how did your saw swing around your head twice? if youve got a two foot lanyard i don't understand the physics of the saw swinging around your head twice unless you keep it clipped to the top of your head.
Top-The fishing pole effect
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xtremetrees
Addicted to ArboristSite
You guys laff at me but this is standard procedure it alot of shops I see production climbers do this regulary. I watch them to this to dead stuff. Yeah Habla espanole.
My safety for my saw strap is the best made!
Look at it its a key chain biner.
Maybe the saw only swung up to my shoulder, it looks about 2 foot from my waist. It was only a 141 thou I did take up the 372 to bomb it down
Do you disagree with my standing to the side on the spar?
My safety for my saw strap is the best made!
Look at it its a key chain biner.
Maybe the saw only swung up to my shoulder, it looks about 2 foot from my waist. It was only a 141 thou I did take up the 372 to bomb it down
Do you disagree with my standing to the side on the spar?
Why was there no room to let it run? You were 60 feet up, cutting a 15 foot top? Unless you were over an obstacle, you had plenty of room to let it run and gradually stop it. Or, the groundie should have been applying a gradual braking force right away. An alternative could have been to use a second lowering point to swing the load over to.
Another mistake was not leaving a bigger hinge, shutting off the saw, and close hitching it at your hip, then finishing the cut with a straight bladed hand saw.
Or, climb higher....or use a pole saw to further lighten the top...
Sounds like a routine job got made a lot harder by some mistakes.
Another mistake was not leaving a bigger hinge, shutting off the saw, and close hitching it at your hip, then finishing the cut with a straight bladed hand saw.
Or, climb higher....or use a pole saw to further lighten the top...
Sounds like a routine job got made a lot harder by some mistakes.
RedlineIt
ArboristSite Guru
Soooo, let's see...
You PLAN to have your safety trapped by your rig...
You KNOWINGLY climb with a saw that idles near redline...
You're too STUPID or LAZY to figure out that if you climb ten more feet, that gives your excellent groundie ten more feet to apply brake...
You're UNPREPARED for the dynamics involved in a situation YOU CREATE.
The word IDIOT hardly covers it.
RedlineIt
You PLAN to have your safety trapped by your rig...
You KNOWINGLY climb with a saw that idles near redline...
You're too STUPID or LAZY to figure out that if you climb ten more feet, that gives your excellent groundie ten more feet to apply brake...
You're UNPREPARED for the dynamics involved in a situation YOU CREATE.
The word IDIOT hardly covers it.
RedlineIt
begleytree
H. sapiens moderatus
Here is an excellent oppritunity to teach and learn. For every person who asks about or relates a scenario like this, there are many more too afraid to ask.
I laude X's courage to post this here for the sharks to feed on.
I'd limit the amount of negative posts here, so as not to drive away someone who can learn from this, and to keep this thread up for discussion. Personally I'm sure he's been called worse names by better people, so lets keep the name calling out, and the tips and teaching will come through better.
Whatchathink?
X, I'd advise checking out that saw, and always keep in the back of your head that the stem you're in my have hidden defects. You don't want to stress it that hard. With ropes and lowering devices improving all the time, more tree failures from cutting larger and larger pieces will become more common, I'm afraid. Take it from someone who just had a life changing experience himself, life is too short and too very precious to risk for the sake of getting a job done a little faster. The object of the days exercise is to arrive home to your family safely.
-Ralph
I laude X's courage to post this here for the sharks to feed on.
I'd limit the amount of negative posts here, so as not to drive away someone who can learn from this, and to keep this thread up for discussion. Personally I'm sure he's been called worse names by better people, so lets keep the name calling out, and the tips and teaching will come through better.
Whatchathink?
X, I'd advise checking out that saw, and always keep in the back of your head that the stem you're in my have hidden defects. You don't want to stress it that hard. With ropes and lowering devices improving all the time, more tree failures from cutting larger and larger pieces will become more common, I'm afraid. Take it from someone who just had a life changing experience himself, life is too short and too very precious to risk for the sake of getting a job done a little faster. The object of the days exercise is to arrive home to your family safely.
-Ralph
ex
first off why are you banned, anyways you dont realy need steel core you need to put your buckstrap above your rigging, second what are using up on the top i like a small delta link with a .5 inch whoopie 5/8 kong rescue pulley, this reduces the swinging do you have a handsaw? dont go aloft without it there not just for pruning anymore. why do you have another rope for escape where is your climbing line. what is happening that you are being physically trapped in the tree is the groundie not able to lower? btw a figure 8 wont help the groundie lower you. spikes kicking out? yeah need more info how does grondie lower what is his friction, how do you lower what is your hardware . i guess the fishing pole is how you felt not the lowering style. hang in there ex everybodys got good stuff coming for you and price a topper into the next job willya? 0200, 335-338 the echos got one for 250.00 as well,141 belongs on da ground for mixing drinks.xtremetrees said:
oldugly
ArboristSite Operative
Personally, it sounds like double roping would have helped the situation, if another groundie was available, if not, possibly using the groundie on the directional rope, and lowering the top yourself off a set line with a friction-stop....if you have one, or just wrapped enough to allow you the mobility, and time to secure it. Without seeing the situation its hard to judge. But using an extra line has many times helped me feel less like a crappie on the end of a fishing pole while topping off the skinny ones.
