Is the shop lying to me and next steps?

Rugged made
Wesspur
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SamT1 said:
I guess I’ll be the odd man out and say never run anything but stihl brand engine oil. Why take a chance to save a dollar every 5 cords? I buy the 6 packs that make 1 gallon each. They cost $13. I get near 5 cords on each gallon of fuel. So that’s $13 for enough oil to cut near 30 cords. At least buy the bulk stihl oil and a syringe to measure it. I have retuned as much as they tune all my Poulan leaf blowers and hedge trimmers to run on 50:1. They aren’t running optimum, but have lasted a long time for use around the house and I dont remember them ever running really well (wife can’t crank any of them)
Id rather blow a $100 Poulan than a $1000+ stihl.
I used to think oil is oil until I blew up a Polaris 4 wheeler one day. I had always used Polaris oil, ran out spraying weeds and didn’t have time to go to the city for oil. So grabbed some 2 stroke oil from the farm supply and the thing didn’t run 2 hours of very light duty weed spraying use. May as well have thrown the thing off a cliff after that, Never ran worth a crap again.
Click to expand...

Although I don't agree that you should only run 'Stihl' brand oil ..... I do agree with the point you're trying to make.

The brand name 'chainsaw mix oils' are NOT that expensive. So why even use outboard oil or something else?

A 6 pack of 6.4 oz. bottles of Husqvarna mix oil is 23 bucks on Amazon.

That'll mix 12 gallons of gas @ 40:1 .... or if you like living on the edge, mix it 50:1 for 15 gallons.

For the average user or firewood scrounger, that's a LOT of chainsaw gas.
 
Hi sorry to hear about your saw. Ask the shop for analysis of the oil that proves it caused the failure, they can't. They may be able to prove no oil at all, but that's about it.
Tip: stihl oil is ashless just like TCW-3. The difference is the base oil, same for Red Armor oil.
In the future use TC or JASO rated oil.
 
I'm back! Finally got the time to get on here and give you guys an update. Sorry for the delay. You all will be pleased to know that I was able to take possession of my saw before they started on it.

I didn't want to risk him lying to me about starting the work so when I arrived I simply asked to see it instead of just opening up with I want to cancel and take it home. He was like, "Why do you want to see it?" Uh, because it's mine. Then when I saw he hadn't started I told him I changed my mind and wanted it back. He got damn cross and said he has the parts on order so I'm inconveniencing him because now has to cancel it and because of that he's charging me a full hours labor - $80. I thought, no surprise. Just gimme my stuff. Don't worry. I won't bother you anymore.

Firstly, I don't know why he couldn't just use those parts for another 660. They're pretty common and he's got the busiest shop in town. That way he'd already have 'em on hand to speed up work for the next poor chap. But oh well, whatever, okay. Secondly, I know it took them no more that a half hour to tear that saw down. They told me they never first do a bleed down test; ergo, that reduced the amount of time they spent on diagnosis. They said they just always tear into whatever they suspect is the most likely cause. Not a good practice, right? According to some of you veterans the real cause of the P&C failure could lie with a bigger problem.

Of course I also got back my MS250. As you can see from the invoice they even replaced my starter rope. Can anyone tell me why it might have needed a new rope if it seemed just fine to begin with? Also, the old plug still looks perfectly fine and I'm obviously not that experienced yet but the carb parts they replaced look okay to me. I know the sprocket would have been a super easy fix to do myself and I actually started to but felt overwhelmed when searching online for a replacement to match. Also, at that time I figured why not just have them do it at the same time as fixing my other saw. I didn't know the sprocket would end up costing $142.15 just like I didn't know they would try to charge me over $700 for the 660.

Some have wondered why I didn't grab up my saws at first when I was there the other day. I know I should have. It's complicated. Well, like I said, I was in a real hurry to be to work number one so I wasn't thinking straight. Secondly, I didn't find out they performed the unauthorized work on my 250 until after I agreed to the $500 quote which I did for two reasons. One, I really wanted that saw fixed right away and as I said $500 was much more realistic. I did already want to fix it myself so I could learn and be independent in that regard but I have so much going on right now. Two, that guy is a longtime patron of the business I work at. So, I felt in a tight spot because I had to be careful about how I dealt with him. And just so you know he is an authorized Stihl dealer and the biggest in the area. It's in the capital of Florida. There you go. Hopefully that is all behind me now. I have my saws and I guess I won't be back there. Now, on to the show!

