Best 2 Stroke Oil?

[OM617YOTA]

FYI, neither need or require you to do that. if anything was going to crap out it would have already. We saw a small window of injection components after ulsd was introduced with issues. It was short lived, and most of it wasn't just from the fuel. It was and Continues to be an easy way to get gullible people to blow money they don't need to. Replacing old equipment injection pumps for wear these days if far and few between, and I'm talking about customers that put more fuel through equipment in a week then you will in 5 years with zero additives used working in conditions that rival hell. We replace more injection components on modern equipment because people can't seem to understand they don't tolerate contamination.

This is good to know. I just bought a 1996 Japanese import for a daily driver, been wondering about fuel lubricity myself. If it's all good then it's all good.

 

[sean donato]

This is good to know. I just bought a 1996 Japanese import for a daily driver, been wondering about fuel lubricity myself. If it's all good then it's all good.

it's fine, it's pretty much always been just fine. Most people with diesels don't add anything to them, and the ones that do have anecdotal (read no) evidence that anything is being protected better or not. Does it help? Who knows, that "test" I linked earlier suggest most additives (including 2 stroke oil) make an insignificant difference To then lubricity of ulsd. Should be more worried about quality filters, an anti gell additive if you need it and possibly a biocide if you're running bio diesel.

 

[Smitty Smithsonite]

Yep, definitely good to know. Been a mechanic for decades, but never touched diesels. These are my first 2. Bought the backhoe 4 years ago. Seemed everyone was adding 2-stroke or bottled additives, so figured it couldn't hurt.

 

[sean donato]

Yep, definitely good to know. Been a mechanic for decades, but never touched diesels. These are my first 2. Bought the backhoe 4 years ago. Seemed everyone was adding 2-stroke or bottled additives, so figured it couldn't hurt.

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I had a 90 w250 w/ cummins loved that truck. rode rough and not very comfortable, but it was dead reliable. Second owner, bought it from my uncle with 200k on it, sold it at 364k on it after I had my 79 w/ 12v p-pump swap finished. Sold it to a friend's kid brother. Still has it. I'd buy it back from him, but he won't sell it.

 

[Smitty Smithsonite]

Yeah she's a little bouncy, especially on the absolute sh!t roads we have here in MA, but after turning wrenches for 14 years on modern junk, I sold off everything I owned that was built after 1995. I'm saving piles of money, and my stress level is near zero again!

Lesson learned. 17 years later, I have the truck I SHOULD'VE had to start with. I should've walked away from that 2007 Silverado 1500 when the brakes pulsated violently on the test drive. That was the blatant sign, and I ignored it. An entire front end including THREE sets of hub bearings, peeling door trim the 1st week, failing switches along with squeaks and rattles the first 2k miles, burning oil at 50k, a rear end at 97k and the transmission 6k miles later, I had finally had enough and dumped it with 134k on the clock. My militant maintenance, Amsoil Signature Series 10w-30, and a Range AFM disabler allowed the engine to make it that long without the dreaded lifter failures that engine is plagued with.

Live and learn!!

 

[Lionsfan]

I had a 90 w250 w/ cummins loved that truck. rode rough and not very comfortable, but it was dead reliable. Second owner, bought it from my uncle with 200k on it, sold it at 364k on it after I had my 79 w/ 12v p-pump swap finished. Sold it to a friend's kid brother. Still has it. I'd buy it back from him, but he won't sell it.

I had a 93' very similar to yours, right down to the color. Honestly, I hated the damn thing.

 

[Breckinridge Elkins]

Additives fall out of suspension and not all additives dissolve

Suspension ≠ solution.

 

[Breckinridge Elkins]

FYI, neither need or require you to do that. if anything was going to crap out it would have already. We saw a small window of injection components after ulsd was introduced with issues. It was short lived, and most of it wasn't just from the fuel. It was and Continues to be an easy way to get gullible people to blow money they don't need to. Replacing old equipment injection pumps for wear these days if far and few between, and I'm talking about customers that put more fuel through equipment in a week then you will in 5 years with zero additives used working in conditions that rival hell. We replace more injection components on modern equipment because people can't seem to understand they don't tolerate contamination.

