How do you get help when stuck in remote areas?

[TimberMcPherson]

I used to have to track which vehicles went where on logging and back country roads. Used to be a PITA when radios didnt have coverage (one of my machines had 4 radios in it).
We came up with pre determined "tags" we would do on the tracks. such as do a swerve or skid if we changed roads. If the roads were hard packed or sealed we would do them on the verge. Dragging a chain on the drawbar leaves a pretty good sign where you have been in the centre of a soft dirt road which will last a couple days. If you do is slightly offset (like by a foot) from the centre then people can see if you were coming or going. Twin stripes means youve come and gone.
We had two guys in identical machines that I couldnt tell by tracks so I cut one of the tread grips on the back wheel on the left rear wheel of one and the right of the other. It could take a while but I could generally find which one had gone where.
Another system is to mark trees with a line with a spraycan when you go in and cross it when you come out. If you work with a bunch of guys each can name their own tree. Has to be done religiously though.

Smoke in the forest gets attention, you just need a safe method of making lots of it when your in a jam.

 

[Sheshovel]

Living in the Yukon you should know never go out in an unreliable vehicle and never go out unprepared and without a gun.If possible don't go that far out alone.Anyone who goes out in the deep woods should know how to find their way with a topo map and compass,know how to build a shelter,get a fire going and find food should you run out.Shelter-Fire-Food-before darkness...then and only then should you think about trying to get out.That is after you have told everybody where you are going and stick to that plan.Three shots in a row is the universal signal for help

 

[TimberMcPherson]

Isnt 6 shots and alot of smacking sounds the signal for youve run into 7 lawyers?

 

[KiwiBro]

Bumping to note that having researched these lately, I've found a crowd selling for around NZ$300-350, so, from about US$220. Need one for my kayaking misadventures, but will be handy on remote jobs also. Choice of ACR's resQLink, Ocean Signal's ResueMe PLB1, or KTi's SA2G.

 

[northmanlogging]

bigger outfits have 2 way radios, fcc licensed stuff here, that are connected to a repeater system by region, so you can talk to someone 200 mi away if they are on the same frequency and security codes. State patrol, sherriffs, local pd all run the same stuff, and can all contact each other via radio, commercial stuff uses the same system, but different frequencies, though some of the units cross over...

CB is still heavily used though, can't beat it at log yards/quarries/loggin roads, not all companies have the the 2way, and not all companies can talk on any set of 2ways... cb covers everyone with the $65. it takes to purchase a new unit and antenna

The 2way (uhf?) stuff is expensive, and the FCC license is like $500 a year... not quite worth it when you only have 2 trucks and one driver.

 

[madhatte]

We have the most ridiculously overpowered super-wham-o-dyne mega-encrypted repeaterized radio network you've ever seen. It works pretty well, mostly. It was like pulling teeth getting the powers-that-be to give us a few VHF channels so we could talk to other agencies because god forbid the bad guys listen to us talking about trees.

 

[svk]

Having as many survival items as possible is best (ie compass, matches, food, water, firearm, extra clothes, safety blanket, phone/radio, horn/whistle, etc). I personally am more concerned with getting hurt when I am hunting/fishing/cutting alone and not being able to make it back to the truck.

Cell signals are not everywhere yet and probably will never be. I know if you can find a high point you can pick up a cell tower that is well over 20 miles away.

 

[Scablands]

The satellite emergency beacons are just OK. SPOT is the major brand. The signal is easily blocked by tree canopy and the satellite is fairly low on the horizon and easily blocked in canyons or just by being on the north side of dirt. So, you might be climbing to the top of a hill just to get a signal.

You also don't call AAA with one. It calls 911. You don't want that if you just have a dead battery in the woods.

 

[fool skip]

A friend of mine, who worked in oil exploration, explained company protocol to me. If he were lost or stuck, stay with the vehicle and after a certain amount of time a search effort would be mounted. Survival supplies were carried. If a aircraft was spotted or a vehicle was heard, he was to set his spare tire on fire. Sounded like a good plan to me.

 

[ChoppyChoppy]

If your out in the middle of nowhere (forest) and say your truck breaks down…

And you can’t get anyone on the CB and cell phone is out of range, what do you do?

I’ve heard about these emergency locater things hikers use. Anyone know anything about them?

Can you buy them? Expensive?

I’ve checked into satellite cell phones, but those cost a young fortune.

Walk to the skidder and drive out of the woods, make the call there.

