to apples. You will note that some guys say that they 'touch up' or maintain their edges with a file every tank of gas. If you count each one of these as 'a sharpening', and compare it to the number of times you grind out a severely rocked chain, yeah, you will get 'more sharpenings' with a file. If you touch up with a grinder and just 'kiss' the cutters, the numbers will be a lot closer.

Philbert

 

[M_S_S]

I agree with Phil. A lot depends on the grinder and the idiot running it.

 

[CTYank]

Everybody is different... I don't like to swap chains, I always just touch up (file) a chain every couple tanks. Chain is either worn out, or in very bad shape before I change it...

My thoughts exactly. Additional exception for "rocked". I might swap chain and clean & flip bar at home. Don't feed ape-spit trolls.

 

[M_S_S]

I have an Oregon but would buy a Silveys in a heartbeat if I could find on. Madesons sez Silveys isn't making new ones, can still get parts.

 

[Philbert]

Brush Ape is referring to sprocket wear patterns. 'Good practice' is to not put a worn chain on a new sprocket, or a new chain on a worn sprocket. They each develop a wear pattern and it is best to let them wear together. Oregon recommends using 2 chains in rotation, and replacing the sprocket when those are used up, as a 'rule of thumb'.

With our storm clean up group, we have many saws and many chains, so we cannot keep specific saws with specific chains. I also know that a lot of guys scrounge used chains, or have special purpose chains: e.g. different chains for hard, frozen wood; clean, soft wood; stumps; etc. and swap bars and chains like parts on a socket set. In this latter case, you have to learn to recognize the wear on each component and replace or maintain them accordingly.

A rim sprocket is $5-10, so often it is worth it to use it up faster in order to get more life out of a $20 chain. Other guys, buy chains like tires for their car: one set until the wear bars show, then take it in to Sears to get another set.

Different stroke for different folks.

Philbert

 

[sunfish]

My thoughts exactly. Additional exception for "rocked". I might swap chain and clean & flip bar at home. Don't feed ape-spit trolls.

I haven't seen the ape in weeks...

 

[turnkey4099]

Hand sharpening is best for me. I have the harbor freight el-cheapo grinder and can hand file 2-3 chains faster than I can do one on the grinder. I also don't have to worry about overheating a tooth when hand filing .

Just finished touching up 5 chains yesterday. Took less than 10 minutes each and that includes the time to change the chains on the saw. My standard is sharpen after each work period, which at my age is only about 3 hours and one tank per saw.

Biggest trick to hand sharpening? The file! Buy them by the dozen and throw away when they dull - which is probably sooner than you expected . I've never counted how many filings I get per new file but it ain't a lot.

Harry K

 

[7sleeper]

I also have a few of the HF el cheapo grinders and have never been able to overheat the chain with them! How is that possible that some people comment on overheating with a tool that only has 80 watts of power....

This is the vid that I often recomend if one is interested in the el cheapo models.



7

 

[M_S_S]

Think they may be taking to much metal off a cutter at one time. That is the only way I think they could over heat a cutter. Like I said it depends on the idiot running the damn thing.