Done with red tacky bar oil

[Lightning Performance]

ZDDP needs heat (greater than 250 degrees Celcius IIRC) and pressure to be affective.

And you should be the number three by now

 

[bwalker]

Yup
So think how hot your bars gets when it goes steel to steel. Anything left in the local area like the rail filled with dust and oil feeds the stuff right back up to the hot spot. In my experience it saved a few rails when the user makes an error such as running out of bar oil. The chain bar got hot and chain got tight not all stretched out. After it cooled down everything went back to how it was with no damage.

That old business about shorting the fuel to match the oil output works very well. When you get caught with half tanks or fuel it's best to top off the fuel and short the tank if needed then top off your bar oil. It happens with the 36 or 40 bar sometimes when you hit knots or punky wood. The usage can change a bit so it's better to have more oil in your saw than not. I've also noticed less problems in the summer on very hot days using one ounce of STP per gallon of bar oil. It seems to run cooler with less friction. Lucas oil additive changed nothing. Other brands offered no benefits either.

250 celcius is nearly 500 degrees. No way a bar gets that hot.

 

[bwalker]

And you should be the number three by now

#3?

 

[Lightning Performance]

250 celcius is nearly 500 degrees. No way a bar gets that hot.

Maybe not on your saw in the fashion your cutting. My milling bar sees 350F and the oil in the tank on the saw sees 350F+ regularly when milling big oak or dry ash. Canola oil boils off the bar studs with vigor in my 660 oil tank.

It does get to 500F in localized hotspots when you run out of oil on the bar. Spalling doesn't happen at low temps. That is what happens when you run steel to steel. Someone correct me if I'm wrong here, please.

 

[Lightning Performance]

I might be dismissed like usual but that doesn't make me wrong.

Experience is the best teacher.

 

[bwalker]

Maybe not on your saw in the fashion your cutting. My milling bar sees 350F and the oil in the tank on the saw sees 350F+ regularly when milling big oak or dry ash. Canola oil boils off the bar studs with vigor in my 660 oil tank.

It does get to 500F in localized hotspots when you run out of oil on the bar. Spalling doesn't happen at low temps. That is what happens when you run steel to steel. Someone correct me if I'm wrong here, please.

I don't mill so I can't say for certain.
In your use the added viscosity would be of help.

 

[Lightning Performance]

I don't mill so I can't say for certain.
In your use the added viscosity would be of help.

Thick oil hurts everything when milling I've found. Having hot canola oil running in everything when the heat comes on in summer is a good game changer most haven't tried. The oil moves so fast you will be closing down a stock low volume oil pump on bars under thirty two inch. I'm still running anything from a twenty four up to a sixty some outings. Generally speaking in my area and my tree picks need a twenty eight to start and forty or forty two once the bark is gone. When you switch over to milling on the slabber fifty two bars or a CSB sixty or bigger you need the extra oil feed out of the saw to slow down some. The thin oil flows way too fast so I'm really getting away from the drip feed and moving more toward running my accessory oil pump. Still testing it but it's dead simple and pretty reliable. It self starts and shuts off when you shut down your cut. Getting the pump volumes right based on viscosity is the PITA part. Soon we will be cooling off and the thing will change yet again. I'm ready to keep up this time with thicker bar oil vs the hot or warm canola. Once winter sets in the oil offered for winter bar oil might be too thick to pass. The canola goes solid at some point so keeping it warm won't be an option so switching back to petroleum is a must from the looks of things come winter.