 

[Jim Thode]

We have many remote areas with no cell coverage. I carry an inReach satellite communicator. It will do two way email and text communications as well as 911 calls anyplace in the world. You can pick up a used but fully serviceable one one for about $200 and the annual subscription is about $140 or less depending on how much you need it. I believe it is the best technology available for remote communication.

 

[Brushwacker]

If your out in the middle of nowhere (forest) and say your truck breaks down…

And you can’t get anyone on the CB and cell phone is out of range, what do you do?

Back in my younger days when I was in NE WA state trapping 2 winters up in the mountains I had a utility truck with lots of tools to get unstuck, a few spare parts, survival items etc..After the snow come I would be taking the snowmobile on the truck as far as I could and then doing most the trapping from it and couldn't carry that much extra equipment. Even though I wasn't living the life I relied on my faith in God. If it wasn't for that I probably would of stayed closer to civilization and or had some one checking up on me daily at least. I got off the path going through a clear cut in a white out up high in the mountains once, but was able to back track back. Had I not made it back to the main trail would of made an interesting outcome. Another time my machine fell throw the snow in a hollow about 5' deep, but I was able to roll it back up the bank with some faith and hard work. Been stuck up high and walked most the way out, 6ish or more miles. Coming down 1 night a blizzard hit and my machine kept fouling out a plug. Pitch black with a 2 cell aa mag lite when the snowmobile would quit. Snowflakes so big it felt like a small glass of ice water when they hit me in the face. Eventually I spotted the problem, a hood cable grounding out the plug wire when I closed the hood. Made it back to a half buried 2wd Datsun P/U with studded tires and bulldozed snow for about 2 miles of unmaintained forest service road and drove another 40ish miles back to my house. Did a good deal of back country road travel, overnight backpacking and canoeing,and some bicycling in the summer of 1994 in AK. No phone,cb, etc..Obviously some will not, and will criticize, but for me I aim to call on the living God before, and in perils and have thankfully been fortunate and confident.

 

[Westboastfaller]

Turn on the spot finder and push help or SOS when its ready if needed.
We've use a three check in system a day, pressing the OK button otherwise if we can't text.
Sat phone is a must sometimes as well a marine radio in a case mounted with battery. Plan ahead too. Phone around and see who can do what for you and can they longline? What kind of helicopter will come so you can prepare for that craft. Its always a good idea to mark your veichle's waypoint and turn it around in a positive direction. SO many times I've slid off the road trying to drive straight out in the snow due to the sun being on the road all afternoon it just sucks the truck off into the ditch.
My Lewis winch has saved me from activating the help option a lot of times. Obviously chains and shovels are a good idea.
I've fell wood for Gyppo companies and even their contract logger has lied when asked about having a sat phone, basket & spine board.


I just used my right to refuse unsafe work and had them drop $3,000.00 on a marine radio, basket, spine board, hard collars, top of the line first aid kit and Oxygen. Oh yeah..and a big bag of 12" spikes so we could make heli pads as we progressed. Sometimes you have to meet god in the middle.

@Brushwacker...your post reminds me of a funny joke I'll have to tell.
I was also in AK in the summer of 94.

 

[Westboastfaller]

The satellite emergency beacons are just OK. SPOT is the major brand. The signal is easily blocked by tree canopy and the satellite is fairly low on the horizon and easily blocked in canyons or just by being on the north side of dirt. So, you might be climbing to the top of a hill just to get a signal.

"and the sattelite is low on the horizion" I don't know why I would give you the benefit of the doubt that this is a typo?^^

You know I've worked in the alpines of the rockies with about 30 of these used 3 times a day monitored by the company. About 100 check ins per day for a 10 week job a few winters ago. As a matter of fact the last time I used one they had us do 2 hour check ins. A little bit of a discrepancy here. Prehahs that's because 'I cun see Russia from mY hOUse" lol

You will get I signal but your accuracy with be affected at certain times of the day and will change through the year as we face a different space. I've snagged & handcut about 400 miles of Seismic line with another cutter a packer and Surveyor with $30,000 dollar packs.
You tend to ask a lot of questions when your cutting Turn-key and
you are waiting for them at every station for them to get their shot.
That's all about accuracy. Yes the Aspen was the worst for accuracy.
I'm not sure why? I'm not so sure its the foliage as its bad in the winter too. It does hold a mercury content in areas. Other jobs we just used a hand held and compass around our neck and followed the arrow and cut at the same time then they got the shots at a later time. The program told you if you were left of 'line' or right of line. Certain times of the year your SATs crash for an hour as you lose the key ones on the west and you have to wait for the earth to rotate to pick up more in the east.
When things are good then it will show a 5 metre accuracy and won't bounce when you move. Prehaps things are better today.
Its the same in the veichle, It may say you are 100ft of the intersection when you are sitting at the light.


