661 Oil Test 32:1 vs 40:1 vs 50:1 ?

[scallywag]

 

[bwalker]

yeah well he actually formulates oil for a living. Your just good with your debate skillz and searching google.
the only misinformation is coming from you.
and no I did not.

furthermore what your saying completely contradicts your love for k2 and 2r. It's so false it's absurd. I mean you've really reached an all time low with this one. I dunno maybe the time you told me to run 16:1 (or was it 8:1..and yeah you were dead serious!) in my 660 and expect more power... hmm.

bottom line - I said more additives was a GOOD THING. I'm saying it's GOOD to run more oil for the lube and the additives. k2 and 2r both have a bunch of them...which is GOOD. But as usual you just want to argue with someone and so your contradicting your own views now just for the sake of you gotta be right and argue argue argue. I'm saying it's good and your saying no they don't have additives or only 1 or 2 and and they don't even matter. LOL

Bwalker - king of debate. Be warned!!! You will lose even if your right!

I doubt the guy formulates anything or he wouldn't be corresponding with every cull that called or emailed.
Further I have posted data in this thread that proves Andrew is indeed wrong.
What I am saying is you don't have a clue.. And your mentality where more is better or a certain high temp base oil is better is telling of someone who doesn't understand two cycle lubricants at all.

 

[redbull660]

I doubt the guy formulates anything or he wouldn't be corresponding with every cull that called or emailed.
Further I have posted data in this thread that proves Andrew is indeed wrong.
What I am saying is you don't have a clue.. And your mentality where more is better or a certain high temp base oil is better is telling of someone who doesn't understand two cycle lubricants at all.

cull - is that your favorite word? I see you use it often. So we're all inferior to you huh.

sure sure. So where is it? you always reference this stuff you posted but never link to it.

I like that the chemical engineer/formulator, guy who actually engineers the stuff, says that I had a good points and that you are completely uninformed. LOL



The only thing telling is that you think you are superior to everyone. That is the only thing you've shown or proven in 337 pages.

 

[bwalker]

cull - is that your favorite word? I see you use it often. So we're all inferior to you huh.

sure sure. So where is it? you always reference this stuff you posted but never link to it.

I like that the chemical engineer/formulator, guy who actually engineers the stuff, says that I had a good points and that you are completely uninformed. yet you still with all your pride and superiority will not wavier in your grandiose self reflection.



The only thing telling is that you think you are superior to everyone. That is the only thing you've shown or proven in 337 pages.

Its posted on this thread... and don't lump everyone else in with your OCD madness.
And if I am completely uninformed why doesn't Andrew list what additives that Belray uses? It's not proprietary as anyone with $35 can have a VOA done, which shows most additives.

 

[redbull660]

Its posted on this thread... and don't lump everyone else in with your OCD madness.

no it's not. where is it? Show us! Please!

yeah I've seen your old posts. You treat everyone like dirt unless they worship you or think exactly like you.

 

[bwalker]

no it's not. where is it? Show us! Please!

yeah I've seen your old posts. You treat everyone like dirt unless they worship you or think exactly like you.

Keep looking, I'm not doing the leg work for you...
I treat people how they treat me. You get hostile, so will I. You are the one who got uncivil, like you typically do when someone doesn't go along with the factually incorrect non sense you post.

 

[redbull660]

your "research" it doesn't exist ...you are all about being a keyboard commando and not doing leg work.

I think most people here would disagree with that self assessment of how you treat people.

yeah all these 2t oils they only have a 1-2 additives. your so full of it. Doesn't matter if it says different on the bottle, doesn't matter if the msds says otherwise, doesn't matter if a 2t chemical engineer/oil formulator says different. Doesn't even matter that the oil you like most has 16-20% of the bottle is additives.

Your research which you haven't furnished...says otherwise and you are correct. Whatever pal.

Your so full of yourself it's insane.

 

[bwalker]

The only thing telling is that you think you are superior to everyone. That is the only thing you've shown or proven in 337 pages.

The only thing you have proven is you don't understand the concept of variables and you can't operate a saw consistantly enough to make your tests even sort of valid.

your "research" it doesn't exist ...you are all about being a keyboard commando and not doing leg work.

I think most people here would disagree with that self assessment of how you treat people.

yeah all these 2t oils they only have a 1-2 additives. your so full of it. Doesn't matter if it says different on the bottle, doesn't matter if the msds says otherwise, doesn't matter if a 2t chemical engineer/oil formulator says different. Doesn't even matter that the oil you like most has 16-20% of the bottle is additives.

Your research which you haven't furnished...says otherwise and you are correct. Whatever pal.

Your so full of yourself it's insane.

Your good at google.. do the research yourself. I will not make up for your intellectual laziness.

 

[redbull660]

The only thing you have proven is you don't understand the concept of variables and you can't operate a saw consistantly enough to make your tests even sort of valid.

Your good at google.. do the research yourself. I will not make up for your intellectual laziness.

----- Original Message -----
From: Hodges, Andrew
To: 'RedBull660'
Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2015 9:19 AM
Subject: RE: Form submission from: Contact

I just caught up with the thread and this bwalker guy is comical. He does not understand oils analysis techniques and how to analyze them for one. Secondly, he does not understand how an elemental analysis works or how to interpret the results of one at all. The VOAs that he posted are fairly useless as they only scan for 3 commonly used elements in 2-stroke formulation with 2 others that are very rarely used and another 9 results that are worthless for analyzing fresh oil.

It is absurd that he is saying that he knows the ingredients of two stroke oil better than someone who literally formulates them for a living as you said. If I were you, I would just throw my hands up and turn your back on it. This guy is a troll and wasting the thread participant’s time with his nonsense.