See, I was always told those high pressure injector pumps needed more lubrication than ULSD can provide. Do they add something else in lieu of sulfur, or was it a non-issue all along?

 

[sean donato]

I had a 93' very similar to yours, right down to the color. Honestly, I hated the damn thing.

That was a free 99 color, Martin senior single stage urethane. The truck was originally black and silver. It's was not a conformable truck, the dash fell apart with every bump you hit, but it always started, got good mpg, and never gave any issues that I didn't cause.

 

[sean donato]

See, I was always told those high pressure injector pumps needed more lubrication than ULSD can provide. Do they add something else in lieu of sulfur, or was it a non-issue all along?

They switched to different materials in the pumps and needle/seats of the injectors. This came on fairly quickly with the advent of commin rail and high pressure pump duce unit injection. The pressure and tolerances are so high to achieve fine fuel atomization normal materials weren't up to the task. Bosch and all the mfg that used their designs (denso, zexel, ect.) Already had the r&d and experience to quickly resolve this issue. Older pumps/injectors arnt subject to nearly the pressure of modern fuel systems and have by and far lasted very well. When was the last time someone said a rotary ve/pd or any p series (or it's equivalent) injection pump went out from lack of lubrication? Basically non. You'll see slightly more wear in the injector needle and seats, but long before that is an issue the springs will have lost enough tension to affect injector performance/ spray pattern. Really were splitting hairs on the longevity aspect.
Edit: to add onto that thought, if people would spend more time worry about fuel quality, ie proper filtration, regularly changing filters/ draining water, they would get a lot more durability out of their systems. There are problematic inhecriin systems, like the cp4 common rail pump, that are known for reliability issues. However that's not a lack of lube issue, it's pushing the materials used in the pump to its max. No amount of added 2 stroke oil or bio fuel is going to save one. It's a piss pore design. Bosch and every mfg that used one knows it, and why the cp3 design is usually retrofitted in its place.

 

[Breckinridge Elkins]

Ok so if I had a Stanadyne pump on an 80's diesel and I sent it in for rebuild (or core exchange) would it come back safe for ULSD?

 

[Arbor1]

Some things never change, I see!

Unfortunately not and the eternal debate over the best oil continues on.

Sigh.

 

[Lionsfan]

They switched to different materials in the pumps and needle/seats of the injectors. This came on fairly quickly with the advent of commin rail and high pressure pump duce unit injection. The pressure and tolerances are so high to achieve fine fuel atomization normal materials weren't up to the task. Bosch and all the mfg that used their designs (denso, zexel, ect.) Already had the r&d and experience to quickly resolve this issue. Older pumps/injectors arnt subject to nearly the pressure of modern fuel systems and have by and far lasted very well. When was the last time someone said a rotary ve/pd or any p series (or it's equivalent) injection pump went out from lack of lubrication? Basically non. You'll see slightly more wear in the injector needle and seats, but long before that is an issue the springs will have lost enough tension to affect injector performance/ spray pattern. Really were splitting hairs on the longevity aspect.
Edit: to add onto that thought, if people would spend more time worry about fuel quality, ie proper filtration, regularly changing filters/ draining water, they would get a lot more durability out of their systems. There are problematic inhecriin systems, like the cp4 common rail pump, that are known for reliability issues. However that's not a lack of lube issue, it's pushing the materials used in the pump to its max. No amount of added 2 stroke oil or bio fuel is going to save one. It's a piss pore design. Bosch and every mfg that used one knows it, and why the cp3 design is usually retrofitted in its place.