I'm not sure I'd be advising someone to climb out of a canyon and leave the fallen because the SOS didn't go through the first time. I'd suggest wait a few minutes. SATs are the busses of the ski...just wait for the next one.

I want to tell you...this stuff isn't rocket science....BUT IT IS

You also don't call AAA with one. It calls 911. You don't want that if you just have a dead battery in the woods.

Also not true. It has a OK option and a help option that can be monitored by your people. There is now a SOV (save our veichle) option that can be added to your help option thats international.

 

[Scablands]

"and the sattelite is low on the horizion" I don't know why I would give you the benefit of the doubt that this is a typo?^^

You know I've worked in the alpines of the rockies with about 30 of these used 3 times a day monitored by the company. About 100 check ins per day for a 10 week job a few winters ago. As a matter of fact the last time I used one they had us do 2 hour check ins. A little bit of a discrepancy here. Prehahs that's because 'I cun see Russia from mY hOUse" lol

You will get I signal but your accuracy with be affected at certain times of the day and will change through the year as we face a different space. I've snagged & handcut about 400 miles of Seismic line with another cutter a packer and Surveyor with $30,000 dollar packs.
You tend to ask a lot of questions when your cutting Turn-key and
you are waiting for them at every station for them to get their shot.
That's all about accuracy. Yes the Aspen was the worst for accuracy.
I'm not sure why? I'm not so sure its the foliage as its bad in the winter too. It does hold a mercury content in areas. Other jobs we just used a hand held and compass around our neck and followed the arrow and cut at the same time then they got the shots at a later time. The program told you if you were left of 'line' or right of line. Certain times of the year your SATs crash for an hour as you lose the key ones on the west and you have to wait for the earth to rotate to pick up more in the east.
When things are good then it will show a 5 metre accuracy and won't bounce when you move. Prehaps things are better today.
Its the same in the veichle, It may say you are 100ft of the intersection when you are sitting at the light.


I'm not sure I'd be advising someone to climb out of a canyon and leave the fallen because the SOS didn't go through the first time. I'd suggest wait a few minutes. SATs are the busses of the ski...just wait for the next one.

I want to tell you...this stuff isn't rocket science....BUT IT IS


Also not true. It has a OK option and a help option that can be monitored by your people. There is now a SOV (save our veichle) option that can be added to your help option thats international.

You're right about the help versus 911 feature. I forgot about that. I had the first gen SPOT for about two years and used it extensively in the woods dirt biking. The new generation of SPOT must have improved greatly, because simply descending 100m to the bottom of a ravine would kill the signal with the first gen. SPOT at least then had *one* satellite for reception, which was at a fixed point in the sky. You didn't wait for a new satellite to come into view. Either you had line of sight or you didn't. GPS and the satellite communications part are two completely different systems, BTW. It sounds like SPOT might have switched satellite systems over the years, which is why you're getting better performance.

I won't get into whether or not to leave a victim. All I'm talking about is what it takes to connect to a satellite - at least what I experienced when SPOT was new about ten years ago. SPOT sounds like it's a much better system now, and I might give it a go again.

The bad news is that SPOT's customer service is as lousy as it was ten years ago. Check out the reviews on REI: https://www.rei.com/product/860469/spot-gen3-satellite-gps-messenger?s_kwcid=PS_Google|401_3316068|_inurl:_mcid: 1209243 _and_ _custom_label: rei _and_ _product_type: camping and hiking _and_ _product_type: camp electronics#inurl:_product_type: plbs and satellite messengers#inurl:_brand: spot|NB|95bf5b08-1fa2-44c1-ac1f-3e213ec932b2|dsa-192208308485&gclid=CJCp6dXajtMCFc9gfgodxiENCA

 

[Westboastfaller]

You're right about the help versus 911 feature. I forgot about that. I had the first gen SPOT for about two years and used it extensively in the woods dirt biking. The new generation of SPOT must have improved greatly, because simply descending 100m to the bottom of a ravine would kill the signal with the first gen. SPOT at least then had *one* satellite for reception, which was at a fixed point in the sky. You didn't wait for a new satellite to come into view. Either you had line of sight or you didn't.