Marshy said:
I really wish you would have taken some pics of the

damaged cylinder and piston. There is a distinct difference between an oil failure and mechanical failure.
Click to expand...

I told y'all I'd snap some photos. Are these pictures telling?

IMG-20181130-0001.jpg






 
Great news!

Pretty much everyone starts out at the same place when it comes to taking care of their own saw, from how to get correct parts to knowledge needed to install them. I'm impressed with the guys on this forum. They will help you find the simplest thing to the most complex without having to rip off your left arm to pay for it. And it's fun! A few tools, a few manuals, and voila, yer mechanicing away. Sorry you had to get here the hard way.

Rick
 
Anyone that works on saws has been burned by the ole', put a new sprocket, plug, check it out, etc.. game.
it usually is put a new rope and plug on it and check it out.......
I always gave them 100 questions as to why, and write down exactly what they want and why.
Cause that ole' ploy is thrown at us all of the time.
I even had a brother-in-law try to burn me with that **** once.
He and his buddy brought me a concrete saw needing a new rope, and "Oh yeah"...... "Put a new plug in it ad check it out".....
I put a new rope in it and pulled it over, and it had no compression, so I put it down.
I handed it back to them with a new rope and said no charge, told them that it wouldn't start, and never will, without a whole lot of money.
My brother-in-law cussing, took it out into the driveway, and pulled on the rope, with starting fluid for 10 minutes, accusing me of trickery, etc....
So I don't step in that pile of poop anymore....
 
Just to keep things in perspective.
These threads pop up, the mob gets worked up, all on the info from the original poster.
Everyone is happy, unless the other party is a member too.

Then the warring camps set up their positions, and a big battle ensues.

usually the first one to make the post has the advantage.

Because the natives are already worked up and looking for blood...
 
WoodLuvr said:
Hi everyone.

I bought a used Stihl MS660 about a year ago from a local repair shop that seemed to have a good reputation. I have only used it about four times overall and was always running it on Stihl brand premix until this last time when I decided to mix my own because every store was out of everything on the shelves because of hurricane Michael and I needed to cut a tree off my house. I had some Mercury outboard 2 cycle oil laying around that I used in the appropriate ratio. I figured 2 stroke is 2 stroke and it wouldn't be a problem. Now this saw was always hard for me to start already but after I mixed the fuel this time I quickly found that the only way I could get it started was with my finger on the throttle and then after it started it wouldn't stay running. I took it in and they are now telling me that it "blew up". They said it needs a new piston and head and that the damage was caused by the oil I used. Said Stihl saws only like Stihl brand oil and I just shoulda known and that different brands of oil are specifically formulated for only that brand of motor. Now this really doesn't make sense to me because they also sell and recommend using "TruFuel" premix as a cheaper alternative to Stihl and I'm pretty sure that it's not made specifically for Stihl chainsaws and will work in pretty much any 2 stroke just fine. They said the cost to repair the saw will be around 750 bucks. I paid $900 for it. Are they deceiving me?

I think it's possible the saw was already on it's last leg and another thing that makes me suspicious is that a couple years prior to this I brought in a vintage all metal Homelite Blue saw to them that I couldn't get to stay running and they told me it needed rebuilt and said parts are near impossible to source so they offered a trade in credit on a new saw. I purchased an MS250 from them at that time. I later bought the used 660 from them after quickly realizing I needed something bigger.

So I need a second opinion. What is the truth? Also, I have decided I am going to make the repairs myself. What do I need to know in order to get this fixed? Where is the cheapest source of OE Stihl parts and how do I get the service manual?

Thank You All!
Click to expand...
 
