Wedge Stacking?

[windthrown]

No problemo, Slayer. There was a high grade job done down the highway from me here last summer. It only has wolf trees, skinny 6 inch 40 foot firs and bad leaners left. I hate seeing them, but they are common here. Guy next door to that crappy job is doing a bang-up slick cut on 20 acres. He will have a perfect growing setup for the next round of planted fir trees there. World of difference. This is all small mom and pop woodland territory here, the big commercial stuff is farther east in the Mt Hood Nat. Forest.

Kiwi: I go by the name of Hank or Henry on AS now. Goes better with my avatar and keeps the Bushy Apes guessing. Glad you like the 310 still. I sold/gave my last 310 (I had a series of them) to my nephew. They are good saws. I tried like hell to get it to run with a stock 361, but I could not get quite that out of it with muffler and carb mods. They are the best saws of that series though.

 

[137cc]

????? In our HWDs! I'll be successfully doing soft Dutchman cuts before I progress onto that next level of impossible.
Fangst

If you're still defending this garbage method of stacking wedges, then any dutchman on purpose is way beyond your timber felling knowledge.

I'm only going off the posted pictures & explainations of backing up doubled up wedges which means an equal amount in reserve to stop the tree sitting back & possibly breaking the hinge. Plastic wedges aren't much good for lifting anything heavy anyway & with our HWDs they are as useless as an ashtray on a motorbike, that method with a single wedge is the recommended way to get small poles down against the lean. So far on the surface I'm seeing more positives than negatives.
Ta

Oh so you think your large eastern hardwoods weigh more than average left coast softwoods, cool story bro.

 

[bitzer]

If you're still defending this garbage method of stacking wedges, then any dutchman on purpose is way beyond your timber felling knowledge.



Oh so you think your large eastern hardwoods weigh more than average left coast softwoods, cool story bro.

Hes from down under mate. Not the states. He and i had a discussion a few months ago about swinging trees. He said it couldn't be done beyond 90 degrees and even that was very unlikely. He had aslso never swung a tree in his life with an intentional dutchman up to that point. I backed up my side with pics of a soft dutchman swing i did from start to finish from a job i was cutting during the course of the thread. He still said i was full of crap. Then proceeded to tell me how hard his hardwoods are. I live in WI and all i cut is hardwood. The general mechanics of timber falling are the same across the board. Species to species vary obviously. Even tree to tree. Hold wood is different, etc. The more he talks the less i know he knows. Thats why i keep him talking with obvious questions, but at the same time proving my point that i am correct because i do this for a living every day.

 

[Bwildered]

So removing more wood than necessary in the back cut of a tree is ok, thereby setting yourself up for more work and more material to add? Its time consuming and pointless. I wedge trees every day with no problem. If i know its going go need more than a double stack and it has to go one way then it gets jacked. The bore cuts and how deep they are is not the issue. Further compromising a tree when it is not necessary is futile. The tree will wedge MUCH harder when the wedges are in contact with wood instead of another wedge. They have to squeeze into that kerf you made until you drive them in far enough to break the wood away from the sides. Plastic wedges are meant for lifting trees, not breaking wood. I know ur aussie hardwoods are very soecial and can not be tamed, but here in the timid north we swing or wedge our trees with the help of gravity in a expediant manner. Don't worry, i will give you new reasons every day if you like. Whats your name by the way? I like to know who i'm debating with. I think we've arrived at that station eh mate?

In regards to breaking out the mortised timber of bore cut, here's another little experiment you can do, pop a dangerous deep bore cut 1/2" from the top of a stump if you can, place a wedge into it & hit it with 20 oz claw hammer, you will be able to easily break out the timber above the wedge with a couple of half hearted taps with the hammer, so in the grand scheme of things when you belt a wedge in with a 4 lb axe it's nothing & not going to make wedging a tree any harder.
Some mongrel days I might wedge 50% of the trees I fall & I only carry one alloy wedge, anything that needs anymore I'll push it over with the big tracked wedge or pull it over with the winch on the other end, or fall anything of value & size in its path & send it where the lean will let it go. I don't use plastic wedges in the bush as they are less than useless, but have found them really handy when I hang a solid core door getting it to the right height as they are nice & slippery.
Ta

 

[Bwildered]

If you're still defending this garbage method of stacking wedges, then any dutchman on purpose is way beyond your timber felling knowledge.



Oh so you think your large eastern hardwoods weigh more than average left coast softwoods, cool story bro.

What's garbage about it? It's safer. So what if another wedge has to be used to get the same amount of lift as two back to back.
Wrong country bro.
Thangst

 

[Bwildered]

Hes from down under mate. Not the states. He and i had a discussion a few months ago about swinging trees. He said it couldn't be done beyond 90 degrees and even that was very unlikely. He had aslso never swung a tree in his life with an intentional dutchman up to that point. I backed up my side with pics of a soft dutchman swing i did from start to finish from a job i was cutting during the course of the thread. He still said i was full of crap. Then proceeded to tell me how hard his hardwoods are. I live in WI and all i cut is hardwood. The general mechanics of timber falling are the same across the board. Species to species vary obviously. Even tree to tree. Hold wood is different, etc. The more he talks the less i know he knows. Thats why i keep him talking with obvious questions, but at the same time proving my point that i am correct because i do this for a living every day.

