Help in deciding between Stihl MS 462 and 500i Chainsaw

[NSEric]

Perhaps this question should be addressed in the context of the region and the local conditions where the saw is to be used… For example, the Pacific NW vs upstate N.Y. or PA. This as they present different demands…

Me… I’m in upstate NY. Hardwoods dominate. The majority of my cutting is with an MS261 with an 18” bar. The second most used saw is an MS461 which currently has a 20” bar. My least used saw is an MS661 with a 25” bar. I have a 36” bar that can be used on the 461 or 661.

I rarely encounter a tree over about 24”. I like it when I do so I can run the 661 and not feel like it’s too much saw.

I wonder how responses here would look to folks if the regional conditions were included?

I cut similar or even smaller trees in my area.
I've discussed the 500i with a few local guys who are into saws, they all say pretty much the same thing... Awesome saw but who needs a 80cc saw around here.
The 362 or 400 is a better all rounder here.

 

[GrizG]

Maybe. Sometimes people do things a certain way because that's the way they've seen it done and just go with it.

I live in WI (like you mostly hardwoods in the <24-30" range) and I run a 500i with a 28" bar pretty much all the time. The only time I get the 261 out is if I'm going to be doing a LOT of limbing or work in smaller trees. Even if I'm in fairly small wood, I still run the 28" bar because the 500i cuts through that stuff a LOT faster than my 261 with an 18" bar. I'm all about getting stuff done faster with less fatigue.

Most people around here think anything over 20" bar is overkill. I was raised that way; my grandfather told me any bar over 20" is just a waste of money. Then I started doing things different ways to see what worked better....long bars are great even if you're in modest sized trees. Standing up and cutting with the tip is a lot easier on your body than bending over with a 20" bar all day. My grandpa also taught me to angle back cut...and several other things that simply weren't a good way of doing things...

I think people tend to get set in their ways and refuse to believe that the way their grand pappy did it isn't necessarily the best or most efficient way...or maybe it was back in the 60's, but not with today's technology.

Obviously what tree's you usually cut and your geography does play a part in your equipment choices, however, I think if more people gave longer bars a legit chance, more people would use them. The only thing I don't like about longer bars is all the teeth to sharpen lol

I've seen plenty of guys using saws who don't seem to have had any training, formal or informal. I advised one land trust's leadership, with whom I volunteer, that I will never work with a specific guy ever again. He was dangerous! For example, I watched him buck a tree that was under pressure and he split the tree with nearly every cut because he didn't understand compression and tension. There was wood flying all over the place out of control and he was jumping out of the way with each cut. What topped the session off was when he backed his tractor over his saw... I'm pretty sure I could have gotten that whole mess on the ground with my first cut and it would have been an uneventful show followed by simple bucking cuts.

Regarding bar length, other variables beyond the diameter of the wood to consider are the stature and strength of the user. A "short bar" may be perfectly fine for a shorter user (say the 5'2'-5'6" range) even when bucking logs laying on the ground. On the other hand the same saw would be troublesome for a guy a foot taller.... The longer bar's weight may be an issue for smaller guys over the course of the day also. What you're cutting matters too... If the saw spends most of the time in the wood the weight isn't that much of an issue. On the other hand, limbing and bucking at chest height or above, or if you're climbing through rugged terrain and dealing with a lot of brush and tree debris, the long bar's weight can lead to fatigue with no tangible benefit.

So many things to consider! Simple answers aren't!

 

[Husky77]

I've seen plenty of guys using saws who don't seem to have had any training, formal or informal. I advised one land trust's leadership, with whom I volunteer, that I will never work with a specific guy ever again. He was dangerous! For example, I watched him buck a tree that was under pressure and he split the tree with nearly every cut because he didn't understand compression and tension. There was wood flying all over the place out of control and he was jumping out of the way with each cut. What topped the session off was when he backed his tractor over his saw... I'm pretty sure I could have gotten that whole mess on the ground with my first cut and it would have been an uneventful show followed by simple bucking cuts.

Regarding bar length, other variables beyond the diameter of the wood to consider are the stature and strength of the user. A "short bar" may be perfectly fine for a shorter user (say the 5'2'-5'6" range) even when bucking logs laying on the ground. On the other hand the same saw would be troublesome for a guy a foot taller.... The longer bar's weight may be an issue for smaller guys over the course of the day also. What you're cutting matters too... If the saw spends most of the time in the wood the weight isn't that much of an issue. On the other hand, limbing and bucking at chest height or above, or if you're climbing through rugged terrain and dealing with a lot of brush and tree debris, the long bar's weight can lead to fatigue with no tangible benefit.

So many things to consider! Simple answers aren't!