 

[bwalker]

Thick oil hurts everything when milling I've found. Having hot canola oil running in everything when the heat comes on in summer is a good game changer most haven't tried. The oil moves so fast you will be closing down a stock low volume oil pump on bars under thirty two inch. I'm still running anything from a twenty four up to a sixty some outings. Generally speaking in my area and my tree picks need a twenty eight to start and forty or forty two once the bark is gone. When you switch over to milling on the slabber fifty two bars or a CSB sixty or bigger you need the extra oil feed out of the saw to slow down some. The thin oil flows way too fast so I'm really getting away from the drip feed and moving more toward running my accessory oil pump. Still testing it but it's dead simple and pretty reliable. It self starts and shuts off when you shut down your cut. Getting the pump volumes right based on viscosity is the PITA part. Soon we will be cooling off and the thing will change yet again. I'm ready to keep up this time with thicker bar oil vs the hot or warm canola. Once winter sets in the oil offered for winter bar oil might be too thick to pass. The canola goes solid at some point so keeping it warm won't be an option so switching back to petroleum is a must from the looks of things come winter.

I get what your saying about oil volumes and viscosity. However, thicker oil has a high film strength. For your use it sounds like you need an auxiliary oiler of some type.

 

[camel2019]

I'll try again.
New canola oil.
You can add STP oil treatment if your looking to have a thicker mix with high zinc and more anti-sling additives but it's not needed.

STP is thin now don’t think it will work to thicken the mix like it used too.

 

[Lightning Performance]

I get what your saying about oil volumes and viscosity. However, thicker oil has a high film strength. For your use it sounds like you need an auxiliary oiler of some type.

I run those but they are worse to control because of changing viscosity between just morning shade till the afternoon sun comes around. I'm not running stuff like 9000 series mix oil that remains stable over a wide range of uses. It matters so much more in the mix when it comes to temps plummeting in the winter. 60-95F is pretty stable then you get issues going down. Cutting my thinnest mix oils should be fairly easy starting with a stable 20wt or less. Using gas, diesel or kero seems like a mess I'm not quite ready for. Plus I do hate the smell of all three of those.

Any ideas?

 

[Lightning Performance]

STP is thin now don’t think it will work to thicken the mix like it used too.

It just has less anti-sling agent in it it seems. Nothing is what it used to be. It was better than snake oil before snake oil came out. The seventies is when most of us started using it for assembly and high heat oil conditions before we could have ever afforded synthetic oils. Valvoline 50 or 70wt synthetic motor oil was seventy bucks a quart in US money in 1975. Big teams filtered it at most tracks if it wasn't fuel soaked or filled with bits and coolant. They knew how to recycle it also. We ask for some with coolant in it for tests in two stroke bike transmissions. It also worked real good in HD transmissions on the street. All of it was a no go in cool weather or when it was cold. You can't pump honey with a gear drive and if you do you get bad juju or broken parts.

 

[McN]

well, the unused oil hole will get plugged regardless of oil type, and the rails will get a slug down the middle almost instantly so?

One of the machine shops I worked at kept trying to get me to use the waste way oil out of one of the lathes its about the same stuff, but... its gone through the lathe, picked up who know how much junk, then sat in the coolant take for weeks to vacuumed out by a rotten old shop vack... I'd rather spend the money on stuff I know isn't going to jack up my oil pump and toast a bar and chain.
The cheap thing stuff doesn't do the trick if ya ask me, I cut 4-6 hours a day for the last 9+ years, only worn 1 bar out and it was a new Oregon POS.

I've watched and read the forum for years for info on our saw repairs and what not and just joined for more. So yes I am New. About that machine shop lathe oil. Don't use it. That is cutting oil, I know, I am a machinist as well. That does not give lubrication, it is used as a coolant and to carry away chips and such. Yup, I tried that as well. Lost bars real fast. In the very late 1960's my Dad was given a 50 gallon drum of fresh 20wt oil. We used that on the ranch for bar oil. Slung a lot of oil and tossed out the dust and shavings. We had 40 acres of mix orange, avocado and walnut trees, all crisscrossed with eucalyptus wind brakes and on the full perimeter. Always cutting and replacing trees. Those who have cut it know dead eucalyptus is really hard. Those trees were or are some 80 years old.