SPOT sounds like it's a much better system now, and I might give it a go again.

I won't get into whether or not to leave a victim. All I'm talking about is what it takes to connect to a satellite - at least what I experienced when SPOT was new about ten years ago.

Yes some mixed reviews. Mostly recommended. Some just seamed like they bought duds. Its supposed to be water proof and one screwed up in a light rain
The gen 3 seems good for the most part. I have used the gen 2 with out problem. Yes they mentioned that "sometimes" it crashed in slot canyons. Yes in fact you may have to wait for SATs to appear. A hand help GPS shows the SATS its using when it starts to pick them up, there location and whether they are Russian or US.
It will have a handful showing and still won't start. But the spot may be able to send on one SAT? apparently it sends much easier that it tracks.

OK for argument sakes. The sat is stationary in the sky but the earth has a circumference of nearly 25, 000 miles 40,000 kilometers and completes a rev in 24 hours. We are spinning just about 1000 mph
I thjnk its inffecting my spelling...lol
Anyway put that in your pipe and smoke it. We come into SAT range technically. The SATs you use in the day Australia is renting when you sleep.
I hate to break this to you but the sun doesn't rise either.

 

[Jim Thode]

Based on my side by side in the field test of an inReach communicator and Spot locator it is clear that the inReach is the most reliable communication device for several reasons. I’ve used a Spot for several years and last year I picked up an inReach. When I had both units activated at the same time I went out in my local forested western Washington countryside for a 1 ½ hr side by side test. I live in forested river valley and made a large loop with some areas in the valley and some on top of a forested ridge line. Over the 1 ½ hour time I attempted to send a message from the Spot and inReach about every 15 minutes for a total of 6 attempted messages from each unit under the exact same conditions.

One difference between the Spot and inReach is that the inReach will tell you if a message has been successfully sent however there is no way in the field to tell if a Spot message has been sent. As I proceeded on my walk and sending messages I knew that each of the six messages I sent had been successfully sent from the inReach. Both units were set to send a check in message to my home email and a text to my cell phone as well as my wife’s computer and cell phone.

When I got back home and checked for messages I found that all six inReach messages had went to all four addresses. That was no surprise because I knew that they had been sent in the field. Of the six messages I attempted to send with the Spot only one was actually sent. That is five messages that did not go through and only one that made it. The one that made it from the Spot was sent in a relatively open area adjacent to a river.

Over the several years that I used the Spot in heavy timber to open country it normally worked about 75% of the time. Over the last year with several trips with the inReach it has worked 100% of the time. Many of these trips were in heavy old growth timber. Some times is takes a few minutes to send a message but so far it has worked great. The Iridium satellite system that the inReach uses to send messages covers the whole earth every nine minutes and the inReach only need a little window to send or receive a text or email message.

Even if you discount my experienced reliability of the inReach over the Spot there is another huge advantage to the inReach. The inReach will do two way text or email communication and the Spot will do only one way communication (sometimes). This two way communication with the inReach is a major reason most folks that look closely at the features choose an inReach over the Spot. The subscription cost is about comparable and can actually be less with the inReach. The Spot uses the Globalstar system for communication that does not cover the whole earth.

I also had an opportunity to test a satellite phone under similar conditions. In timbered areas I was likely to make a phone connection but every time I got connected I was soon cut off as the satellite moved past any small opening in the trees. The phone I was using uses the same Iridium satellite system as the inReach. The inReach only needs a small window to send or receive a message and the satellite phone needs a continuous clear opening to maintain a conversation. Other then not being able to maintain a conversation without a clear sky, the sat phone cost much more and does not give GPS locations with each call/message.

Anyway, that is my fist hand experience. I would only recommend the inReach as best current technology to send and receive emergency messages in remote areas.

 

[Westboastfaller]

Good information Jim^^^
My experience with the spot was in pine areas of the rockie mountain foot hills. The only time I had trouble was when I wasn't doing it right but once I was shown again all NY checks were good...everyone's was. It was indicators when it sent.

I would definitely buy the other one though based on your testing.

Thanks.

Here is a link of the devices I use

http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/wedge-belt.290601/page-3

 

[Gypo Logger]

Generaly when I'm lost in the bush, I just tell myself, 'I'm here because I'm not all there.'