Coming from some one that seems to be a sawn off hero that can't even do a small scale experiment on a sapling to prove himself wrong that's hilarious. Maybe a hacksaw is too much for you & would be too dangerous or embarrassing!
Thanski

 

[Gologit]

In regards to breaking out the mortised timber of bore cut, here's another little experiment you can do, pop a dangerous deep bore cut 1/2" from the top of a stump if you can, place a wedge into it & hit it with 20 oz claw hammer, you will be able to easily break out the timber above the wedge with a couple of half hearted taps with the hammer, so in the grand scheme of things when you belt a wedge in with a 4 lb axe it's nothing & not going to make wedging a tree any harder.
Some mongrel days I might wedge 50% of the trees I fall & I only carry one alloy wedge, anything that needs anymore I'll push it over with the big tracked wedge or pull it over with the winch on the other end, or fall anything of value & size in its path & send it where the lean will let it go. I don't use plastic wedges in the bush as they are less than useless, but have found them really handy when I hang a solid core door getting it to the right height as they are nice & slippery.
Ta

I'm glad that you're not falling anywhere around me.

 

[bitzer]

Coming from some one that seems to be a sawn off hero that can't even do a small scale experiment on a sapling to prove himself wrong that's hilarious. Maybe a hacksaw is too much for you & would be too dangerous or embarrassing!
Thanski

I was wondering when the jokes about my manhood or penis size would start. That experiment was your idea. I did mine with two real trees and a bunch of pictures. When i asked you for yours you said you didn't want to waste a broom stick. I never said bore cutting was dangerous. To me its just a waste of time and that means money. If you only carry one wedge than how do you stack them? I know you said you've never tried it, but why defend it so vehemently then? Wedge on wood has a lot more friction than wedge on wedge. You said so yourself. Breaking the wood out after isn't the issue either. Its just more time which means more money. You must be paid by the hour.

 

[treeslayer2003]

in my opinion, GOL is more dangerous. at least in big timber.

 

[rwoods]

Just the observation of a trespassing firewood hack - time is precious to most folks. Translated here to mean efficiency/productivity and safety.

The described GOL method appears to be neither as efficient nor as productive as proper stacking wedge on wedge. Overall it doesn't appear to me to be much safer, if at all. The facts behind these conclusions have already been stated.

With all due respect to my Aussie friend, BW, my time is too precious to waste it arguing with him over techniques. He knows you can swing a tree and he knows those useless plastic wedges are used to fall trees bigger than any he has ever cut. I am sure he would agree that he is as hard headed as those Aussie trees of his; an attribute with its own pros and cons.

Ron

 

[northmanlogging]

What's garbage about it? It's safer. So what if another wedge has to be used to get the same amount of lift as two back to back.
Wrong country bro.
Thangst

Alright Bewildered, how is it any safer?

Take yer time.

 

[Gologit]

Alright Bewildered, how is it any safer?

Take yer time.

We keep making the same mistake. We're trying to overcome inexperience and ignorance with common sense, logic and the excellent advice of people who actually know what they're doing. In most cases it might work. In this case, not so much.
Some times you just have to quit beating your head against the wall.

 

[windthrown]

 

[treeslayer2003]

We keep making the same mistake. We're trying to overcome inexperience and ignorance with common sense, logic and the excellent advice of people who actually know what they're doing. In most cases it might work. In this case, not so much.
Some times you just have to quit beating your head against the wall.

yes sir......but whats more frustrating to me is trying to explain to some one that wants to know.........i just seem to have a hard time typing in a way folks can understand...........and of course i don't want any one to get hurt.

 

[Gologit]

yes sir......but whats more frustrating to me is trying to explain to some one that wants to know.........i just seem to have a hard time typing in a way folks can understand...........and of course i don't want any one to get hurt.

You explain things just fine. Don't worry about it. A
lot of people don't really want advice anyway. They just want you to validate whatever goofy idea they already have set in their mind.
You can't do anything with people like that.

 

[treeslayer2003]

i know.......but some times its a friend and i wish i could get on mah private chopper here and fly over to show them lol.

 

[KiwiBro]

No help < reading < photos < videos < personal instruction.
Always grateful for at least the last four.

 

[northmanlogging]

You explain things just fine. Don't worry about it. A
lot of people don't really want advice anyway. They just want you to validate whatever goofy idea they already have set in their mind.
You can't do anything with people like that.

Do you just copy and paste this? cause you say it a lot.

 

[Gologit]

Do you just copy and paste this? cause you say it a lot.

No cut and paste. But you're right, I do say it a lot. I'm old and old people tend to repeat themselves.
It's a damn shame that we have to.

 

[northmanlogging]

Its an arrogance problem, that old dude don't know ****, I went to college I paid to learn form an old dude that paid to listen to some other old dude that learned his **** for free from some other old dude. or dudette whatever....