I still have groves and lots of trees, so a lot of wore out saws ! For bar oil I now use "used" automatic transmission fluid. I get that 5 gal at a time from the local home garage transmission re-builder. I rigged up a gravity feed filter, 6 feet of 4 inch plastic pipe with a valve on the bottom that runs into a standard automotive engine oil filter. Good quality one. Let it gravity feed into a gallon jug. I use older saws and let them sling all the oil they can. Free oil and it keeps the bar and such kind of flushed out.

Well that's what we do, your experience may vary !

Dan

 

[Wow]

Idk about used lots of salt and other nasty stuff in there. I’m still on the fence about vegetable oil in general I have tried it in my poulan made jonsered but it seems to just sling right off. I thought about it for my mill I’m planning on building but that bar I’m going to use is not cheap.

Try adding STP.

 

[Wow]

I don't use the thin Synthetic STP. The old thick and sticky stuff in the Blue bottle is like 3 bucks. That's what I use and is thicker than honey and slick too. If y put a drop on your finger then wipe it clean and try to snap your fingers you will see how slick it is.

 

[bwalker]

It just has less anti-sling agent in it it seems. Nothing is what it used to be. It was better than snake oil before snake oil came out. The seventies is when most of us started using it for assembly and high heat oil conditions before we could have ever afforded synthetic oils. Valvoline 50 or 70wt synthetic motor oil was seventy bucks a quart in US money in 1975. Big teams filtered it at most tracks if it wasn't fuel soaked or filled with bits and coolant. They knew how to recycle it also. We ask for some with coolant in it for tests in two stroke bike transmissions. It also worked real good in HD transmissions on the street. All of it was a no go in cool weather or when it was cold. You can't pump honey with a gear drive and if you do you get bad juju or broken parts.

STP was always just heavy oil with a liberal dose of ZDDP in it. It never had a tac or anti sling additive in it and it won't do much to fortify sub par bar oil.

 

[PP4218]

Someone should be along shortly to bash all that.
Enjoy

Yeah, you aren't kidding there!!

 

[Husky77]

I bought a saw that had vegetable oil run as bar oil, it was sticky/rancid everywhere. First thing I done was wash the saw off and flush the oil tank out. The bar was not looking good, wear and chips along the groove that I never seen on a bar run with "proper" oil. I wont be using the stuff mainly because it DOES go off and my saws are not used often enough to renew it and keep it flowing. Plus I hate the smell of rancid veg oil.
All very well going bio and saving the planet, stopping the rich flying everywhere will save the planet a lot more that us using a bit of oil.

 

[Lightning Performance]

I bought a saw that had vegetable oil run as bar oil, it was sticky/rancid everywhere. First thing I done was wash the saw off and flush the oil tank out. The bar was not looking good, wear and chips along the groove that I never seen on a bar run with "proper" oil. I wont be using the stuff mainly because it DOES go off and my saws are not used often enough to renew it and keep it flowing. Plus I hate the smell of rancid veg oil.
All very well going bio and saving the planet, stopping the rich flying everywhere will save the planet a lot more that us using a bit of oil.

Many vegetable oils do that.
Wrong oil

Wasn't about saving the planet is was about wearing petroleum when working.

 

[056kid]

and, for those of this thread who are NOT professionals.........you homeowners with a cheap saw, looking to trim the fat/cost at every turn........there is NO substitute for the correct guide bar oil.
For those of us who DO know about our chainsaws..... If you have ever serviced a POS that some cheap skate has run his oil changes thru, you know of what we speak.

Manual.......

Seen a handull of saws with millions of feet on each one of them. They drank a whole lot of used oil to no apparent detriment. They don't last more than a few seasons anyways.

 

[056kid]

Maybe not on your saw in the fashion your cutting. My milling bar sees 350F and the oil in the tank on the saw sees 350F+ regularly when milling big oak or dry ash. Canola oil boils off the bar studs with vigor in my 660 oil tank.

It does get to 500F in localized hotspots when you run out of oil on the bar. Spalling doesn't happen at low temps. That is what happens when you run steel to steel. Someone correct me if I'm wrong here, please.

What saw are you running.