gitrdun_climbr
ArboristSite Operative
laxed climbing
I won't beat a dead horse and go on and on about what X did wrong although I will say, dude, get a new saw...you're working. X caused feedback which may have taught, or reminded 10 other climbers to take smaller pieces or tie off a rappel line for escape. The Art and Science of Practical Rigging is an excellent ISA publication with clear drawings and descriptions of where your flipline sits in relation to your rigging. It also talks about your cuts X and in this department you could use some review. I'm a bit suprised that after this many years in the industry you don't know how to face cut a top or cross cut a chunk so that you have plenty of time to kill and hang your saw. I would really recommend that book and Tree Climbers Companion to get back to some basics...like SAFE use of a figure-8 and such.
What I really wanted to address was safe climbing generally. X is right in that people in our industry, climbers included, get laxed after a while. When I climb for the big production outfits there is an expectation to run right up the tree on a single attachment point and lay waste. When I climb for my own micro-company I go out into the field and tie in all over the place. Yesterday it was two fliplines with a climbing line overhead. Once I was set up like that I could quickly and safely ascend the tree without ever having to rely on a single attachment point. Bolts come out of mechanical adjusters, I know cause a boy out here recently slid 30 feet down a spar when it happened to him...talk about tree rash! My ISA exam prep classes, ANSI, numerous sources teach us to tie in twice at least when cutting. Many of the 'pros' I see don't climb like this...which is a mystery to me being fairly new to the field and trying to do things by the book as much as possible. I will admit, the 'book' won't teach you everything but in my opinion it's a damn good reference point.
This work pays well so don't rush like a mad-landscaper or something. Play it safe and live to see another day!
I won't beat a dead horse and go on and on about what X did wrong although I will say, dude, get a new saw...you're working. X caused feedback which may have taught, or reminded 10 other climbers to take smaller pieces or tie off a rappel line for escape. The Art and Science of Practical Rigging is an excellent ISA publication with clear drawings and descriptions of where your flipline sits in relation to your rigging. It also talks about your cuts X and in this department you could use some review. I'm a bit suprised that after this many years in the industry you don't know how to face cut a top or cross cut a chunk so that you have plenty of time to kill and hang your saw. I would really recommend that book and Tree Climbers Companion to get back to some basics...like SAFE use of a figure-8 and such.
What I really wanted to address was safe climbing generally. X is right in that people in our industry, climbers included, get laxed after a while. When I climb for the big production outfits there is an expectation to run right up the tree on a single attachment point and lay waste. When I climb for my own micro-company I go out into the field and tie in all over the place. Yesterday it was two fliplines with a climbing line overhead. Once I was set up like that I could quickly and safely ascend the tree without ever having to rely on a single attachment point. Bolts come out of mechanical adjusters, I know cause a boy out here recently slid 30 feet down a spar when it happened to him...talk about tree rash! My ISA exam prep classes, ANSI, numerous sources teach us to tie in twice at least when cutting. Many of the 'pros' I see don't climb like this...which is a mystery to me being fairly new to the field and trying to do things by the book as much as possible. I will admit, the 'book' won't teach you everything but in my opinion it's a damn good reference point.
This work pays well so don't rush like a mad-landscaper or something. Play it safe and live to see another day!
xtremetrees
Addicted to ArboristSite
Oh yeah, wait till I can load my videos daily..:monkey:
RedlineIt
ArboristSite Guru
xtremetrees,
jmack and Begley are quite right, just slagging you off doesn't add anything to the discussion. I consider myself properly smacked.
Edit my post in your head, because I'm, frankly, too STUPID and LAZY to do so myself.
So here's something constuctive,
Do you have a quick way to rack that saw? I work with one guy who uses a tiny brass clip to rack his saw, he's always fumbling for it and using two hands to get it clipped, he never gets that saw racked in time!
Petzl make a wide mouth wire-gate 'biner with a flat back that is designed to slip behind your belt webbing, the flat back and a piece of rubber clipping keep it always oriented out, so it's in the same place everytime, all easy quick and slick.
There are other, even more robust belt mounted saw clips out there, but I've never found them in any North American dealers list, the Petzl wire-gate is pretty common.
Oh, that does feel better, after all!
RedlineIt
jmack and Begley are quite right, just slagging you off doesn't add anything to the discussion. I consider myself properly smacked.
Edit my post in your head, because I'm, frankly, too STUPID and LAZY to do so myself.
So here's something constuctive,
Do you have a quick way to rack that saw? I work with one guy who uses a tiny brass clip to rack his saw, he's always fumbling for it and using two hands to get it clipped, he never gets that saw racked in time!
Petzl make a wide mouth wire-gate 'biner with a flat back that is designed to slip behind your belt webbing, the flat back and a piece of rubber clipping keep it always oriented out, so it's in the same place everytime, all easy quick and slick.