He also has no idea how technical and customer service works for a competent company who cares about their customers. I speak to “every cull that calls and emails” as he puts it, or as I like to refer to them, people with questions, because no one knows product formulas properties and performance better than a formulator and tester. He can disagree about product performance all he wants, but don’t try to tell me what I do every single day and call me a liar.

I am sorry to go on a bit of a tirade about this, but I get the feeling you are probably feeling a bit the same way. This will be the last time I let his nonsense get to me because I won’t respond to any of his comments after this point and I would suggest the members of AS to do the same.

AndrewHodges, OMA I
Product Line Manager, Powersports Division | Bel-Ray Company, LLC

-----------------------------------------------------

I think I am going to follow Andrew's above advice. I'm outta here.

 

[bwalker]

He still hasn't provided you a list, eh?
I most certainly do know how to interpret a VOA and I know which elements point to which additives..

 

[Slackerjpt]

 

[one.man.band]

bwalker.....just so you know, the only reason i mentioned bsfc, was because i thought you were referring to it in your previous post. the bsfc angle to all this, is just how i think about it.
for a few reasons.. first one is that bsfc shows how much fuel (mass) a motor is using at various rpms with increasing load. if you know how much fuel, you can figure approximately how much oil. 2% 3% 4% etc.

the second reason, the bsfc wfo curve, when viewed upside down, shows the shape of the torque curve of the engine. also, more importantly (to me anyway), shows the delivery ratio. since the delivery ratio (fresh fuel air ingested charge).......is what everyone who has held a grinder or rasp is changing. off topic.

guess to sum up, i see it as a volume thing, because its the basis of the thread, caught my eye. at low rpm, the ports are too big, motor gets way over oiled. at very high rpm under load...... under oiled because ports too small. the high rpm under load situation is bad. but luckily, as the saw gets into this situation it cures itself. because it cannot get enough air......rpms slow down, putting it in a better place to get oil. friction goes up with rpm, so that and air are the stumbling blocks, that cause this quick drop off the cliff in torque and hp curves. how quickly the temp comes down after letting off the throttle is pretty cool. easy to see with a temp gun.

wrote too much......probably wrong, but somehow these motors do stay together.

 

[bwalker]

bwalker.....just so you know, the only reason i mentioned bsfc, was because i thought you were referring to it in your previous post. the bsfc angle to all this, is just how i think about it.
for a few reasons.. first one is that bsfc shows how much fuel (mass) a motor is using at various rpms with increasing load. if you know how much fuel, you can figure approximately how much oil. 2% 3% 4% etc.

the second reason, the bsfc wfo curve, when viewed upside down, shows the shape of the torque curve of the engine. also, more importantly (to me anyway), shows the delivery ratio. since the delivery ratio (fresh fuel air ingested charge).......is what everyone who has held a grinder or rasp is changing. off topic.

guess to sum up, i see it as a volume thing, because its the basis of the thread, caught my eye. at low rpm, the ports are too big, motor gets way over oiled. at very high rpm under load...... under oiled because ports too small. the high rpm under load situation is bad. but luckily, as the saw gets into this situation it cures itself. because it cannot get enough air......rpms slow down, putting it in a better place to get oil. friction goes up with rpm, so that and air are the stumbling blocks, that cause this quick drop off the cliff in torque and hp curves. how quickly the temp comes down after letting off the throttle is pretty cool. easy to see with a temp gun.

wrote too much......probably wrong, but somehow these motors do stay together.

I knew were you were coming from and thanks for the injection of sanity to this thread..
If you take the word port out of what you wrote, your basically saying the same thing as the Maxima oil migration study.

 

[bwalker]

bwalker.....just so you know, the only reason i mentioned bsfc, was because i thought you were referring to it in your previous post. the bsfc angle to all this, is just how i think about it.
for a few reasons.. first one is that bsfc shows how much fuel (mass) a motor is using at various rpms with increasing load. if you know how much fuel, you can figure approximately how much oil. 2% 3% 4% etc.

the second reason, the bsfc wfo curve, when viewed upside down, shows the shape of the torque curve of the engine. also, more importantly (to me anyway), shows the delivery ratio. since the delivery ratio (fresh fuel air ingested charge).......is what everyone who has held a grinder or rasp is changing. off topic.

guess to sum up, i see it as a volume thing, because its the basis of the thread, caught my eye. at low rpm, the ports are too big, motor gets way over oiled. at very high rpm under load...... under oiled because ports too small. the high rpm under load situation is bad. but luckily, as the saw gets into this situation it cures itself. because it cannot get enough air......rpms slow down, putting it in a better place to get oil. friction goes up with rpm, so that and air are the stumbling blocks, that cause this quick drop off the cliff in torque and hp curves. how quickly the temp comes down after letting off the throttle is pretty cool. easy to see with a temp gun.

wrote too much......probably wrong, but somehow these motors do stay together.

One other thing. Think of torque as a measure of cylinder filling efficiency. Essentially that's what it is.

 

[KenJax Tree]

Now formulators and scientists from Belray are joining in[emoji1] this is truly the best oil thread AS will ever see.

 

[Andyshine77]

brad if you just want to be a simpleton about it...then just quit wasting your time and leave.

They're far more important things to deal with in life. If you were an adult, you'd already know this.

 

[KenJax Tree]

Pick a good oil mix it 32:1-40:1 and cut wood there really isn't much more to it.

 

[SAWMIKAZE]

Group hug in the shower.

 

[redbull660]

They're far more important things to deal with in life. If you were an adult, you'd already know this.

This thread is an in depth or is supposed to be an in depth discussion on oil. Philosophy and the meaning of life etc etc ...well Im pretty sure that's in another thread...well probably on some other message board.

 

[big t double]

Group hug in the shower.

I'm in. Where do I sign up.