This is the injection pump off our B 2601 Kubota. There is this huge misconception with the uninformed out there that common rail is the devil and mechanical stuff never fails. The little ball stud broke off one of the delivery valves and jammed up the fuel rack last Saturday morning. Kubota does not list individual parts, their solution is to sell you the entire injection pump for $1,452 dollars, plus the cost of overnight shipping.
This is a critical piece of equipment for the company, so I ordered it, and hope to have it back in service tomorrow.

If you have any contact for a shop that can rebuild the old injection pump, please PM me their contact info.

 

[Breckinridge Elkins]

$1400 is a pretty good deal for a new injector pump. When I had to buy one it was arond $1300 for a reman before the core return which brought it down to $600 something. In other words, the core was worth more than the parts and labor.
Who makes the pump? There should be several shops online who can rebuild it or sell you a reman.

 

[Lionsfan]

$1400 is a pretty good deal for a new injector pump. When I had to buy one it was arond $1300 for a reman before the core return which brought it down to $600 something. In other words, the core was worth more than the parts and labor.
Who makes the pump? There should be several shops online who can rebuild it or sell you a reman.

I need it back online, now. I'll send the old unit out for a rebuild and put it on the shelf.

 

[sean donato]

Ok so if I had a Stanadyne pump on an 80's diesel and I sent it in for rebuild (or core exchange) would it come back safe for ULSD?

whatever wear items would be replaced, with new components which would be of equal or superior quality to what it came with, assuming parts are available. Of the items that typically wear inside a rotary injection pump, the aluminum housing is the most prone to give issues, and thats not really a lack of lube issue. (Just soft metal with hard metal rubbing it.) housings/bores seems to be big wear areas on high hour pumps, usually the cam plates and head assemblies are ok for reuse. Injector needles and seats will see the most wear, and I don't know any mfg that hasn't moved onto higher quality materias many years ago. So in a nut shell the rebuilt pump will be ready for many years of service. Truthfully rotary and inline pumps didn't change substantially over the years, even with the advent of electronic controls. Another thing to keep in mind, is a lot of these old pumps were designed for a global market, and outside of the states and a few other countries fuel standards are non existent and these pumps live long productive lives.

 

[sean donato]

This is the injection pump off our B 2601 Kubota. There is this huge misconception with the uninformed out there that common rail is the devil and mechanical stuff never fails. The little ball stud broke off one of the delivery valves and jammed up the fuel rack last Saturday morning. Kubota does not list individual parts, their solution is to sell you the entire injection pump for $1,452 dollars, plus the cost of overnight shipping.
This is a critical piece of equipment for the company, so I ordered it, and hope to have it back in service tomorrow.

If you have any contact for a shop that can rebuild the old injection pump, please PM me their contact info.

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Pm sent, shame that didn't fail under warranty. Kubota has gotten really proud of their parts in the past few years. Been finding that out with dad's L and my B. Very frustrating.

 

[sean donato]

$1400 is a pretty good deal for a new injector pump. When I had to buy one it was arond $1300 for a reman before the core return which brought it down to $600 something. In other words, the core was worth more than the parts and labor.
Who makes the pump? There should be several shops online who can rebuild it or sell you a reman.

It's a rip off for what it is. Shouldn't be over $600.00 in reality. Basically hasn't changed since the D-xx05 engines came out. Last I recall zexel makes them for kubota.

 

[Lionsfan]

Pm sent, shame that didn't fail under warranty. Kubota has gotten really proud of their parts in the past few years. Been finding that out with dad's L and my B. Very frustrating.

About 1,600 hrs. on it, so she's out of warranty. Nothing seriously high, but due to the application there are a lot of start/stop cycles and a lot of throttle up/throttle down cycles.

 

[Lionsfan]

It's a rip off for what it is. Shouldn't be over $600.00 in reality. Basically hasn't changed since the D-xx05 engines came out. Last I recall zexel makes them for kubota.

Correct, no f-n way a simple injection pump should cost 10% the price of a new tractor, but they've got you by the balls, and they know it. Correct, it's a Zexel pump.