Like the former members have advised , any 2 stroke oil will suffice mixed at the proper ratio . Back in the 60,s straight Sae. 30 oil was used at 16:1 . Today modern saws run syn oils rather than straight mineral oil @ 50:1 . The problems with the older oil technology was oils broke down causing excessive carbon . Today's 2 stroke oils are primarily ashless therefore carbon issues are significantly reduced . The pictures that you have taken show evidence of very little or no oil . Also the practices of your local dealer if accurate are very irregular .
 
WoodLuvr said:
Hi everyone.

I bought a used Stihl MS660 about a year ago from a local repair shop that seemed to have a good reputation. I have only used it about four times overall and was always running it on Stihl brand premix until this last time when I decided to mix my own because every store was out of everything on the shelves because of hurricane Michael and I needed to cut a tree off my house. I had some Mercury outboard 2 cycle oil laying around that I used in the appropriate ratio. I figured 2 stroke is 2 stroke and it wouldn't be a problem. Now this saw was always hard for me to start already but after I mixed the fuel this time I quickly found that the only way I could get it started was with my finger on the throttle and then after it started it wouldn't stay running. I took it in and they are now telling me that it "blew up". They said it needs a new piston and head and that the damage was caused by the oil I used. Said Stihl saws only like Stihl brand oil and I just shoulda known and that different brands of oil are specifically formulated for only that brand of motor. Now this really doesn't make sense to me because they also sell and recommend using "TruFuel" premix as a cheaper alternative to Stihl and I'm pretty sure that it's not made specifically for Stihl chainsaws and will work in pretty much any 2 stroke just fine. They said the cost to repair the saw will be around 750 bucks. I paid $900 for it. Are they deceiving me?

I think it's possible the saw was already on it's last leg and another thing that makes me suspicious is that a couple years prior to this I brought in a vintage all metal Homelite Blue saw to them that I couldn't get to stay running and they told me it needed rebuilt and said parts are near impossible to source so they offered a trade in credit on a new saw. I purchased an MS250 from them at that time. I later bought the used 660 from them after quickly realizing I needed something bigger.

So I need a second opinion. What is the truth? Also, I have decided I am going to make the repairs myself. What do I need to know in order to get this fixed? Where is the cheapest source of OE Stihl parts and how do I get the service manual?

Thank You All!
Click to expand...
That's bs in my opinion; I use 1 qt. TCW3 to 6 gal gas plus Stabil; I use it on my 6 echo trimmers, 4 Stihls (009,021,032av, and MS460, plus several of my customers stuff for years, never a problem.
 
HarleyT said:
I have a feeling that the shop in question is not all that bad, not all that much a crook.
Click to expand...

Hard to say what a shop guy is thinking unless we were there. A really busy shop, guy will have his standard approach to a saw and add attitude and the reality of the condition of said saw on top. You also mentioned that having a customer say his saw just needs a little thing, like a carb adjust and a spark plug when it really needs a tear down and a jug, happens often enough to color your thinking. What is unfortunate is when the attitude reflects on your honest customers who are just in a hurry. Said customer looks the same as the BS types to a wary mechanic.

I prefer being a one man shop, and doing business with same whenever possible. That guy usually gets over the attitude problem being reflected in how he handles the next customer.

Rick
 
Rick Stephens said:
Hard to say what a shop guy is thinking unless we were there. A really busy shop, guy will have his standard approach to a saw and add attitude and the reality of the condition of said saw on top. You also mentioned that having a customer say his saw just needs a little thing, like a carb adjust and a spark plug when it really needs a tear down and a jug, happens often enough to color your thinking. What is unfortunate is when the attitude reflects on your honest customers who are just in a hurry. Said customer looks the same as the BS types to a wary mechanic.

I prefer being a one man shop, and doing business with same whenever possible. That guy usually gets over the attitude problem being reflected in how he handles the next customer.

Rick
Click to expand...
Yeah,
well human nature is what it is.
And a "wronged" person joins internet forums, and raises hell.
Just as this guy has done here.
BTW, his MS250 had warranty work done back in 2014 on his carb.....
FWIW.....
 

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