I worked with a guy once who really was deadly, how he never killed anyone was pure luck on their part and a credit to them being so observant. Anything under tention or presure he just vouldnt see the danger, he would let chains fly without any thought. He is probably dead kow and the best thing for him and everyone around him, not a nice man, we all come across at least one in a life time that people just stay away from.
Stay safe out there and avoid idiots, they seem to be breeding

 

[OM617YOTA]

I worked with a guy once who really was deadly, how he never killed anyone was pure luck on their part and a credit to them being so observant. Anything under tention or presure he just vouldnt see the danger, he would let chains fly without any thought. He is probably dead kow and the best thing for him and everyone around him, not a nice man, we all come across at least one in a life time that people just stay away from.
Stay safe out there and avoid idiots, they seem to be breeding

There comes a point where it's not a clueless lack of awareness, but intentionally trying to hurt folks, with an "oops it was an accident" excuse. Stay far, far away from those people.

 

[GrizG]

There comes a point where it's not a clueless lack of awareness, but intentionally trying to hurt folks, with an "oops it was an accident" excuse. Stay far, far away from those people.

The guy I encountered showed up with the land trust’s property manager. He had been cleaning up simple fallen ash trees for them in the past. When I arrived on site I saw a tangled mess… a large walnut uprooted and took out 6-7 other trees. They were all blocking the rail trail and some were hung up in trees on the other side of the trail. Multiple spring poles and a lot of loaded branches and stems. I started brushing it out before they arrived.

The guy jumped off his tractor and grabs his saw. I stopped him and the manager backed me. It would be insane to have two saws running in there as things were going to move. Someone would definitely be injured or killed!

I needed “ground crew” help. After nearly two hours with the MS 261 I was ready for the MS 461… after a break. The guy jumped in with saw to what I saw as a straight forward situation…. It quickly became clear he had no idea what he was doing! After the splintered trunk situation we pulled him out and I took over the cutting again. After I had it broken down he used his tractor to clean up… and backed over his saw while doing so. The manager and I would never work with him again… The manager and I have Game of Logging training… wildman had run saws for years without benefit of any training, formal or informal, and was lucky to be alive!

 

[gggGary]

I'm just an untrained home firewood cutter. Two weeks ago, doing storm clean up in North Carolina I was sawing in a large group. I quickly appointed a helper who's main job was keeping the others away from my felling. At lunch break I cut things short so I could get trees down before the swarm got back to the woods. The group leader wanted me to train others to "run saws". I politely declined that "invitation". I had my 462CM along cuz the group usually just has smaller saws in the trucks. I quickly got mine out cuz the group leader had not gotten their saws to maintenance and they were nearly useless. (261 and 362) Others were beavering away with those saws, I didn't watch, much. Only had to cut one of the saws out of a trunk. In his defense the group leader had JUST been thrown into the roll with no training.
Gotta admit after 4 or 5 hours of felling and bucking with the 462 with a 25" bar I was BEAT. Some old guy has taken over my body.
Someone asked to "borrow" MY saw, you can guess my answer.

 

[GrizG]

I'm just an untrained home firewood cutter. Two weeks ago, doing storm clean up in North Carolina I was sawing in a large group. I quickly appointed a helper who's main job was keeping the others away from my felling. At lunch break I cut things short so I could get trees down before the swarm got back to the woods. The group leader wanted me to train others to "run saws". I politely declined that "invitation". I had my 462CM along cuz the group usually just has smaller saws in the trucks. I quickly got mine out cuz the group leader had not gotten their saws to maintenance and they were nearly useless. (261 and 362) Others were beavering away with those saws, I didn't watch, much. Only had to cut one of the saws out of a trunk. In his defense the group leader had JUST been thrown into the roll with no training.
Gotta admit after 4 or 5 hours of felling and bucking with the 462 with a 25" bar I was BEAT. Some old guy has taken over my body.
Someone asked to "borrow" MY saw, you can guess my answer.

Your old guy’s twin borrows my saws too… I try to use the smallest saw that works effectively for each stage of a job. The 661 is for trunk wood only (felling and bucking). I tried using it for limbing a big tree one time but it was tiring…

I took the 25” bar from my 461 and put it on the 661 and put the 20” bar that came with the 661 on the 461. When I ordered the 661 the only kits available had 20” bars but I saw that as an opportunity to create a nice incremental set of saws… with the 36” bar in reserve!

 

[gggGary]

I've never run a 500i, the 462 C-M came up last Dec. on CL; an aerialist tree service selling a"one huge maple" saw at a serious discount from list, my local dealer verified the saw's history, I've had the 25" bar buried in red elm and oak for 6 or 10 tanks, I couldn't be happier with how it cuts running stihl 3/8 .050 chain kept sharp.