There are other, even more robust belt mounted saw clips out there, but I've never found them in any North American dealers list, the Petzl wire-gate is pretty common.
Oh, that does feel better, after all!
RedlineIt
lanyard
(had it happen)
hey redline buck has one where the ring cinches tight with the paddle biner you can slam that in farily quick and the lanyard breaks away at 200 lbsRedlineIt said:xtremetrees,
jmack and Begley are quite right, just slagging you off doesn't add anything to the discussion. I consider myself properly smacked.
Edit my post in your head, because I'm, frankly, too STUPID and LAZY to do so myself.
So here's something constuctive,
Do you have a quick way to rack that saw? I work with one guy who uses a tiny brass clip to rack his saw, he's always fumbling for it and using two hands to get it clipped, he never gets that saw racked in time!
Petzl make a wide mouth wire-gate 'biner with a flat back that is designed to slip behind your belt webbing, the flat back and a piece of rubber clipping keep it always oriented out, so it's in the same place everytime, all easy quick and slick.
There are other, even more robust belt mounted saw clips out there, but I've never found them in any North American dealers list, the Petzl wire-gate is pretty common.
Oh, that does feel better, after all!
RedlineIt
(had it happen)
Stumper
One Man Band
Xtreme has a history on the Inet-He vacillates between posting incoherencies and incomprehensibly foolish scenarios.
I have wondered about English being his native language-Then I wondered if he was posting while drunk or otherwise chemically impaired- Then I thought perhap he is a troll. What is the answer? His coherency has improved of late but he still describes acts of idiocy. It is nice that so many want to be kind and helpful. I am dubious about Xtreme. I'm pretty confident now that English is his native tongue. All other plausible scenarios bring me backto dismissing him as a person of subnormal intelligence.:notrolls2:
opcorn:
I have wondered about English being his native language-Then I wondered if he was posting while drunk or otherwise chemically impaired- Then I thought perhap he is a troll. What is the answer? His coherency has improved of late but he still describes acts of idiocy. It is nice that so many want to be kind and helpful. I am dubious about Xtreme. I'm pretty confident now that English is his native tongue. All other plausible scenarios bring me backto dismissing him as a person of subnormal intelligence.:notrolls2:
opcorn:xtremetrees
Addicted to ArboristSite
mmm thats helpful bro now git off my thread and do ur own tree
mm jmac u have that many post an dittnt know that
I know all these big mouths never put thier lives in their groundmans hands for training. They probably havent don this kinda training with their ground man this year much less last month.
Let your groundman lower you regylarly panicky kids it may one day save your life.
mm jmac u have that many post an dittnt know that
I know all these big mouths never put thier lives in their groundmans hands for training. They probably havent don this kinda training with their ground man this year much less last month.
Let your groundman lower you regylarly panicky kids it may one day save your life.
Last edited:
skwerl
Will Climb for food
Wow. In four years this is the first time I have ever seen Stumper insult anybody here, no matter how stupid or incompetent they were. And we've had some doozies come through here! Great post Justin, had me rolling!
xtremetrees
Addicted to ArboristSite
Skwerl are you the atrist formally know as Rocky J squirrle?
Why did you change your name dude.?
Y youve only been here 4 years?
I think MB banned me for my big straps for big tops thread. Musta scared um pretty bad with my standard procedure.
Listen, if I post topics about SRT or some other C.A. topic other than getting trees down yall are all about it but when I do what others that never post do and is common throuought the industry you folks revert to insults and overtures. Its like you dont wanna hear whats going down in shops all over the USA. Noobs wont post it, wont stay, wont learn.
Not everyone does mass dampening, hardly any are SRT much less DRT. So why dont you folks keep it simple, stay safe and be honest.
When we rule out everything that can go wrong the rest is luck. I dont kid myself about this, you shouldnt either. How many thing that can kill you each and every day do you eliminate? How lucky are you folks? Do any of you guys cut trees? I think most yall computer nerds and like begley says are sharks to blow yourselves into prideful ballons.
It doesnt bother me because I dont see your pics.
Why did you change your name dude.?
Y youve only been here 4 years?
I think MB banned me for my big straps for big tops thread. Musta scared um pretty bad with my standard procedure.
Listen, if I post topics about SRT or some other C.A. topic other than getting trees down yall are all about it but when I do what others that never post do and is common throuought the industry you folks revert to insults and overtures. Its like you dont wanna hear whats going down in shops all over the USA. Noobs wont post it, wont stay, wont learn.
Not everyone does mass dampening, hardly any are SRT much less DRT. So why dont you folks keep it simple, stay safe and be honest.
When we rule out everything that can go wrong the rest is luck. I dont kid myself about this, you shouldnt either. How many thing that can kill you each and every day do you eliminate? How lucky are you folks? Do any of you guys cut trees? I think most yall computer nerds and like begley says are sharks to blow yourselves into prideful ballons.
It doesnt bother me because I dont see your pics.
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