Which Klotz?

[StihlyinEly]

Thanks for the response, I appreciate that. Do you use Saber Professional mixed at 100:1 or 80:1?

It's 50:1 in everything I run. I don't quite believe the 100:1 stuff. It's worth nothing that Amsoil states it can be run AS LEAN AS 100:1, not that it SHOULD always be run that lean. At 50:1 it's amazingly clean and nearly smokeless, and I get added piece of mind.

I will add that, although I run the Amsoil Outboard oil at 50:1 on my 90 Hp Mercury, I do run my smaller kicker/trolling motor at 80:1, because it's always running at low rpms.

 

[Terry Syd]

Oil threads remind me of board room meetings. If the topic of discussion is about recent changes in software or new accounting techniques, there isn't much response from the board - but bring up the topic of parking spaces and everyone has an opinion.

Everyone mixes their own fuel, therefore they have some expertise on the topic - and we get pages of opinions as a result.

 

[blsnelling]

I was just wondering if people really think it makes a nickel's worth of difference.

Matter of fact, I do......................but not a penny more:hmm3grin2orange:

So........what ratio is best???? I mean, really? :msp_unsure:

I won't run 50:1 in my ported saws. I'm ok with 40:1, but prefer 32:1. I believe that gives me a measureable level of protection with the higher RPMs and temps a ported saw will run.

 

[K&L Landscaping]

I have cold feet about the Saber. I'm just going to stay with the HP Ultra because I know it's a proven performer through my own, real world testing. I just can't afford any oil related failures in my equipment fleet (who can?). I will just pony up the extra cash for the Ultra and be done with it.

 

[komatsuvarna]

I have cold feet about the Saber. I'm just going to stay with the HP Ultra because I know it's a proven performer through my own, real world testing. I just can't afford any oil related failures in my equipment fleet (who can?). I will just pony up the extra cash for the Ultra and be done with it.

I know of a few people that run saber. Parrisw builds quite a few ported saws and runs saber in his, at 40 or 50:1. I believe you'll be fine with it, I just wouldn't do it at 100:1.

Here lately Ive been mixing all mine at about 37:1. I put (1) 2 gallon premix of ultra, with a gallon and a half of gas. Its easier to keep up with for me that way.

 

[Mastermind]

I just ordered a liter of bel ray h1r synthetic. I just want to give it a try...

 

[RiverRat2]

I use Amsoil, seems to be good and clean burning. There are people that hate Amsoil products.

As to Dominator, I have no idea and will not research it, never heard of it ...... in fact, LOL. I use Amsoil Saber for 2 stroke oil, didn't research beyond that. I get Amsoil Saber by the case when I buy other Amsoil for skidders and trucks and ATV's.

Sam

What does a case of it run you Sam??

 

[mdavlee]

I'm thinking hard on the H1R now after the airplane torture test...otstir:

 

[Mastermind]

I'm thinking hard on the H1R now after the airplane torture test...otstir:

That was what made me give it a try.

Great talking with you BTW.

 

[mdavlee]

Yeah I'm going to try some of it too. I hope to get some run time around Christmas with it.

Good talking with you Randy.

 

[StihlyinEly]

I have cold feet about the Saber. I'm just going to stay with the HP Ultra because I know it's a proven performer through my own, real world testing. I just can't afford any oil related failures in my equipment fleet (who can?). I will just pony up the extra cash for the Ultra and be done with it.

And that's the most important thing. Confidence in proven performance. All this "which oil is the best" is pretty much nonsense. Any excellent quality oil, either conventional or synthetic, will do a great job if mixed as recommended and used in a well maintained saw. I prefer synthetic myself, and Amsoil among synthetics, but that's just because it's a proven performer to me.

Folks, get out there and cut!!!!

 

[RTK]

It was a simple question. I've run Supertech Outboard 2 Stroke oil, which by many accounts should ruin a saw in about 5 tanks, LOL, and now I use Amsoil Saber, because I get it for cheap, when I buy synthetic for my trucks and skidders, and it has been run at 80:1 and now 50:1, yet the PC look great when inspected. So its hard for me to comprehend how reading about 27 different oils is going to make or break a PC to any measureable degree, when most saws in this forum aren't used that much to begin with and the old, conventional oils of 20 years ago, has been good enough to have saws still running on it today.

Its a free world, but I just think its silly to put all this wonderment into 2 stroke oil, beyond a reasonable quality, synthetic and what color it comes in, LOL.


Sam

You got it, the oils of today are so far superior to the oils of years past, if mixed correctly, and saw tuned properly, I doubt 99.9% of the people would ever wear out a piston or cylinder no matter what oil they used. When I raced karts some 37 years ago the Mac racing engines had a sticker on them to mix at 16-32:1 non detergent 30w motor oil. No additive packages, dispersant's, etc.......Of all the oils I have used Amsoil saber seemed to leave the hardest deposites.

 

[RiverRat2]

I've used it on all my 2-strokes for years. Great stuff, and very clean. I buy most of my saws and other 2-strokes used, and the large majority have been run on conventional oils. I can't tell you how many times I've picked up those units and seen a lot of carbon and sludge buildup, and after 5 or 6 tanks of Amsoil mix, they are cleaner and running smoother.

I'm sure it'd be the same with most high-end synthetics, just that for me it's been Amsoil.

Your last statement is correct,,, I have seen the same results with The Ultra HP in Chainsaws, stringtrimmers, brushcutters, polesaws cutoff saws, edgers, that have been rented & run for years with the orange bottle dino based mix,,, I small engine tech part time at an OPE dealer's shop who is a personal friend of mine to help when they get behind,,, & cause I like piddling with motors and making them run!!!
they rent (with 1 gallon of mixed Ultra fuel) all of the two stokes I just mentioned and they buy and mix 35 gallons of non ethanol 89 octane fuel at a time,,, when Ultra HP first came out back in 06 or so,, they switched to it from the orange bottle,,, I dont know how many tanks it took,, but the first one I had to tear down after the switch was an older 08S Saw that the bearings seals were pretty well shot or the crankcase was damaged,,, (cant remember it's been a few years OK!!!!!!) :bang: from the years of rental abuse,, anyways, I had to pull the jug ,,, and was use to decarbonizing them in the past before putting them back together,,,, I couldnt believe how clean the top of the piston/Exh port/comb chamber were,,, I am not kidding I barely had to clean those areas at all,,,
that is the same day I switched to Synthetics,,, in my OPE stuff,, its funny I have been running the Klotz Super Techniplate on my 2.5 LITER Merc Hi performance division fishing motor,,, that is no where near stock,,, BTW!!! and my buddies drag boat runs a mix of R-50 and the 80-20 w bean oil,,, he says the bean oil can handle the heat like no esters can,,, FWIW,, he's been racing two smokes sucessfully for a very long time,,, some of his past national record holder RC boats run the bean oil based Klotz on Nitro w/methanol and turn well in excess of 22K rpm over 105 MPH,,,

Dont yall just love oil threads!!!! who started this anyways???

 

[mdavlee]

I don't know what smartass started this thread but it's not been too bad:msp_unsure:

 

[RTK]

We could change that LOL

 

[Mastermind]

We could change that LOL

And Stuff.

 

[HEAVY FUEL]

I know the klotz benol is not recommended for cold weather. I ran the r50 for quite awhile but had build up on top of the piston. Made the switch to blue marble mineral oil. Has been pretty good for the past few years. Never tried the techniplate tho.

 

[Andyshine77]

I know the klotz benol is not recommended for cold weather. I ran the r50 for quite awhile but had build up on top of the piston. Made the switch to blue marble mineral oil. Has been pretty good for the past few years. Never tried the techniplate tho.

R50 has that tendency, but everything else seems to stay extremely clean.

 

[Tzed250]

That was the list I was talking about, and unfortunately the two stroke bikes are getting few and far between. I have seen a few bikes with stuck power valves running caster oil, and I didn't like what I saw with 927 or Klotz super, both run extremely dirty in my experience. There was an old school thread about 927 when big Dave was still porting a lot of saws. 927 and Klotz Super simply do not burn clean in saw, I've seen just too much evidence. Don't get me wrong you're not going to blow up an engine running caster oil, it's just that they're much better options IMHO. And lets not forget castor oil doesn't like cold temps.

And there you have it. My experience runs right the opposite of yours. The TZ250 has guillotine style power valves and after running straight castor premix the YPVS system was well oiled but in no way gummed up. The worst deposits I have ever seen were on the piston of my FS76, after being run on nothing but Stihl orange bottle 50:1 for over 10 years the rings were glued in the grooves. Horrible varnish.


I guess it's time to post this pic again.

This is what I call clean.

MS660 cylinder, 6-7 tanks of Amoco Ultimate premium unleaded(10% ethanol) mixed with Stihl Ultra @ 50:1, with one ounce per gallon Klotz Super Techniplate added.


This photo was taken after the saw was used to buck 40" White Oak, so the top end was under plenty of load. No pic of the piston, but what was on the crown wiped off with a paper towel.

Notice how clean the plug is.


My $.02

...

 

[RiverRat2]

I know the klotz benol is not recommended for cold weather. I ran the r50 for quite awhile but had build up on top of the piston. Made the switch to blue marble mineral oil. Has been pretty good for the past few years. Never tried the techniplate tho.

Funny you say that but my Buddy who races full size and RC boats they had a sponsorhip deal with Blue Marble and he really liked it,, I actually have a few gallons of it left,,

He agrees the R-50 does leave some carbon on the piston top but he's tearing down after every race weekend anyways and I usually an helping and what I see also agrees w/Andyshine's post...
Every thing internal is sparkle clean and well oiled no signs of heating of bluing of rotating assembly brgs, rings, etc

R50 has that tendency, but everything else seems to stay extremely clean.